[KISS]

Subject : HR 615 -


On Tuesday, the Senate health committee voted 12-11 in favor of a two-page amendment, courtesy of Republican Tom Coburn which would require all Members of Congress and their staff members to enroll in any new government-run health plan.

Congressman John Fleming has proposed an amendment that would require Congressmen and Senators to take the same health care plan that they would force on us. (Under proposed legislation they are exempt.)

Congressman Fleming is encouraging people to go to his Website and sign his petition. The process is very simple. I have done just that at: Congressman John Fleming : Home



Senator Coburn and Congressman Fleming are both physicians. Regardless of your political beliefs, it sure seems reasonable that Congress should have exactly the same medical coverage that they impose on the rest of us.



Please urge as many people as you can to do the same!

[Catsmine]

Left, right or sideways, this seems like the most rational thing proposed in congress in about 50 years. I'm in, but it'll never pass.

[tomder55]

I am shocked this made it out of committee . My best guess is that it will be cynically voted into the health care bill and secretly removed from the final bill in the Conference Committee. Then the whole group of hypocrites can do a John Kerry. "I voted for it before I voted against it" .

They will also have a back up cover that goes something like this..... since they claim the bill will allow you can keep your current coverage ;they can support the amendment because their gold plated tax payer funded plan would remain in tact. A better amendment would be that they must sign onto any "public option "plan passed .

[ETWolverine]

Go Coburn and Fleming. I agree with Tom, I'm shocked thast this got out of committee in the Senate.

As far as I'm concerned, if the government's plan for health care reform isn't good enough for members of Congress to join, then it isn't good enough for me to join either.

I hope that Coburn's and Fleming's efforts get the attention they deserve.

Elliot

[excon]

Congressman John Fleming has proposed an amendment that would require Congressmen and Senators to take the same health care plan that they would force on us.

I am shocked this made it out of committee . A better amendment would be that they must sign onto any "public option "plan passed .

Hello righty's:

I don't know how you missed the word "option". You write it, and then ignore that you even wrote it. Or, maybe you don't quite understand what OPTION means. If a plan is OPTIONAL, you can't be FORCED into it, otherwise it's not OPTIONAL.

Actually, the public "OPTION" means exactly what it says. People will have CHOICE... Nobody is going to be FORCED into anything. That's kind of the opposite of how you guys phrase it. How come you do that? I mean, we're talking about simple English here...

Or, is it just possible, that you, like the Wolverine, don't believe what the words say anyway, because they Dems are LYING, and this is just a commie plot to take over a BIG chuck of the rotten capitalist society?

excon

[tomder55]

I don't know . I read the mandatory coverage part of the Baccus bill as just that... mandatory... not optional .

[speechlesstx]

Actually, the public "OPTION" means exactly what it says. People will have CHOICE... Nobody is going to be FORCED into anything. That's kinda the opposite of how you guys phrase it. How come you do that? I mean, we're talking about simple English here...

Clinton had his own version of what "is" means. Obama thinks volunteer work can be "mandatory," and you think "option" means "option."

[inthebox]

Hello righty's:

I dunno how you missed the word "option". You write it, and then ignore that you even wrote it. Or, maybe you don't quite understand what OPTION means. If a plan is OPTIONAL, you can't be FORCED into it, otherwise it's not OPTIONAL.

Actually, the public "OPTION" means exactly what it says. People will have CHOICE... Nobody is going to be FORCED into anything.

excon

I guess employers and individuals are not FORCED to pay medicare, and social security TAXES either? Who do you think is going to pay for any government expansion? TAXPAYORS WILL BE FORCED TO PAY HIGHER TAXES for any further government expansion into healthcare, regardless of whatever words they choose to use.


G&P

[excon]

Who do you think is going to pay for any government expansion?

Hello in:

Let's review. If we're NOW treating EVERYBODY, as the right wing insists we do, then we're not going to "expand" anything. We're just going to move it around a little... That shouldn't cost anything.

Or, are you wingers ready to admit that we DON'T treat everybody now?? You can't have it both ways.

excon

[ETWolverine]

Hello righty's:

I dunno how you missed the word "option". You write it, and then ignore that you even wrote it. Or, maybe you don't quite understand what OPTION means. If a plan is OPTIONAL, you can't be FORCED into it, otherwise it's not OPTIONAL.

Actually, the public "OPTION" means exactly what it says. People will have CHOICE... Nobody is going to be FORCED into anything. That's kinda the opposite of how you guys phrase it. How come you do that? I mean, we're talking about simple English here...

Or, is it just possible, that you, like the Wolverine, don't believe what the words say anyway, because they Dems are LYING, and this is just a commie plot to take over a BIG chuck of the rotten capitalist society?

excon

I mean, I’m all for a single-payer system, uh … eventually. I think what we have to do, though, is work with what we’ve got in order to close the gap.

---Kathleen Sebelius, 2007


I think if we get a good public option it could lead to single payer, and that’s the best way to reach single payer. Saying you’ll do nothing until you get single payer is a sure way never to get it.

---Barney Frank, 7/27/2009


I happen to be a proponent of single-payer universal health care coverage. But as all of you know, we may not get there immediately because first we have to take back the White House, we have to take back the Senate and we have to take back the House.

--- Barack Obama, 2003


And next to me was a guy from the insurance company who argued against the public health insurance option, saying it wouldn’t let private insurance compete. That a public option will put the private insurance industry out of business and lead to single-payer. My single-payer friends, he was right. The man was right.

---Jan Schakowsky


[T]he only reason not to do [single-payer] is that politically it’s hard to do in one step…You’d have to convince people to completely give up the insurance they have, whereas something that lets people keep the insurance they have but then offers the option of a public plan, that may evolve into single-payer, but you can do it politically…

--- Paul Krugman, Economist


They have a sneaky strategy, the point of which is to put in place something that over time the natural incentives within its own market will move it to single-payer.

--- Washington Post Reporter Ezra Klein


And of course, here is Jacob Hacker, one of the architects of nationalized health care, telling us straight out that the "public option" isn't a "trojan horse"... there's nothing hidden about it.

YouTube - Hacker admits Public Option is Trojan Horse for Single Payer


They have made it very clear that there is not going to be anything "optional" about the public option.

And you, excon, have fallen for it. You really think that we're going to be able to keep our current health care if we want to.

Or perhaps you haven't been fooled... you actually favor a single-payer system.

Which means that there are two choices: You are either a sucker or a liar. Either you've been fooled by the "choice and competition" rhetoric, or you HAVEN'T been fooled and are just spouting the party line to perpetuate their lie.

Elliot

[excon]

Hello again, Elliot:

So, NO bill should be passed because of what the Democrats WANT to do - even though what they WANT to do, ISN'T in the bill.

Using that logic, the Dems should block ALL attempts to cut taxes even a little bit, because everybody knows the wingers WANT MORE taxes cut than that.

DUDE! Our legislators need to pass a law because of what the law IS, and NOT because of what they think the other guys WANT.

excon

[inthebox]

Hello in:

Let's review. If we're NOW treating EVERYBODY, as the right wing insists we do, then we're not going to "expand" anything. We're just going to move it around a little... That shouldn't cost anything.

Or, are you wingers ready to admit that we DON'T treat everybody now???? You can't have it both ways.

excon

This is under the ASSUMPTION that government is more efficient than the private sector.

Lets learn from the recent past:

Prescription price control:

Updated Estimates of Spending for the Medicare Prescription Drug Program

Medicare part D is costing TAXPAYORS $593 BILLION.
$4 per month per generic prescription at Wally world or any number of private pharmacies cost only the individual consumer of the medication, not the taxpayor.



G&P

[ETWolverine]

Hello again, Elliot:

So, NO bill should be passed because of what the Democrats WANT to do - even though what they WANT to do, ISN'T in the bill.

Actually, no bill should be passed because the bills that they are proposing don't solve any of the problems that they claim they are trying to solve, and they are also growing government for no reason.

Using that logic, the Dems should block ALL attempts to cut taxes even a little bit, because everybody knows the wingers WANT MORE taxes cut than that.

And they do. What's your point.

DUDE! Our legislators need to pass a law because of what the law IS, and NOT because of what they think the other guys WANT.

Excon

Actually they need to KILL the bill because of what it is... growth of government with no solution to ANY of the problems that it claims to solve.

I guess legislators have no responsibility to make sure that slippery slopes aren't created and doors to misuse aren't opened. Is that your logic? We should pass ANY law, regardless of what other problems that law creates, and regardless of how those who are passing the law are TELLING US BEFOREHAND that they plan to abuse that law.

Your blind trust for government is shocking for one who calls himself a libertarian. But then again we know you aren't a libertarian at all.

Elliot

[twinkiedooter]

If those folks in Congress have to live like the rest of us I've got news for you.

It's Not Going to Happen. Now or Ever. Get over it. Signing petitions is meaningless to them. It makes you feel good having the delusion that maybe something is going to change (or maybe the sky is going to rain money down to you).

Can you imagine Queen Pelosi actually having to go to a health clinic? Oh no. She demands the best doctors and hospitals OUR money can buy. She's not going to give that up. Nope. Not going to happen in a million years. Nor are any of the other government blood suckers er, Senators and Congressmen, going to stand for that either!