[mathwiz3502]

:(:(the u.s. Debt just spiked 12 trillion dollars:(:(

[paraclete]

Perhaps that is why they called the last ten years the noughties.

So when you get that many noughts you can't grasp the number there is only one way out from here and it might start with cutting back on adventurist military campaigns

[earl237]

Maclean's magazine said they should consider a national sales tax similar to Canada's HST but will any politician be brave enough to do the right thing?

[excon]

Hello wiz:

Buy gold.

excon

[tomder55]

Our GDP was around $14.4 so the Obots conceivably have another $1.6 trillion to squander. Maybe that will provide the necessary funding for all those cash for caulker jobs the President wants to create.

There are many economists who agree that raising taxes in the middle of a recession is the wrong perscription. I have no inherent objection to a sales tax as long as there is a concurrent reduction in income taxes.

[earl237]

Just heard that Greece's debt rating was downgraded to BBB+ which is negative and sent markets and Euro lower. Even Canada's debt is worse than expected.

[paraclete]

Why should I be concerned about the credit rating of a second string country, bad credit ratings are not catching

[excon]

bad credit ratings are not catching

Hello clete:

They aren't?

excon

[tomder55]

Turns out that the phrase "cash for caulkers " wasn't polling very well. So the President did a rewording of his plan in his recent address to the Brookings Institution . It is now being called "home retrofits" .
RealClearPolitics - Obama's Speech at the Brookings Institute
The NY Slimes describes it as "offering rebates to people who make their homes more energy efficient."
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/09/us...s.html?_r=2&hp

Mixed into his address is a combination of taking credit for stopping a runaway train("We avoided the depression many feared" ),and a healthy dose of his argument of last resort... it's Republicans and Bush's fault.

He claimed that Larry Summers warned him a year ago that joblessness would grow at a rate not seen since the 1930s. But as I recall ;he also claimed when the bucket list stimulus was passed that unemployment would cap at around 8%.
Also ;if it was true that Summers told him that unemployment would be worse then he had been saying ;then why did he waste a year with nonsense like healthcare reform ;cap and trade ,and an inadequate stimulus package that only filled some pot holes and diverted tax money to fill the state's coffers ? Clearly there was not enough attention being paid to the employment picture . One could say he was asleep at the wheel ? Or dropped the ball because his attention was diverted ? A year and $787 billion was wasted.

Cap and trade will never pass because the public will never support higher taxes based on faulty and fraudulent science when so many people are suffering and struggling without jobs. That is why POTUS went unilateral with the EPA directive . If that isn't all show for Copenhagen then you will see a public revolt that will make the TEA Parties look like tea parties. The public is in no mood for extra taxes for pet liberal/socialist policies.

He also knows that a new porkulus will not float . So he is proposing a new way to pay for all that window shrink.
There is a pot of unspent TARP monopoly money still floating around (somewhere around $75 Billion). Some of it will be distrubuted through Treasury for small business loans (will the government own these businesses like they "own" the zombie banks being kept alive with TARP ? );tax credits that rewards companies for hiring workers;and a useless temporary 1 year elimination of capital gains taxes on small business investments .

The bulk of it however will be used to make the same mistakes that was made with the 1st stimulus plan($50 billion toward infrastructure... more road paving with those fancy Obama billboard signs on the road) .

Using fuzzy math;he said that returning TARP money would also be used to pay down the debt. TARP really is that magic bullet that keeps on giving . It prevented us from going over a financial cliff. It will fund further job stimulus ;reduce the unemployment rate ;and at the same time reduce the deficit ? Truly magic !

[paraclete]

Turns out that the phrase "cash for caulkers " wasn't polling very well. So the President did a rewording of his plan in his recent address to the Brookings Institution . It is now being called "home retrofits" .

Better get in on your retrofit quickly, I heard that the US is about to default on its international obligations. There goes the game

[excon]

Hello:

It IS interesting that righty's only complain about spending when it's for domestic use. You don't hear any of 'em questioning the cost of going to war, do you? They're MORE than willing to borrow and spend for THAT. In fact, that's exactly what George W. Bush did, and you never heard a peep from the righty's.

excon

[paraclete]

Hello:

It IS interesting that righty's only complain about spending when it's for domestic use. You don't hear any of 'em questioning the cost of going to war, do ya? They're MORE than willing to borrow and spend for THAT. In fact, that's exactly what George W. Bush did, and you never heard a peep from the righty's.

excon

Hey EX I complain about government spending anytime. I don't like the way welfare is handed out, I don't like the waste on boondoggling, and I especially don't like them spending money in so called developing countries when there are people here just as badly off.

What I see is this government have the responsibility to maintain public inferstructure and look after the population, they don't have the right to wage war in someoneelse's territory and to interfere in someonelse's development

So less do goodin' and more do rightin'

[tomder55]

The NY Slimes is reporting on the lack of progress of the bucket list stimulus bill "cash for caulkers " weatherization program.

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2010...tion.html?_r=1

After a year of crippling delays,
After a year, the $5 billion program has retrofitted a fraction of the homes expected and created far fewer construction jobs than anticipated...

A little more than 30,000 homes have been weatherized, which is about 5 percent of the program's goal, and job creation has fallen well short of the 87,000 officials anticipated...

An Associated Press review found the program has been slowed by government rules and bureaucratic delays, as well as such questions as how much to pay contractors and how to protect historic homes during renovations...

In Alaska, Wyoming and the District of Columbia, the program has yet to produce a single job or retrofit one home...

In California, it has created 84 jobs in a state with nearly 37 million residents...

[speechlesstx]

It IS interesting that righty's only complain about spending when it's for domestic use.

Haven't been paying attention again I see, lots of righty's complain about all those billions gone to countries that hate us anyway. Or how about all those billions wasted on the U.N.

[speechlesstx]

I'm sure we can count on similar success with Obamacare. I'm just saying...

[excon]

Haven't been paying attention again I see, lots of righty's complain about all those billions gone to countries that hate us anyway. Or how about all those billions wasted on the U.N.?

Hello again, Steve:

I'm willing to rephrase it. Righty's complain about ANY spending that's not related to national security.

excon

[speechlesstx]

Hello again, Steve:

I'm willing to rephrase it. Righty's complain about ANY spending that's not related to national security.

Well it is hard to accomplish much when you're dead.

[excon]

Hello again, Steve:

Actually, this thread should be about WHAT you're willing to go deeply into debt FOR - not about the debt. Clearly, you didn't mind going deeply into debt during the last presidency.

So, talking about how bad the Dems are because of the debt, isn't really true, is it?

excon

[speechlesstx]

Actually, this thread should be about WHAT you're willing to go deeply into debt FOR - not about the debt.

I don't want to go deeply in debt for anything.

Clearly, you didn't mind going deeply into debt during the last presidency.

Clearly you're repeating a talking point with no merit.

So, talking about how bad the Dems are because of the debt, isn't really true, is it?

At this point does it really matter how we got there? Why are we going to make it worse?

[excon]

I don't want to go deeply in debt for anything. Clearly you're repeating a talking point with no merit... Why are we going to make it worse?

Hello again, Steve:

Did you support Bush's two wars? Did you support his two tax cuts? I rest my case.

I don't want to go further into debt either. I believe in PAYING your way. That's why we should re-institute a tax on the richest 2% amongst us. But, most importantly, we should reclaim what the bankers ripped us off for. That's a couple $$ trillion right there.

But, being a dedicated right winger, you may very well think we WE'RENT ripped off.

excon