[galveston]

Does anyone out there know where to find the ancient names of the constellations? I have read that the names were changed at some time within recorded history. Hopefully, the information will be somewhere on the net, but if not, maybe there is a book somewhere.
Thanks!

[Capuchin]

Looks like the main constellations have been changed very little since 1000BC, and certainly not since Greek times.

The names we use now are directly related to the names the Romans used, and have just evolved the way that language does.

See Here for more info.

Of course the egyptians would have had vastly different names and some different groupings - firstly because they can see different stars, and secondly because of a vastly different culture.

The Chinese still today have their own traditional constellations that aren't the same as the widely accepted western ones.

The Greeks and Romans had a vastly overlapping culture and have been widely taken into our language and culture today, hence most Western countries use their constellations.

Hope this was helpful :)

[testingthingsout]

Hello,

I believe that the following article will help you out.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Former_constellations
It offers Ptolemy's (90-168 AD) list of 48 constellations. And this is talking about greek constellations. The following is also a useful Wikipedia article, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_catalog , as well as this one: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constellation#Star_names

Ptolemy's star catalogue seems to be based on Hipparchus' previous list of constellations which had been lost until recently as explained in the following article: http://www.space.com/scienceastronom...ue_050124.html .

Let me know if this helps out.

[galveston]

Thanks to Capuchin and Testingthingsout.
This is turning out to be a pretty complex subject. I didn't see anything attributed to the Hebrews here. My reason for asking is found in the Bible.
Gen 1:14
14 And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:
(KJV)

It would seem plausible that the star names would have some meaning if they were to serve as signs, but that would only apply if we knew what those names were. It may be that there are no records of this kind at this late date. The closest I see here are 2 Assyrian names: Hired Man (Aries) and Swallow (Pisces).

[Starman]

Thanks to Capuchin and Testingthingsout.
This is turning out to be a pretty complex subject. I didn't see anything attributed to the Hebrews here. My reason for asking is found in the Bible.
Gen 1:14
14 And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:
(KJV)

It would seem plausible that the star names would have some meaning if they were to serve as signs, but that would only apply if we knew what those names were. It may be that there are no records of this kind at this late date. The closest I see here are 2 Assyrian names: Hired Man (Aries) and Swallow (Pisces).

The only time during which the Hebrews consulted the constellations instead of God was when they turned apostate and rebellious and sought to imitate the heathen nations around them.

Jeremiah 10:2: "Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them.

You are wearied in the multitude of thy counsels. Let now the astrologers, the stargazers, the monthly prognosticators, stand up and save you from these things that shall come upon you. Behold, they shall be as stubble; the fire shall burn them; they shall not deliver themselves from the power of the flame: (Isaiah 47:13,14).

http://www.bloomington.in.us/~lgthscac/astrology.htm

[Fianchetto]

Does anyone out there know where to find the ancient names of the constellations? I have read that the names were changed at some time within recorded history. Hopefully, the information will be somewhere on the net, but if not, maybe there is a book somewhere.
Thanks!

You might try Peterson's Field Guide to the ?Stars? Constellations?

I believe that you will find that before intercontinental travel became routine, the various cultures had different names and different groupings of stars. Bayer's atlas (I believe) depicted Argo Navis (the ship 'Argo') as one great constellation, whereas now it is divided into it's component parts, the Keel, the Compass etc. (Sorry I can't remember the Latin names for those). I don't remember the Native American names offhand, but believe that a few are mentioned in an early chapter of the book. < Now, where the heck did I put my copy? >

[Fianchetto]

Some nifty stuff I found in this little book of constellations and their associated myths - you may be able to get a copy from amazon.com ISBN 1-56138-247-7

"Orion was typically seen as a male figure, warrior-god or great hunter. In ancient Egypt, Orion oftenwas seen as Osiris, god of lifr, light and the sun. In much of the middle east he was the "Giant" or the "Strong One". The ancient Jews sometimes called these stars Nimrod <Old testament character> bound to the heavens for disobeying God. In India, Orion was a stag shot with an arrow(the three middle stars), while in China these stars were part of a constellation called the White Tiger. Some Brazilian indians picture a cayman (relative of alligators and crocodiles, and the Maoris of New Zealand saw a canoe."

I had understood that classically, Orion fell in love with one (or more) of the Pleides and was bound to the heavens to give eternal chase to the seven sisters, accompanied with his canine companion Sirius, never to catch up from them while eterally pursued by Scorpius. The book tells two slightly disparate tales.

"The Iroquoi Myth:
Long ago there lived a man who had grown to old and feeble to hunt or do chores. He became a bburden to his family and an outcast to others. H knew that his days on earth were numbered, so with great effort, he climbed a high mountain with his bundleon his back and his walking staff in his hand. When he reached the top, the old man began to sing his death chant, singing for a continuation of his spiritual journey - after life on earth.
His voice drifted down to his village below where the people stopped what they were doing and turnedtheir eyews to the lone figure on the mountaintop. As the people watchedthe old man began to rise slowly into the air. As he rose, his voice became fainter and fainter. Soon, the people could not hear him at all. Finally he took his place among the stars, and can be seen today as "Old Man"."
He now carries the sun across the sky, High and warm in summer and low and cold in winter.

Just a sample to whet your appetite. The book is little, ~3 x 3 x .5 inches and cost me five bucss a long time ago. If youcan't get it maybe I'll send you mine. Has a rendition of a sun on the cover, is black and purple, and is full of these beautiful tals woven by different peoples across the globe. Enjoy, and good luck finding a copy! :)

[galveston]

Thanks to you all for your input. It may be that I am looking for something that is not there. It may be that the signs that the Bible speaks of are simply that man looking at the stars should be able to realize that there is a Creator. If there were names assigned to the stars in anicent Biblical times, they would have pointed to that Creator. It was just an interesting thought.

[Starman]

Thanks to you all for your input. It may be that I am looking for something that is not there. It may be that the signs that the Bible speaks of are simply that man looking at the stars should be able to realize that there is a Creator. If there were names assigned to the stars in anicent Biblical times, they would have pointed to that Creator. It was just an interesting thought.

In fact, that's exactly what the Bible tells us:

"The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork. Day unto day uttereth speech, and night unto night sheweth knowledge. There is no speech nor language, where their voice is not heard." -Psalm 19:1-3

[Fianchetto]

In fact, that's exactly what the Bible tells us:

"The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork. Day unto day uttereth speech, and night unto night sheweth knowledge. There is no speech nor language, where their voice is not heard." -Psalm 19:1-3

True, but His Handiwork is all around us - as a master painter uses the same pigments to create his various works, so has the Creator chosen to make all life of the same "stuff" - and to do so much variety with so limited a pallette is what I find so tremendously awesome.

Every living thing has the same form of instruction code, DNA, comprised of only FOUR "colors" -C,A,T,G (cytosine, adenosine, thymine and guanine - the only 4 nucleotides). From viruses to bacteria, broccoli to bull elephants, iguanas to giraffes (constellation Camelopardalis, btw) to manatees to man. All made from only those four colors. The DNA from just one of your cells, stretched out, would be a single filamentous molecule 6 feet long.
Broccoli wouldn't be quite so long, but He stopped when he was finished making it, right?
And with those four colors, not only did He build the different species, but allowed for diversification within those species - the individuality that make you you and me, well FWIW, me. And with just 4 "colors".

My two cents.
Fianchetto:)

[BeverlyVive]

The Holyland Experience in Orlando, Florida had a presentation given by Bill Jones on the "Gospel of the Stars" that is now available from them in DVD. It presents exactly what you're looking for with no preaching - star names, translations, etc. Some internet search sites will bring up interesting information on the Gospel in (or of) the stars; some rail against the very idea. I think the idea is interesting, but not something to get lost in. If kids can learn about the Greek/Roman legends, and the Native American legends, it can't hurt to learn the legend? Truth? About the gospel in the stars. No telescopes required; the constellations are formed from stars visible to the naked eye and are not valid when stars are added via telescope. Hope this helps.

[ebaines]

Like most things having to do with astronomical names, the official names of the constellations are maintained by the International Astronomical Union (IAU). Back in 1930 they divided the sky up into 88 individual constellations, so that every point of the heavenly sphere is included in a constellation. In determining the boundary lines they attempted to stay as close as practical to the "traditional" constellations - e.g, Orion, the 12 constellations of the zodiac, etc. But Ptolemy only listed 48 constellations, and he obviously never travelled to the southern hemisphere, so he didn't cover a good portion of the sky. For the southern hemisphere many of the constellation names have a much shorter tradition, as many were named by European explorers in the just the past 500 years. Hence, while the constellations in the north are typically named for Greek mythological figures (Hercules, Andromeda, etc) or animals (Ursa Major and Minor, Canes Major and Minor, Scorpio, etc), the ones in the south tend to have more modern names (The Telescope, the Sextant, etc). I suppose if someone were to name a new constellation today, it might well be given a name like "The Telephone" or "iPod."

One interesting factoid - while astrologers talk about the 12 signs of the zodiac, the sun actually travels thorugh 13 constellations each year - the sun spends the first two weeks of December in "Ophiochus," between Scorpio and Sagittarius. Obviously the astronomers and the astrologers are not in agreement here!

[karis]

X out a dvd named "Bethlahams star" this man has identified and gained insight... I do believe that the timeing of Gods birth and death etc.. . is woven into all his creation and timming. So to was the naming of the constalations at that perticular time in history he designed and fit this into his plan. Remember who the Great Controler is.

[Stratmando]

Some additional info:
Constellations

[qwertyou123]

Im not an expert but I jnow that I learned a lot of the ancient constellation names by watching some DVDs by a woman named Shauna Manfredine. Just look her up. The series with the information that coud be helpful is called Mazzoroth Messages. It's a good series and Shauna gives some good insite. I hope this is helpful!
God Bless!

[lilybeth1234]

How did people from the past name the constellations

[ebaines]

how did poeple from the past name the constellations

Depends on which people you are referring to. As Capuchin pointed out much earlier in this thread (back on post #2) many of the constellations that we in the west are familiar with were first catalogued by Ptolemy, and hence their tie-ins to Greek mythology. Other culture and their own names for patterns they saw in the skies. You can get an overview here: Constellation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia