[Alty]

I've heard that pressing a cut, raw potato on them works.

Only if warlock spits on the potato and you turn around 5 times while chanting "Wart, heal thyself".

[hheath541]

Really?

In the dark ages, the Church was in eclipse, and what was the name of those people running Europe, you know, the ones doing human sacrifice and various tortures at halloween? Druids, weren't they?

actually druids NEVER performed human sacrifices. There were a group of people who believed in the value of all life and that all of creation was sacred, much like the buddhists.

i would like you to cite some reliable sources that can prove that druids made human sacrifices. Heck, there aren't any first-hand records that druids even ever EXISTED, because they didn't believe in writing anything about their religion down. Most of the resources in existence are from people, mostly the early missionaries, relating stories they heard from other people. There are very few accounts from the time the druids are said to have lived that mentions them, and most are merely in passing.

Christian influence has given us schools, hospitals, great art, music and liberty (in this country) unequalled in history.

this, too, is false. All those things were present in ancient greece, just to name one example, long before christianity was around.

there is more art that has absolutely nothing to do with christianity than that which does. There has also been more art throughout history that had nothing to do with christianity than that which did. The same goes for music.

many asian cultures actually have better hospitals and school systems then anything present in america. Those cultures do NOT have a value or belief system based on christianity, in fact a christians are a minority in those countries.

many of the american indian tribes had more freedom and equality than early america, and some even more than is present today. The cherokee, for instance, had equal rights for all and a governing system much like democracy. Women were allowed to fight and serve as leaders and had full ownership of their lives and property. Unlike modern america, if an individual, man or woman, felt that they were being mistreated or that a marriage had simply run it's course, they were able to end it on good terms with the other person without having to jump through all the legal and hoops that exist today.

The Bible also encourages private ownership of land and the work ethic, two concepts responsible for the creation of the great economic power that the USA has been.

so did many ancient religions. Ancient greece, rome, and egypt were all built, and flourished, under that belief.

It is departure from these basic concepts that is causing the downfall of our economy at the present time. The rush toward socialism is NOT Bible based, and has been proven to be a failure many times already.

actually, it is the belief that someone else will fix your problems that has caused all the problems. Big businesses have run themselves into the ground, all the while thinking that the government will come along and bail them out of trouble. Then, guess what, the government comes along and gives them money to pay off debts they shouldn't have in the first place.

i find that a very christian belief. Correct me if I'm wrong, but christianity teaches that if you make a mistake it's OK, because all you have to do is pray to god asking for help/forgiveness and he'll come along and make it all OK, if you deserve it.

[hheath541]

Unlike atheists or those who do not put their trust in God, Christians acknowledge that humanity is imperfect, and that anything based on the humanity is going to have its faults.

I know MANY atheists and non-christians and NONE of them believe that humans are perfect. In fact, they are more ready, willing and able to admit that they ARE flawed and work to change it than the CHRISTIANS I know. Christians seem all to willing to just sit back and wait for god to come along and fix things, all the while complaining that things never change or get better.

[hheath541]

To be clear I am NOT a he.. I am a SHE and because I love my race does not make me racist.. I am talking about love-NOT hate.. that's where you liberals always get it wrong..

I think most of the people here simply use 'he' when there is no definitive way of knowing the correct gender. I have been referred to as he AND she, and neither bother me. Now, if you were posting in the pregnancy forum asking if we thought you were pregnant and someone called you 'he' you would have an actual reason to be upset.

It's not just liberals who take offense to a statement like, 'love your race.' telling someone to love their race strongly implies that they should not love or respect other races. If you mean something different then you need to use more inclusive language. If you don't know what that means, you need to go look it up.

Just because I think things were better years ago than they are now and that a Christian based belief system is partially the reason AND because I happen to think ALL people should love their race you assume I am a WHITE CHRISTIAN MALE

Actually, I thought you were christian. I made no real assumptions on your race OR gender. A racist from one gender is just the same as a racist from any other gender, in my book. And I have never known racism to be exclusively male.

If for instance I was a black, Muslim female that was waving a banner saying to, "love your race." You'd be all fine and cosy with that wouldn't you? Because THAT would be being PC to everyone. *spit* ridiculous! Everyone should love themselves, friends, family and race.. Thought I made that clear.. There was no small print that said "if you're white"..

Actually, I would find that just as offensive as a white, christian male or an asian, taoist male or female. Racism comes in all shapes, sizes, colors, religions, and genders.

Since you seem a bit shaky on the actual definition of racism, let me help you out.

Rac⋅ism [rey-siz-uhm] –noun
1. a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human races determine cultural or individual achievement, usually involving the idea that one's own race is superior and has the right to rule others.
2. a policy, system of government, etc. based upon or fostering such a doctrine; discrimination.
3. hatred or intolerance of another race or other races.
Racism Definition | Definition of Racism at Dictionary.com

By my count you seem to be racist.

[inthebox]

Who are you to speak "In the name of Christianity"?


Self explanatory:

About the YMCA

Young Mens CHRISTAIAN Asociation. Of course it is now co-ed and has developed since its foundation.

God's Pantry Food Bank - Home


The Salvation Army: What We Believe


Catholic Health Initiatives


William Wilberforce - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"In 1785, he underwent a conversion experience and became an evangelical Christian, resulting in major changes to his lifestyle and a lifelong concern for reform. In 1787, he came into contact with Thomas Clarkson and a group of anti-slave-trade activists, including Granville Sharp, Hannah More and Charles Middleton. They persuaded Wilberforce to take on the cause of abolition, and he soon became one of the leading English abolitionists. He headed the parliamentary campaign against the British slave trade for twenty-six years until the passage of the Slave Trade Act 1807."

Martin Luther King, Jr. - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. was a BAPTIST minister







Please elaborate and provide links.




Search engine's are amazing, you can provide links to base your opinion in FACTS, not just general statements





"We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their creator with certain unalienable rights, that among them...." (from memory :D)

I see the words "created" and "their creator" it sounds to me like it is saying "Everyone has a right to believe what they want, because everyone is equal, and you can believe in your creator, no matter what that is.
NOT "Unless you are Christian get out of my country."



Read those, bold faced, words literally. How you can interpret them to mean what you just wrote is ?????






Where do atheists, or "those who do not put their trust in God" as a whole think humanity is perfect? You talk to any educated person, of any religion(or lack thereof) and you will find that everyone knows that humanity is imperfect.
Just like there were stray "Christians" who did inhumane things, and they don't speak for all of Christianity, there are stray "[insert any religion here]" who did inhumane things, but don't speak for the whole of their religion.


Exactly, your whole statement that Christianity is bad does not hold water then.





Certainly, a sinful humanity, including those not of the church, have comitted atrocities, but it is biased to only see one side.

See what I did there? You need to look at it from another standpoint also. Used your own logic against you, because you are refusing to see anything else.

I do , that is why I stated that. I can tell you that priest molestation of children is bad, that burning heretics, or the inquisition is bad.

My response was to catsmine



G&P

[inthebox]

Gal, read the OT brook of Amos. Read the NT Sermon on the Mount. Read the teachings of Jesus. Do you know the Golden Rule?

Does the bible advocate any particular form of government? Or is it primarily about GOd and our relationship to God?





G&P

[inthebox]

many asian cultures actually have better hospitals and school systems then anything present in america. Those cultures do NOT have a value or belief system based on christianity, in fact a christians are a minority in those countries.

This is based on what?



SAT Scores Fall as Gap Widens; Asians Gain - WSJ.com

College Board officials said that Asian-American students appeared to do better at all income levels. Officials said that was because they tend to take more Advanced Placement and other rigorous courses, and their families place a strong value on success in education.

Religion is a direct non-factor. Parental influence is the most important factors.


Children in single-parent families by race - Data Across States - KIDS COUNT Data Center

BLacks have the highest rate of single parenthood - lowest scores
Asians have the lowest rates of single parenthood - highest scores


However, the Christian value is for marriage, even despite similar divorce rates between christians and Non- Christians.






G&P

[HelpinHere]

Self explanatory:

About the YMCA

Young Mens CHRISTAIAN Asociation. Of course it is now co-ed and has developed since its foundation.

God's Pantry Food Bank - Home


The Salvation Army: What We Believe


Catholic Health Initiatives


William Wilberforce - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"In 1785, he underwent a conversion experience and became an evangelical Christian, resulting in major changes to his lifestyle and a lifelong concern for reform. In 1787, he came into contact with Thomas Clarkson and a group of anti-slave-trade activists, including Granville Sharp, Hannah More and Charles Middleton. They persuaded Wilberforce to take on the cause of abolition, and he soon became one of the leading English abolitionists. He headed the parliamentary campaign against the British slave trade for twenty-six years until the passage of the Slave Trade Act 1807."

Martin Luther King, Jr. - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. Was a BAPTIST minister

Search engine's are amazing, you can provide links to base your opinion in FACTS, not just general statements

Yes, they are. Now, go use one of those "amazing" search engines to see how all of those things Cats listed are all related to religion. If you can find yourself information (no, I am not going to read it because I know it's all religion-related) then you can find information for Cats' examples (and I know those are religion-related also).

Read those, bold faced, words literally. How you can interpret them to mean what you just wrote is??

Okay, it literally says nothing about Christian values or beliefs. In fact, it doesn't even use the word "God". Because it says "creator" I could see aethists seeing their parents as their "creator(s)", so I still have to ask how that says anything about a Christian God?

Exactly, your whole statement that Christianity is bad does not hold water then.

My statement was not that Christianity is "bad", but rather that your statement that a Christian background for this country is not only unmerited, but not inherently "good" as there are "bad" things that have come of it.

I do , that is why I stated that. I can tell you that priest molestation of children is bad, that burning heretics, or the inquisition is bad.

Good. Besides the molestation (which is more about the individuals than the religion) you only listed two events that happened outside of the jurisdiction of this country.
Now, go look up all of that stuff that Cats listed, and see how religious influence in this country is not always a good thing. Until you do that, since you've been defending religious influence in this country, don't claim that you're looking at the other side of things.

My response was to catsmine

It's a public forum, get over it.
If you wanted to talk to Cats personally, send him a PM. Otherwise, it's a free country, and a free board, don't complain if someone else replies to your message.


I'll respond to the rest of what you said in a minute, it's horribly hard to quote it like you posted it.

[Wondergirl]

Does the bible advocate any particular form of government? Or is it primarily about GOd and our relationship to God?

No form except to render to Caesar... That relationship to God first, and then our relationship TO EACH OTHER. Thus, the Golden Rule, Jesus' Second Greatest Commandment, the OT book of Amos.

[hheath541]

This is based on what?



SAT Scores Fall as Gap Widens; Asians Gain - WSJ.com





Religion is a direct non-factor. Parental influence is the most important factors.


Children in single-parent families by race - Data Across States - KIDS COUNT Data Center

BLacks have the highest rate of single parenthood - lowest scores
Asians have the lowest rates of single parenthood - highest scores


However, the Christian value is for marriage, even despite similar divorce rates between christians and Non- Christians.






G&P

You are only looking at test scores of different ethnic backgrounds WITHIN america. I was talking about the school systems in different COUNTRIES. They are not the same thing and you cannot use america standardized testing to judge the knowledge base and curriculum in other countries. You not only didn't prove your point, you failed to even make a dent in mine.

[hheath541]

Now, go look up all of that stuff that Cats listed, and see how religious influence in this country is not always a good thing. Until you do that, since you've been defending religious influence in this country, don't claim that you're looking at the other side of things.

I like how my points are being ignored by those trying to claim the christianity has done nothing but good for this country. Probably because they can't find a way to dispute them.

I was even kind enough to provide links to my sources, and everything.

[HelpinHere]

Sorry heath (not health :D). I know you're there.

I was just responding to that guy's responding to me responding to him responding to Cats' post... :confused:
I think that makes sense... lol :rolleyes:

[hheath541]

Sorry heath (not health :D). I know you're there.

I was just responding to that guy's responding to me responding to him responding to Cats' post... :confused:
I think that makes sense... lol :rolleyes:

it made perfect sense ^_^

it just amuses me that they're ignoring my post. My only guess is because they can't find any way to disprove me.

[HelpinHere]

Yep, it's a better reason than most to do so! :D

[hheath541]

I think we frightened them off.

[galveston]

Here you go. With link at bottom

Name of Signer State Religious Affiliation
Charles Carroll Maryland Catholic
Samuel Huntington Connecticut Congregationalist
Roger Sherman Connecticut Congregationalist
William Williams Connecticut Congregationalist
Oliver Wolcott Connecticut Congregationalist
Lyman Hall Georgia Congregationalist
Samuel Adams Massachusetts Congregationalist
John Hancock Massachusetts Congregationalist
Josiah Bartlett New Hampshire Congregationalist
William Whipple New Hampshire Congregationalist
William Ellery Rhode Island Congregationalist
John Adams Massachusetts Congregationalist; Unitarian
Robert Treat Paine Massachusetts Congregationalist; Unitarian
George Walton Georgia Episcopalian
John Penn North Carolina Episcopalian
George Ross Pennsylvania Episcopalian
Thomas Heyward Jr. South Carolina Episcopalian
Thomas Lynch Jr. South Carolina Episcopalian
Arthur Middleton South Carolina Episcopalian
Edward Rutledge South Carolina Episcopalian
Francis Lightfoot Lee Virginia Episcopalian
Richard Henry Lee Virginia Episcopalian
George Read Delaware Episcopalian
Caesar Rodney Delaware Episcopalian
Samuel Chase Maryland Episcopalian
William Paca Maryland Episcopalian
Thomas Stone Maryland Episcopalian
Elbridge Gerry Massachusetts Episcopalian
Francis Hopkinson New Jersey Episcopalian
Francis Lewis New York Episcopalian
Lewis Morris New York Episcopalian
William Hooper North Carolina Episcopalian
Robert Morris Pennsylvania Episcopalian
John Morton Pennsylvania Episcopalian
Stephen Hopkins Rhode Island Episcopalian
Carter Braxton Virginia Episcopalian
Benjamin Harrison Virginia Episcopalian
Thomas Nelson Jr. Virginia Episcopalian
George Wythe Virginia Episcopalian
Thomas Jefferson Virginia Episcopalian (Deist)
Benjamin Franklin Pennsylvania Episcopalian (Deist)
Button Gwinnett Georgia Episcopalian; Congregationalist
James Wilson Pennsylvania Episcopalian; Presbyterian
Joseph Hewes North Carolina Quaker, Episcopalian
George Clymer Pennsylvania Quaker, Episcopalian
Thomas McKean Delaware Presbyterian
Matthew Thornton New Hampshire Presbyterian
Abraham Clark New Jersey Presbyterian
John Hart New Jersey Presbyterian
Richard Stockton New Jersey Presbyterian
John Witherspoon New Jersey Presbyterian
William Floyd New York Presbyterian
Philip Livingston New York Presbyterian
James Smith Pennsylvania Presbyterian
George Taylor Pennsylvania Presbyterian
Benjamin Rush Pennsylvania Presbyterian

www.adherents.com/gov/Founding_Fathers_Religion

Religion of the Founding Fathers of America

[NeedKarma]

Well that answers everything!

LOL!

[galveston]

Well that answers everything!

LOL!

It's a pretty good answer to those who loudly claim that this country was founded by Deists.

Don't you agree?

[hheath541]

this country was founded by people who wrote the separation of church and state INTO THE CONSTITUTION! If they intended the government to be run on the values and teachings of ANY religion, they wouldn't have done that.

[NeedKarma]

It's a pretty good answer to those who loudly claim that this country was founded by Deists.

Don't you agree?

Well no. There were a lot of replies to your statements starting on page 5 but you blew right through those.