[brackets]

Below is an answer that I got from a non-religionist.
Anyone with any views to it?

-------------------------

We have been admonished not to judge,
But no one (or verrrry few) today has(have)
Seriously considered, let alone practice,
How to "not judge."

All of the negative thoughts, deeds and actions throughout
Our entire lifestream, for which we have not taken the
Responsibility, are still embedded deep
Within our outer consciousness.

How then do we stop judging when the belief system
Provides what goes out and the ego interprets
What is reflected back?

What we see in others is being assessed and evaluated
By that which is in our own belief system.

If it were not in our belief system, we would see a
Different evaluation.

If we had no hate, anger, prejudice, jealousy, etc. in
The blueprints of our own thoughts, there is no physical
Way we could see them in others.

We wouldn't have any standard or base of this nature with
Which to compare or judge.

When we see a negative aspect in another person, we can
Be assured that it is only the reflection of that which
Is in our own consciousness.

If the outer-consciousness has a record of our all past and is
Used in judging, assessing and evaluating what we see in
Others; and is dictating what is happening in our own life,
How do we break this chain that is binding us to our past?
How do we clear our outer-consciousness?

When we see something negative in another person and
Become aware that we are judging the individual instead
Of evaluating the action and understanding the reason for
That action, we should immediately stop whatever we are
Doing, turn around and get that thought pattern
Out of our own consciousness, which is causing the
Reflection that our senses are picking up.

We can do this because the moment of the
Present is our only point of power given unto us.

There are two basic aspects of change in regard to the
Consciousness that need to be dealt with.

-> First, is to correct what we see in others;
-> Second is to eliminate from thought and deed, the
Unwanted things that are happening in our own life.

Unblocking these two basic aspects alones, opens up our
Wisdom 'within' and understanding and thereby making it
Grown even more.
Blocking the two aspects dwarfs up your wisdom and
Understanding and you remain on mercy of someone
Else's wisdom and understanding.

In order to change something for the better, we must
First understand what we want to change.


brackets.

[Jahiem28]

We have no right to Judge anyone. We can give an opinion of what we think. Instead of judging some of us need to try to help with a solution. That my 3 cent worth.

[JimGunther]

People who think it is wrong to "judge" others need to come down to my office, open the file cabinet and look inside some of the case files. You will see police reports in which one person did something horrible to another, lied about it, went to court and told the jury how wrong the other person was to accuse them, and how their rights were violated in the process.

I have been a probation officer for seven years and find it idiotic to think that when one person did something horrible to another, that it is somehow wrong to say, "That person did something horrible!"

Here is a quote you listed:

"If we had no hate, anger, prejudice, jealousy, etc. in
the blueprints of our own thoughts, there is no physical way we could see them in others."

To be blunt about it, this is some of the most mindless crap I have read in a long time. First of all, we don't see wrongdoing in others in a physical way, we make a judgement about their actions in our mind based upon our belief that what they did was wrong. Secondly, as rational adults we have a notion about what is generally right and wrong, we don't have to harbor hate, anger, etc. in ourselves to recognize them in others.

When we judge people, we compare something that they did, or we believe they did, against our own standards of right and wrong, and make a judgement about it on this basis. While this type of activity can certainly be misused in certain circumstances, as a general rule, I see nothing wrong with this practice.

[keenu]

I agree that we should not judge.
We can only judge against our own personal ideal, and judging implies the existence of good and bad. Good and bad are only the two extremes of an event and are based on JUDGEMENT.
Each person's reality is his own and that is it.
It is very difficult not to judge as we have all been brought up to think this way. The current worldview accepts judgement, the belief in good and evil, belief in god and the devil and so forth. Until these beliefs are gone there
Will be judgements.

[JimGunther]

It is obvious to me that the author of the previous post is an idiot. They say, "We can only judge against our own personal ideal, and judging implies the existence of good and bad. Good and bad are only the two extremes of an event and are based on JUDGEMENT.
Each person's reality is his own and that is it."

Obviously this person is not aware that we have a body of laws that we consider to be our collective "right and wrong" as opposed to an some "personal ideal." Let's say that I come into this person's home, rape his wife, and bash his daughter's face in with a hammer. How many people's "personal ideals" will think that this is OK? If my reality says that it is OK to do this, does that excuse my behavior and prevent the victims from seeking a legal remedy for my actions? Obviously any reasonable person will correctly identify my behavior as "wrong" and it is ridiculous to somehow conclude that they are wrong for doing so.

To put it another way, the author of the previous post is saying that it is wrong to judge people, but in doing so, is passing judgement on conduct they consider to be wrong, namely, passing judgement on others!!

A reasonable person will recognize that as a society and a nation, we have adopted in our legal system a collective body of "right and wrong" and impose legal sanctions on people who do "wrong." This legal sanction is imposed not based upon the notion that "each person's reality is their own", but rather that the objective reality of a situation as it occurred is balanced against what is permitted by statute.

Sure, we may not as a society agree that everything prohibited by law is really wrong, but we do have a large body of law that we all agree upon, from everything from theft to murder. We do have a collective notion of right and wrong, good and bad. And you can't say that it is wrong to pass judgement on others because in so doing you are passing judgement on others yourself.

[serialwife]

Perhaps in some ivory tower of academia we've decided not to pass judgement. I tell you to come with me for one day at my job. Walk with me as I talk to child molesters, child pornographers, and other monsters that violate children. Listen to the man who gets on the witness stand and tells you he punched a 2 month old baby in the head because he wouldn't stop crying. So I decided to give him something to cry about. Then look at the child who is now deaf, blind, in helmet, and permanently maimed. And state that we don't have a right to judge a person.

If you violate laws and social norms you open yourself up to judgement. You are not necessarily being judged but your behaviors are. Judging these behaviors allows us to see what treatment is possible for these people. There have been rehabilative statements made.. without an initial judgement there is no counseling. Assessment is a form of judgement.

[mike145k]

To judge or not to judge how can you live with out making a judgement ,and I agree we must change others, to conform to the law,and to break that law will cause punishment severe as it may sound mankind has always understood that the law must be enforced,and the second part will naturealy occur,no thought or deed will no longer need to exsist,in a world dedicated to remove all evil so that no man will fear his fellow man

[Starman]

Judging conduct as either good or evil is not wrong.
Not judging it as good or evil is wrong since it indicates amorality and amorlity
Approves of injustice.

[JimGunther]

As a general statement, it seems to me that if a person has done something wrong, why should it be wrong to say so? We make judgements about people all the time, for example the person who forces you to apply the brakes to keep from hitting them as they force their way into your lane in front of you. Their actions tell you something about the kind of person they are. Why should it be wrong for you to make a judgement about this person and say to the person seated next to you in the car, "That guy is a real jerk!"

[keenu]

As a general statement, it seems to me that if a person has done something wrong, why should it be wrong to say so? We make judgements about people all the time, for example the person who forces you to apply the brakes to keep from hitting them as they force their way into your lane in front of you. Their actions tell you something about the kind of person they are. Why should it be wrong for you to make a judgement about this person and say to the person seated next to you in the car, "That guy is a real jerk!"

Ultimately we should not judge (see my answer above)... but... in reality I believe that we all have the right to express our opinions. It doesn't matter what someone else thinks of those opinions. They are unique to us and our right. If someone is on television and says something that someone else finds offensive I do NOT believe that the person should issue some sort of apology because someone else chose to be offended. As an example, considering what Obama said recently I think that he should stand by what he said and that's that.

[inthebox]

Agree with Jim and Starman.

I don't know how the goal of some peolple is not to judge. I do my thing and you do your thing and let us not judge each other. Well, what if my thing is to have my dog crap on your lawn - to use a very mild example - would you judge me then?

Humans are social. Not to make judgements, besides being impossible, is a formula for chaos and anarchy.






Keenu :

So it is okay for Obama to make those sorts of comments, and to endorse the beliefs of Rev Wright?

So you, in your no judgement scheme of things, Ferraro's comments are okay with you too? How about those of the KKK? Everything is okay right? Just no "judgement" i.e. no thinking.

Now if the opening poster said let us not PRE- judge people then, I can agree with that.

However if I were to say Christian, Muslim, Atheist, liberal, neo-con, Mexican, Black, etc... how many people would already have preconceived notions?

Nothing is good or evil, right or wrong? Open your eyes - Darfur, child rape, homelessness, drug addiction. How can one believe that if only if humans learn not to judge, that these things will somehow cease to exist? It is precisely the idea of knowing right and wrong, recognizing good and evil, that leads to action to try and remedy problems.

[black111madonna]

There is a lot of wrong things happening in the world.. but judging it would not make a difference, the people who are responsible for the mess they cause lack insight, so I feel sorry for them and I forgive them because I can't blame them for not being aware of the consequences by their irresponsible actions.

The only one you can judge is yourself by selfhonesty!

[JimGunther]

Kennu, You're not getting the common sense notion that in saying its wrong to judge, you are making a judgement! This business about prohibiting people from certain speech because it offends people is in direct conflict with the First Amendment rights we have in this country, except in certain circumstances.

[purplewings]

Everyone forms opinions but we need not speak them aloud. Let them set in your head and see what comes about. Usually when I get to know a person, I find a different way to think about them.

Once spoken, the opinion becomes a judgment and we have caused other people to look at it from our view. This can quickly become gossip which is extremely harmful. People have even committed suicide from gossip that forever damages their reputation.

Our task is to look within and find our own shortcomings and correct them. We judge ourselves even harder than we judge others. If we accept ourselves and whatever we may have done in our past, we will also be able to accept those around us - and stop judging altogether.

Every time I see something I dislike in one of my sons, I find myself looking within and there it is - or was at some time. Then I can smile and let them grow at their own pace just as I had to do... but without judgment.

[SkyGem]

Below is an answer that I got from a non-religionist.
Anyone with any views to it?

Jesus Christ has said it the best when He said "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone." That says it all and should end the matter.

[0rphan]

Whether it's right to judge or not we all do it, I believe it's in our makeup, part of are moral code if you like.
Every day we make a judgement over some crisis or another, whether it's sorting out the kids or forming an opinion about the guy next door. What we have to remember is that this is only our opinion and not necessarily shared by another.
I think you only speak out in defence of your opinion if it directly affects you and yours, there fore making some kind of judgment for what ever you consider is wrong.
This I personally think is necessary for day to day living,how you decide whether to discipline your kids for a wrong doing or what ever it may be.
If we did not judge the rights and wrongs of daily life, how could we live by any moral code or raise our kids in the correct manner... to do the right thing.

Sometimes you have to judge a situation, or a person for all kinds of reasons and I think that's how it should be, how could you possibly go through life in a state of constant indecision, how confusing for your children.

WE would all like to say... no who am I to judge... but in reality how many of us have gone down our local for a swift half , or leaned over the garden fence for a good gossip about.. Joe Bloggs... down the street, if you haven't in your ENTIRE LIFE then I fined that extremely hard to believe, everyone at some point or another has judged someone for something no matter how simplistic it might be, were only human it's what we do.

Only my opinion,no offence to anyone.

[N0help4u]

People take the do not judge as a blanket statement as if you have to condone and accept whatever anybody does but the Bible also says to discern so therefore you are to use some sort of judgment in evaluating things. The problem is that people do sum things up in their own limited minds rather than looking outside the box at the big picture.
They limit their viewpoint to not being able to see past their own nose and finding understanding at what makes the person who they are.
With a blanket do not judge statement where do you draw boundries on what is acceptable and what can and can not be tolerated?
If I am honestly not judging (using discernment and wisdom) then I would allow my child to go with a pediphile or I wouldn't think much of jumping in a car of a dope dealer.
So I believe we have to use some judgment but the standard can't be limited to a snobby stuck up self confined limitation where we do not and can not see past our own prejudices.

Personally I believe my poor self is richer than many well off people because I know and accept people from all walks of life for their individuality whereas many people look down their noses on people 'lesser' than their standards. They are the poorer people because they are not rich in the variety life has to offer through those that they THINK are not worthy of the time of day.

[crue_boo]

Okay.. I think you are all unclear about what we should be discussing here. Bringing up the fact that we shouldn't judge is not relevant to what the real statement should be.. [I]We should not pre-judge[I] like inthebox said. There's nothing at all wrong or sinful about judging in general. Some of these problems that comes from what some people think is [I]judging[I], is really more complex than that... without judging, how would our government be (not that its great haha but man it could have been worse), how many crappy bands would there be out there, how would be aware that the tattoo chick doing your tattoo isn't going to screw it up. God judges people strait up to make his decision of who goes to heaven and who doesn't.
I understand what is trying to be said here, but since this is sort of like a statement to change people's lifestyles, you have to remember that you got to make it make sense to everyone. Instead of not judging, how about, we not judge those on things that don't affect what type of person they are inside. Basically saying, don't judge a book by it's cover, simple as that. If you get into the book... and it is horrible, then its horrible. It's a judgment yes, but its also an opinion and most definitely a fact. Now who's to say we can't state [I]facts[I] anymore?! PFFT!
... like JimG was saying... there's a lot of bad, evil and messed up people. That's a fact, that's what they are. It's wrong if we see them with piercings and judge them on that and assume something bad of them! If you molested a child and there's proof... then obviously we can't just let them run around in the streets screwing every little girl they see! I'm 16 and cute lol I don't need that.

Soo ultimately... I think that it is in fact RIGHT to judge people correctly as our world would be a little bit loopy if we didn't. I think it is WRONG to judge people without having the knowledge of that particular person to make judgment of. Does that not make sense? And like... this is coming from a 16 year old hippie who loves everyone and will make friends with EVERYONE unless they are disrespectful, greedy, etc. So since I'm obviously an extreme believer in not making quick judgments... and I'm saying yes it's right to judge in certain circumstances, come on you got to know I must be half right, like I'm totally unbiasd here. And how many times do you meet an average looking girl who is popular without trying that doesn't belong in one of those creepy cliques?! Hell I'm even friends with some of those girls because I didn't make a "quick judment" or "pre judgment" and I found out that this girl was in fact super super self conscious and depressed and spent all her money on brand name clothes just to feel good about herself. She needed a good friend.. me :).. lol... I got sooo off topic but that's my opinion on all this shiznit

Peace&Love,
Randi-Lynne

[crue_boo]

And by the way NOhelp4U, I LOVE your answer. That is what I meant all summed up. I just didn't read that post! Technically I agree with everyone on this because the WRONG side of this situation would be to judge someone if they simply came across as something, which no one has stated to be the "right thing"... so.. Proppps

[JimGunther]

The original question that opened this thread says nothing about "pre-judging." Pre-judging is obviously wrong because it implies by definition that a person is making a judgement based on incomplete information or perhaps nothing more than a first impression.