[Fr_Chuck]

The son has to take his responsibility and duties. When her son has the child during his visits he can allow his mother to see the child.

The grandmother needs to be talking to her son to make things happen.

[JudyKayTee]

As far as Grandma getting too involved and seeing the situation from only one point of view, yes, well, that is what usually occurs when something like this happens. We see it all the time here and in other areas of our lives. People get frustrated and look for advice. Virago started out her OP by saying she "just needed to vent". She was also asking if anyone had been through this too and/or had some non-violent advice to offer. I think you guys are being a tad tough on the lady. Maybe I am tired or off my game today but I don't care if there is more to the story or if she is sticking her nose where it doesn't belong. I would like to see her come back & use this site. It won't happen if we whip her with a wet noodle. (Where the heck did that expression come from anyway?).

Virago, I hope your son gets things resolved by legal means and you all get to enjoy his daughter again. Good luck!

Maybe your viewpoint after 120 posts and mine (and others) after a combined total of 50,000 posts is different.

I think sugar coating this situation in which a CHILD is a pawn in a adults' war has to be addressed for just what it is.

Whip with a wet noodle? Hardly. Tell it like I (speaking only for myself) see it is something else.

Did you read the post? The Police had to be called. The OP has no standing in this fight. This is her son's battle, not hers, and maybe if it were handed back to him he would handle it.

There is a child being played as a pawn here.

I also note no legal advice was asked for. That's why this is in the other family and people (relationship) category. On the legal boards the strict advice would be (and nothing else) - the son has to get a Court Order concerning any/all of these issues. No personal advice, nothing else.

[Just_Another_Lemming]

I think sugar coating this situation in which a CHILD is a pawn in a adults' war has to be addressed for just what it is.

Whip with a wet noodle? Hardly. Tell it like I (speaking only for myself) see it is something else.

Did you read the post? The Police had to be called. The OP has no standing in this fight. This is her son's battle, not hers, and maybe if it were handed back to him he would handle it.

There is a child being played as a pawn here.

I also note no legal advice was asked for. That's why this is in the other family and people (relationship) category. On the legal boards the strict advice would be (and nothing else) - the son has to get a Court Order concerning any/all of these issues. No personal advice, nothing else.

Of course the child is being used as a pawn. Do I think you and Asking are right in your evaluation of the situation? Yes. Do I think the OP is wearing blinders and won't listen to a word either of you say? Yes. You are a very smart woman. I know you can differentiate between someone you can really get through to and someone you can't. As soon as I saw the wording the neighbor girl "fell pregnant" I knew this was going to be a one sided affair. You can ask questions and try to use reason with this OP, but she isn't going to budge because she believes she is in the right and nothing anyone says here is going to change that. THAT was my point in posting what I did. I felt directing her to find a good barrister will only help the situation. He/she will be in a face to face situation and will deal with the entire family directly and will be able to verbally delineate what each player's role is. ;)
You and I both know that simply because this wasn't posted under the "legal" forum it doesn't negate a response advising someone to go get legal help.

Maybe your viewpoint after 120 posts and mine (and others) after a combined total of 50,000 posts is different.

I have noticed over the past couple of years the "experts" have used this line quite often. Judy, I remember when you were a newbie. How else did I know to say "MT" to you on another thread? Please don't assume that the person you are speaking with knows less than you do simply because they have a smaller number of posts and they don't have the title of "Expert".

[JudyKayTee]

You and I both know that simply because this wasn't posted under the "legal" forum it doesn't negate a response advising someone to go get legal help.

I have noticed over the past couple of years the "experts" have used this line quite often. Judy, I remember when you were a newbie. How else did I know to say "MT" to you on another thread? Please don't assume that the person you are speaking with knows less than you do simply because they have a smaller number of posts and they don't have the title of "Expert".

You missed my first point entirely - I was addressing why personal advice was posted here instead of strictly legal advice. On the legal board it would have been strictly legal. Posting on the legal board pretty much precludes the personal advice. It doesn't work the other way around.

I am not assuming anyone knows more or less than I do, has more or less education or experience, nor have I ever said that. What I do know is that those of us who have posted many, many times have a better sense of where a thread is going - answer the same or similar question about five hundred times and you have a completely different viewpoint. The ex-female partner is always hysterical, vindictive, irresponsible; the ex-male partner is always violent and has a drinking problem. That's just how the situation is presented.

I am well aware that the majority of the people who post legal questions only want their actions or thinking to be ratified - they don't want to know the legal answer. They want to hear that they are right.

And some legal advice surprises me but this isn't a legal thread and so I didn't comment. You said: "He won't be responsible for paying her A FREAKING DIME if he can get Joint Custody order from the courts." From my reading of UK law the non-custodial parent still pays child support to the custodial parent when there is a joint custody order. The money doesn't go to "her" (the ex). It is for the support of the child.

I am also somewhat surprised by your public scolding of people (experts or not) who give answers which don't agree with yours. I would never deny you the right to express your opinion, whether I agreed with it.

I'm amazed that you remember when I was a "newbie." I joined in 2007; you joined in 2010. Did you post under another name in the past?

[Just_Another_Lemming]

Virago, I hope you haven't left this web site permanently. If you are reading these posts, this link might help your family:

UK Divorce : Child Custody Law : Joint Custody

[QLP]

Virago, I am in England and my understanding is that grandparents have little recourse in law at the moment.

There is some information here:

Paternal Grandparent's Rights - Separated Dads (UK)

The present coalition government has promised a review on this to strengthen grandparents rights but time will tell what and when will change.

For now I think the best thing you can do is encourage your son to get his own arrangements legally formalised so that you can see your grandchild when the father has her.

[JudyKayTee]

Virago, I am in England and my understanding is that grandparents have little recourse in law at the moment.

There is some information here:

Paternal Grandparent's Rights - Separated Dads (UK)

The present coalition government has promised a review on this to strengthen grandparents rights but time will tell what and when will change.

For now I think the best thing you can do is encourage your son to get his own arrangements legally formalised so that you can see your grandchild when the father has her.

Seeing the grandchild when the father "has her" is not a given - the mother may very well NOT want the grandmother to visit and may raise issues (as previously discussed) in Court. If the Court agrees that the grandparent is problematical I see supervised visitation so that the grandmother CAN'T see the child.

I'm not saying it's fair or right; I'm saying I've seen it.

[nellre]

I don't have an answer.
I'm in the same spot, but it's my daughter, who has just had what I can only call a mental break... has cut me off from them. My grandkids are 10 and 12. They have a good father, I think the kids are safe, but nobody in her milieu seems to have noticed that these kids have been deprived of a loving grandmother for no apparent reason.
I'm trying to write something in a birthday card... and I am at a loss what to say. Needless to say I cry over this several times a day.

[martinizing2]

I don't have an answer.
I'm in the same spot, but it's my daughter, who has just had what I can only call a mental break... has cut me off from them. My grandkids are 10 and 12. They have a good father, I think the kids are safe, but nobody in her milieu seems to have noticed that these kids have been deprived of a loving grandmother for no apparent reason.
I'm trying to write something in a birthday card... and I am at a loss what to say. Needless to say I cry over this several times a day.

You should type this into the box at the top of the page and that will start a new thread just for you and your problem.

This thread has not been posted to (until now) for a week or two.
You will get a better response by reposting in the box that says "Ask your question or search"