[taoplr]

Tao, I've heard about NLP but never really tried it. Besides those links have you ever stuided it or have any book recomendations on the subject that are good?

Hey Chuff,

I had the good fortune to study with the founders in the mid 70s. It has proven useful in my personal and professional life for years and working with a lot of people. It enabled me to understand myself and others in practical ways, without dogma, just providing tools. It also helped me make fundamental changes in myself that I desperately needed to change.

NLP has a dark side and can be misused. I find that true for any powerful system that has insight into how people work and methods for influencing them. It also has many self-correcting components.

I have not followed its developmental path very closely, so there must be plenty people, web sites, blogs, books, workshops, and various media products out there that I don't know. I recommend that you start with a good scouring of the web. Read everything you find. Let me know if you come across anything questionable and I'll offer an opinion. Also:

Watch the videos on Darren Brown on uTube. The guy uses straight up NLP plus some real genius that will absolutely blow your mind. Tony Robbins was also an NLPer and based much of his method on it. You might like his work.

Googlize: Milton H. Erickson, John Grinder, Richard Bandler, Robert Dilts, Leslie Cameron Bandler, Steve Gilligan, Steve Andreas, Connirae Andreas, & Robert McDonald.

There are surely books galore, but most of what you want to read should be on the web. I'll look around and see if something pops up that you should read.

Also read about Milton Erickson: Amazon.com: milton h erickson

Read:

Uncommon Therapy
My Voice Will Go With You

Erickson was the primary model for a big part of NLP. He was the greatest medical hypnotist of all time, I feel.

That should get you some pleasure and insight. I hope you enjoy the exploration.

Tao

[vanheart]

Hey guys.
Its been a month of NC.

Not sure if I can even communicate what I feel. Been marking this on my calendar & now not sure even why at this point.

The past few days have been ones of understanding & confusion still. Doesn't seem like a day goes by when I don't think about this girl. I almost wish that would subside.

I go from complete understanding to missing, wondering, hatred, to feelings of deception. And still I wake up with her on my mind.

I even wrote some things to help me break free and realize. Like "Shes gone, She doesnt want you, Shes moved on." Then to ones like "If you truly feel love for her her, then wish her well in her life without you."

Always looks & sounds good on paper, but I guess it all helps in some way.

Among my efforts to work hard, exercise, keep busy, socialize, etc.. I seem to end up feeling so lonely at times & ask myself why?

Why is this destructive girl having such an effect on me still? Is it me or the time/conditioning, etc..

It seems like sometimes I can't stop. As much as I try. I guess time is my only salvation. I can't wait until I don't feel anything towards her.

Its harder than I thought.

[taoplr]

hey guys.
Its been a month of NC.

Not sure if I can even communicate what I feel. Been marking this on my calendar & now not sure even why at this point.

The past few days have been ones of understanding & confusion still. Doesn't seem like a day goes by when I don't think about this girl. I almost wish that would subside.

Congrats on the month of NC.

Whoa! Talk about the "almost" part. What stops you from totally wishing these thoughts would subside? Delve into this.

I go from complete understanding to missing, wondering, hatred, to feelings of deception. And still I wake up with her on my mind.

I even wrote some things to help me break free and realize. Like "Shes gone, She doesnt want you, Shes moved on." Then to ones like "If you truly feel love for her her, then wish her well in her life without you."

Always looks & sounds good on paper, but I guess it all helps in some way.

Whatever works. But writing about her won't help now as much as writing about yourself. You are still in a pattern and the de-energizing of that pattern still is somewhere within your power. Maybe not your conscious mind's sphere of power, but available to the Greater You, which includes your unconscious mind. As tough as it is, and because it is tough, remembering that will make it easier for you to plow through this until you are on the other side of it.

While you're not done yet, you are learning. You know that logical arguments don't work, that you can relapse and recover reasonably well, that the path to freeing your heart is hard, and that the work you have done so far hasn't reached the place in you from which you can move out of this loop and on to your next steps. But you also have a sense that you own this process, so you can find the resources you need to let go and move on.

Among my efforts to work hard, exercise, keep busy, socialize, etc.. I seem to end up feeling so lonely at times & ask myself why?

This is the human condition! You and 3/4 of the world's population feel lonely because of the alienation our society promotes in us. People write books about that in every culture and era.

So don't mix existential loneliness—or the simple need we all have for touch, to be together with someone—with a longing for her. She is your obsession for the moment, not the answer to your loneliness.

Why is this destructive girl having such an effect on me still? Is it me or the time/conditioning, etc..

That's the magic question, or near it. Right now, the question that comes to mind is What does she represent to you? You haven't gotten deep enough within yourself to hit the release button on the meaning of all this. What, exactly, does she mean to you? To what story does she belong? Take some time with this.

It seems like sometimes I can't stop. As much as I try. I guess time is my only salvation. I can't wait until I don't feel anything towards her.

Its harder than I thought.

Yep, so far it's been a tough experience. Time is your ally and every day that passes gives you greater distance from 30 days ago. You might feel eager to be done, but you determine how you let go. You might be fully aware that getting completely through it means that you get to heal and grow from the experience. Be equally clear that whatever residue of suffering you carry away, you get to keep.

So, take stock of what you are learning about yourself, how you operate, and what choices you can make next. No conclusions or judgments about what this turns you into or says about what you are. You're a little wiser than you were a month ago and your ego isn't so much in the way, so be patient and kind. Take a few deep breaths, relax, and get back to observing yourself, having dialog with yourself, and getting deeper within yourself until you completely assimilate this whole experience.

Tao

[talaniman]

Fact It was a five year relationship

Fact- Its been a month since the break up

Of course you still have feelings and that's so normal as you have just gotten over the shock and are in the mourning period of this break up. You are using your coping skills to get you through this. Your doing pretty good for a normal human.

Talaniman calculation- depending on how proactive you are with your healing, factoring in the maturity factor and the support factor (Hehehe) you will feel a lot better in the coming months. Just remember it's a process, and that takes time.

You may never get over her completely, but the point is to be able to handle it and be happy with yourself and rebuild a life that you enjoy without her.

Actually your off to a good start and are on a good path.

[vanheart]

Thanks guys.
Gives me a lot to work on
I will continue with further and more focused self-dialogue

[talaniman]

I would think, just me, that being more proactive physically with getting out among people and having a great time would give you a good healthy balance, in the healing process.

[vanheart]

Thanks, I've been doing that too.

[vanheart]

Hi,
Through my efforts to answer those questions of what she means to me, I looked back at something that I pulled from the web a few weeks ago.

Here it is, speaks volumes of my relationship:

You won't believe me now, but maybe you will in the future; the fact is, you do not love her and you never did love her. You cannot love anyone right now because you do not love yourself and hold yourself in very low esteem. You hurt because you had a very sick symbiotic relationship going on; you were with an abusive out of control woman and you had a sick, needy emotional dependency on her, nothing more; you don't even really like her, you needed her to punish you for whatever happened to you in your past that created this loss of self-esteem and your need to be punished by someone. Whatever she said and led you to believe you believed because you wanted to believe it, not because it had any validity...you were the proverbial drowning man clutching at a straw, only in this case your straw was a razor blade; the more you fought to hold on, the more you got hurt.
You really have to get hold of yourself and force yourself to join a new club or organization whose members have the same interests you do or volunteer your time somewhere and feel good about yourself again.
The minutiae of why she said this or that really doesn't matter because anything she ever said to you was lies in order to get you to do whatever she wanted you to do at the time; she cares nothing for you and you care nothing for her, the two of you are deeply emotionally scarred, only the difference is, you can be cured and find your happiness.
Please understand, you are never going to have any closure from this because there is nothing to have closure from. You haven't lost anything because you never had anything to begin with; all of it was lies and abuse.
There are no good times with her and she will never change, she will be the same and nothing you can do or say will change that, so since she won't change, it is you who must and get on with your life and seek out new people and open yourself up to new experiences. You must stop clinging to your dream of her, because it is not real...it is an illusion, as was the entire relationship. Until you are a whole, independent person you really won't be able to have a reciprocal satisfying relationsip with anyone; you must not think of a partner as something you need to complete yourself, a partner should be someone who complements your life, but you are a whole separate human being who can survive on his own, which is what you have to do now until you find a viable partner.

[taoplr]

Hi,
Through my efforts to answer those questions of what she means to me, I looked back at something that I pulled from the web a few weeks ago.

(Great description)

Your movement continues. If you're up for reading, take a look at Amazon.com: Finding Meaning in the Second Half of Life: How to Finally, Really Grow Up: James Hollis: Books

Hollis' insight into relationships and self-understanding is sensational.

Tao

"It matters if you just don't give up."
--Stephen Hawking

[vanheart]

Thanks Tao.
I picked that up & started reading it.

After 34 days of NC, woke up this a.m. to an email from my ex.

"Hi, how are you? I am not sure where you are at or if you want to speak with me but I would really love to talk and see how you are doing.
I'm ok.

Let me know if I can call and when a good time would be. I hope you are doing well, enjoying summer and that your big project is going awesome.

hope to talk to you soon.
much love"

Why after a month is she doing this? In one way I feel remotely satisfied that she somewhat cares? Or maybe not, maybe she just fishing for something. Wish I knew...

[jmw0713]

Typical ex feeling guilty email. Don't fall for it. She will not tell you anything that you want to hear. She just wants to make sure you are "OK" with everything that happened to make herself feel better.

I fell into that trap a while back with my ex. I caved in and talked to her so we could "catch up". Did I gain anything from that... no, just old memories and feeling that I helped her get over her guilt and move on by being there to talk. Did she tell me anything that made me feel better about what happened between us? No. Was she trying to get back with me because things fell through with her current BF? No.

So yeah, while I was stuck on her, I still acted like a sick puppy and helped her. I should have stuck to NC and helped myself and let her wallow in her guilt.

Don't reply... just forge ahead.

[talaniman]

Talaniman Rule-Once I disappear from someones life, they have to work their a$$ off to even find me.

[taoplr]

Thanks Tao.
I picked that up & started reading it.

After 34 days of NC, woke up this a.m. to an email from my ex.

"Hi, how are you? I am not sure where you are at or if you want to speak with me but I would really love to talk and see how you are doing.
I'm ok.

Let me know if I can call and when a good time would be. I hope you are doing well, enjoying summer and that your big project is going awesome.

hope to talk to you soon.
much love"

Why after a month is she doing this? In one way I feel remotely satisfied that she somewhat cares? Or maybe not, maybe she just fishing for something. Wish I knew...

Ahhhh, the pleasures of NC!

Here's a great chance to let go and be done, or to pick it up again and do the dance with her. She's phishing, looking to find a hook. But now, the locus of control is in you.

So, it all belongs to you. Take your time. Slow down and listen inside. Treat yourself with a wholesome love. Whatever you do, there are people here who stand with you.

Tao

[vanheart]

Thanks all,

I have no intention of contacting her.
At first, in some sick way, this put my wonder to rest if she was thinking about me or if she would ever try & contact me.

Its been a month to the day since she tried last via text.

This in fact through me for a loop & although put that wondering to rest, in a way confused me a bit more. A minor setback, I suppose.

What got me kind of pissed is how she stated "Im ok" & "Hope you are enjoying the summer" Yet Ive been pretty paralyzed for most of these weeks.

I wonder if she's trying to see if Im OK to validate her decision, or feels guilty or what. Maybe she thinks that its been enough time that we can simply chat about our day. To make her feel warm & fuzzy that she is a strong, couragous and caring person. (just the opposite) Or maybe there's no one to listen to her the way I used to. Ie: Listen to all of the amazing things she's got on the go... Or "I can't believe he hasn't tried to contact me, he loves me so much & was so broken up...

I don't know & probably shouldn't even wonder why. I guess I'm not there yet to not give a crap. It kind of effs with my head.

Another day.

[taoplr]

Thanks all,

I have no intention of contacting her.
At first, in some sick way, this put my wonder to rest if she was thinking about me or if she would ever try & contact me.

Its been a month to the day since she tried last via text.

This in fact through me for a loop & although put that wondering to rest, in a way confused me a bit more. A minor setback, I suppose.

What got me kinda pissed is how she stated "Im ok" & "Hope you are enjoying the summer" Yet Ive been pretty paralyzed for most of these weeks.

I wonder if shes trying to see if Im ok to validate her decision, or feels guilty or what. Maybe she thinks that its been enough time that we can simply chat about our day. to make her feel warm & fuzzy that she is a strong, couragous and caring person. (just the opposite) Or maybe theres no one to listen to her the way I used to. ie: Listen to all of the amazing things shes got on the go... Or "I can't believe he hasnt tried to contact me, he loves me so much & was so broken up...

I dont know & probably shouldnt even wonder why. I guess im not there yet to not give a crap. It kinda effs with my head.

Another day.

One day at a time, Dude. Just keep letting go. Keep a watch out for the parts of you that are already in a new place. They've lost interest in her, and are creating your next steps. You might find yourself wondering what they're up to.

Tao

[ajGambino]

Be strong man, she's just trying to make it easier for herself. She knows what she did, and she knows it was cold and heartless... that's why she's emailing you: To see if she can get any sympathy words out of you, so she can feel better and sleep better.

You do not owe her anything, she left you to deal with a devastating breakup, now you leave her with the recoil effects. Screw her, you've come this far... don't let her F with your mind, keep moving forward.


Shed that skin buddy, we're here for you man.

[vanheart]

Thanks.
I will.
Can't help deciphering that message, though.

"Im ok"
Does that mean?

[taoplr]

thanks.
i will.
cant help deciphering that message, though.

"Im ok"
does that mean?

Knock yourself out. Parse the language; interpret every nuance; look for secret messages in the text. Then, well you know what to do...

BTW, "I'm OK" means that she's OK.

Tao

[jmw0713]

Yep, it just shows you who she is really thinking about in that message... herself.

You're making the right choice by not responding.

Try not to analyze her every word. You'll get a headache.

[vanheart]

ouch & thanks, I'm once again in denial.

I feel stupid for trying to read anything into this. Even when I looked at it from the outside, I still wanted to analyze it. Grasping for any assemblence of true feelings from her. What a joke. Maybe this is what I've been waiting for in a way.

I guess she's been OK since before the breakup. Now I'm pissed she even tried to suck me back in. makes me feel like crap, but can't stop thinking about it today.

was I first thought was a speed bump turned into a mountain.

I guess until I remove her from the equation, I won't be free.

I go from being strong to weak. Lame.