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dittttka · Dec 21, 2006, 12:21 PM

In Indiana, one of the head managers of a nursing home(#1) is married to a gentlemen working in another nursing home(#2).

Now, Indiana is a "right to work" State; meaning she can fire you if you where the wrong colored socks to work, and you can quit at any time without having to give any notice. Employers are also limited in what they can say when confirming employment for future jobs.

Two of the nursing assistants at this nursing home(#1) were applying for positions at the nursing home(#2) where the husband worked. The two ladies hadn't received a position at #2, nor had they forfeited their employment with #1. The manager, having spoken with her husband, talked to the hiring manager at #2. She told her not to hire the girls, that they hadn't served her any 2-week notice and "would you want someone like that working for you?". Naturally the assistants now work at neither home.

Can she legally do this? Doesn't that leave her and the corp. itself, in an actionable position?

ScottGem · Dec 21, 2006, 12:45 PM

I'm not sure if this is illegal, but, based on the facts you provide it should be actionable. If the employees had not been offered a position yet by nursing home #2 then they were under no obligation to give notice at #1. The mgr at #1 had no business bad mouthing them at that point. The mgr at #2 should have realized this and told her well they haven't been offered a position so no notice is required yet.

There may also be an issue of a violation of confidential info between the husband and wife. I would consult with a human resources atty in Ind on that issue.

What the employees would have to do is sue the mgr at #1 for libel assuming they can prove what she said.

Fr_Chuck · Dec 21, 2006, 03:58 PM

I am not sure unless Indiana has some special laws limiting what an employor can say about an employee, but the "right to work" has nothing to do with that.

Most companies will require a written notice that the employee has allowed any records to be given out, but they can give number of days late, they can give information on any warnings given and any problems at all at the old employment. They can also say and are often asked if they would re-hire or not.

I see nothing illegal in this at all, and HR people often get into a lot of detail about people they are hiring or not hiring.

LUNAGODDESS · Dec 21, 2006, 05:52 PM

First, Indiana is a heavy union state... go to this website to find more information about right to work.
http://www.nrtw.org/rtws.htm

So, the right to work law will cause serious problems with unions and the voters in Indiana.

Second, the advice of wife is considered in certain situation. My suggestion to the other women go and get another job. Many states are suffering from a shortage of nurses and nurses aides. One of those states is Texas.

excon · Dec 22, 2006, 05:46 AM

Hello dit:

I don't think there is any violation of law. Nobody lied, and nobody was fired for something they didn't do. Nobody badmouthed anybody. Only a reasonable question was asked, that the girls could have prevented from being asked - "would you want someone like that working for you?".

If you were interviewing, and hadn't given notice yet, wouldn't you make sure your new prospective boss doesn't call your old boss until you've given notice?? I would. These girls didn't - their bad.

excon

ScottGem · Dec 22, 2006, 06:40 AM

I think you may need to reread the OP, excon. On what was told us, the current boss contacted the prospective boss, not the other way around. Plus she contacted them because of talk with her husband. Second, the employees had not been offered a position yet, so there was no reason to give notice. The current boss was criticizing them for doing something they hadn't done yet.

talaniman · Dec 22, 2006, 06:54 AM

I think there is a strong case for unlawful termination. Also there are unemployment benefits to get also. Contact your local Equal Employment Opportunity Commission and file a formal complaint. In the meantime sign nothing that releases them from any responsibility. Especially your right to sue for missed wages.

dittttka · Dec 23, 2006, 12:27 AM

Still awaiting official word about what ended up happening in this situation... The two girls were asked to come back to job #1 and did so. (this in itself sounds fishy to me... why give them the jobs back now?)

I'm new to this website and am trying to figure out if I'm putting this update in the right place so if I'm messing up here, please let me know. The website provided by Lunagoddess is innacurate... Indiana is a "right to work" state and has been for some time. And yes that has led to problems everywhere union-wise. Massive unemployment and heavy turnover in skill positions... anyhooo.

As far as I am to understand, the only information an employer can legally discuss if called, is start date and end date and if the employee would be considered for rehire. I'm almost positive that they can not even say if the former employee was fired or quit on their own. I'm almost positive that the girls wouldn't have been asked back if there weren't legal issues behind this decision. But I do not know for sure, so I won't say that is a fact.

talaniman · Dec 23, 2006, 04:58 AM

Indiana is a "right to work" state and has been for some time. And yes that has led to problems everywhere union-wise. Massive unemployment and heavy turnover in skill positions... anyhooo.

This is very inaccurate and the opposite is true.
I worked in Indiana all my life and was a union worker all that time and your employer can only verify your employment, you need to check with your EEOC to verify that. And Indiana is not a right to work state and really not sure where your info comes from, but that probably why your having a problem, as you are not represented by a union.

mjinms · Dec 24, 2006, 12:15 AM

Originally Posted by dittttka

In Indiana, one of the head managers of a nursing home(#1) is married to a gentlemen working in another nursing home(#2).

Now, Indiana is a "right to work" State; meaning she can fire you if you where the wrong colored socks to work, and you can quit at any time without having to give any notice. Employers are also limited in what they can say when confirming employment for future jobs.

Two of the nursing assistants at this nursing home(#1) were applying for positions at the nursing home(#2) where the husband worked. The two ladies hadn't received a position at #2, nor had they forfeited their employment with #1. The manager, having spoken with her husband, talked to the hiring manager at #2. She told her not to hire the girls, that they hadn't served her any 2-week notice and "would you want someone like that working for you?". Naturally the assistants now work at neither home.

Can she legally do this? Doesn't that leave her and the corp., itself, in an actionable position?

That is a form of slander. To talk about someone and preventing the person from achieving financial reward is slander. If someone started a rumor about me and I work as a real estate agent, no one wanted to use me as aa real estate agent would hurt my future in making money , that is grounds of slander. The law works for one and should work for the other. If you can quite without giving notice then they did what was according to the law. Why they left depends on a lot. Was the pay better if they left and went to a different place, benefits may be better, and they may have felt that confrontation would be useless and chose to seek employment somewhere else. They should have a right to defend themselvves as why they didn't give a notice. If they went to management and told them they wanted better benefits and better pay they could be fired and if they stood up for themselves and said there are other places with better pay, they could be fired and that wouldn't look good when it came to another job.

s_cianci · Dec 24, 2006, 09:44 PM

I'm not at all sure. If what she said was truthful (about them not giving the two-week notice) then I don't think, when push comes to shove, that there's much of a case here. Ultimately the other employer (presumably) chose to act on her advice and opinion and use that as a basis for not hiring them. But there's too many variables involved to make a really solid case that would stick.

ScottGem · Dec 25, 2006, 05:40 AM

Originally Posted by s_cianci

I'm not at all sure. If what she said was truthful (about them not giving the two-week notice) then I don't think, when push comes to shove, that there's much of a case here. Ultimately the other employer (presumably) chose to act on her advice and opinion and use that as a basis for not hiring them. But there's too many variables involved to make a really solid case that would stick.

I think you also need to reread the OP:

Originally Posted by dittttka

Two of the nursing assistants at this nursing home(#1) were applying for positions at the nursing home(#2) where the husband worked. The two ladies hadn't received a position at #2, nor had they forfeited their employment with #1. The manager, having spoken with her husband, talked to the hiring manager at #2.

The assistants had simply applied for a position. They had not received an offer of a job yet. So there was no reason to give notice. In addition, the manager at #1 took it upon herself to contact the manager at #2. She was not responding to an inquiry.

Given those circumstances I believe there is an actionable offense here. The assitants were being punished for looking for another job, which they had every right to do.