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BIGBOPPER · Mar 9, 2009, 11:53 PM

I hope that this is the right venue for this question.

I lost my job this past summer and in December I applied for, and was awarded, food stamps for myself. My partner, who I have lived with for going on seven years now, did not want to be included at that time in my application, because even though she is also out of work, she thought she had a job offer and wouldn't need to get food stamps for herself. Well fast forward a couple of months, and her job never came through. I want to add her to my case, since we do share housing, meals, and food, etc. much of the money she gets a month goes for my medical bills and medications. She receives unemployment and is my total support. Our incomes fall well within the eligibility requirements for income and assets for two people, if she applies by herself, her unemployment income is $ 13.50 a week too much to qualify.

I went to the a.c.c.e.s.s. online site and added her to the my case. A day later, a lady calls and says that my case cannot be changed because my partner is "not my relative, nor married to me, and that she must file separately." I tried to explain to her that she is my partner, we live under the same roof, prepare meals together... and each time she repeated the same thing and hung up on me. Now, I went to both the state of Florida website, and the U.s. government website, and both say that a household is anyone who lives together and buys and prepares food together. It doesn't say anything about the people in the household having to be related or married.

I tried calling my case worker, but since this is miami, she is swamped and her voice mail will not take any messages. I faxed her, but she has not returned any thing to me.

The state of Florida won't let us marry, and say that unmarried people can't get food stamps. Is this true?

What should I do now?

N0help4u · Mar 10, 2009, 10:03 AM

You said the one site said both the state of Florida website, and the U.s. government website, and both say that a household is anyone who lives together and buys and prepares food together.
Then you say the state of Florida won't let us marry, and say that unmarried people can't get food stamps. Is this true?

You need to call an 800 number and go back to the welfare office and ask to speak to her supervisor or somebody in charge above her. Also tell them you want a print out of the law that states you can not get food stamps if you are just living together, I can not see how they could possibly mske a law like this because some opposite sexes are JUST room mates and some same sexes are 'co habitating' as a couple so you are punished for being honest about your relationship?

BIGBOPPER · Mar 10, 2009, 05:15 PM

I don't have a toll free number for them, and the local number goes to a mailbox that is full. Both the U.S. website and the State of Florida website states that we qualify. Yet this lady says we don't. I am going to try to fax the intake worker that I initially talked to and see if I can get an appointment to see someone about this.
This is very frustrating for my partner and I because we have had problems before because we are a same sex couple.
I know that not everyone appreciates, nor approves of our relationship, and I probably will never change their minds, but they should still do what's right and not try to think that by cutting something here, or denying us something there, will make us change. It won't. I am more committed to her than my husband was to me. And I think that all couples that are such should be rewarded for that, and not villified.
Oops, I'm on my soapbox (again,) and I apologize.
Hopefully this time I can get through to someone...
Thank you again for a very nice response.

twinkiedooter · Mar 10, 2009, 05:59 PM

Go in person to their office. Trying to do things over the phone is pointless to those people ditto with faxing anything. Faxes get lost. You both should go with appropriate ID. Fill out paperwork there to change your household. You might have to go back for another face to face interview in order to change your household's status. That kind of change just can't be done over the phone or by fax.

Fr_Chuck · Mar 10, 2009, 06:27 PM

Several issues, 1. you did not claim them on the orgainal filing, even though they were living in the home ( when you thought they were going to earn too much, then it was OK to leave them off) ** not legally, since it would have been household income

Now you want to claim them, since it would provide more benefit.

Can anyoe else sort of say, fraud at the first filing to benefit the person filing. And it is possible the agency will catch or question that issue at the time also.

BIGBOPPER · Mar 10, 2009, 08:08 PM

I had to let the agency know that I lived with her when I filed the initial application. They needed a letter from her to state that she is my sole form of support. At that time, as long as I did not add her, her income was immaterial. The case worker even saw a picture of her on my cell phone. (it turns out we both like cats, and I was showing off my calico kitty.) My girlfriend at the time had interviewed for three positions at local hospitals, and thought that she was going to land one of them. Unfortunately, since there were dozens of applicants, she was passed over. I was awarded the full amount for a single household, since it was determined that she could support herself, and did not want to be added to the claim.
DCF knows about my girlfriend, and if they had wanted to at that time, asked for her income (she's on unemployment BTW).
There has to be several households that do not consist of either married couples or relatives. Several people live together, have children together, but do not marry. They can get food stamps easily.
I do not understand why I cannot add my partner, now that there has been a change in our household situation, and we need further assistance.
To answer TwinkieDooter, I think that's what it is going to boil down to. We'll have to go to our "detachment area" office and spend the day. Maybe somebody there will be a little bit more sympathetic.

artlady · Mar 10, 2009, 08:42 PM

This is not some sort of discrimination.This is bureaucratic red tape.You can not add her to your case.That is up to them,how they end up evaluating the household.She has to file a separate application.

If you were a straight couple they would be doing it the same way.Not married,not a couple.

The DMV has a reputation for red tape bureaucracy,public assistance is beyond that.They are worse.They have so many regulations and you must be willing to jump through their hoops if you want to get even $10.00 in food stamps.

N0help4u · Mar 12, 2009, 07:20 AM

Here is the easiest way to do it and it is how a roommate (non relationship)
Goes about applying.
You applied for yourself
Now your partner goes and applies for themselves (of course they have to do as you did and claim you as in the household) BUT NOT as a couple.
Then you each have your own case and it is up to the office to combine them when they come to their senses. There is no fraud since you are both claiming your incomes.

BIGBOPPER · Mar 12, 2009, 07:00 PM

Well the office will not combine them, a case is a case. I am obligated to immediately report any change in my situation, which I did when we both realized that she wasn't going to get a job soon (There are X number of jobs for our position in three counties near us, so it's not like we were applying at Wal-Mart.), My girlfriend did apply on her own initially, and was denied because she made $13.00 too much, on unemployment only. (I am not on unemployment right now, but will be I hope soon.) But If I follow the rules, and report the change, the income for the two of us, allows an increase in my food stamps. Again, and this is what I have the problem with. A.) two government bodies - The U.S. and the State of Florida, say that we should be considered a household. B.) The lady that I talked to, answered every question I had with "Since you are not related, or married, she must file separately, and we cannot help you." Which is contrary to A.
That is why I consider it discrimination. If the Governments had said anything different, I'd said "Oh well." But they don't. How can the one individual supersede both state and federal law?

lilbay · Mar 14, 2009, 11:46 AM

Actually this deal with Social Services is not discrimination because this is the same for ALL Unmarried couples be they same sex or heterosexual couples. Unless the couple is in fact Married then they must apply as individuals.
(actually you should be happy because you both get your own and end up with more when you break it down :rolleyes:)
So send your partner to do her own case now that she I not getting the unemployment any longer.

Now the whole issue with the fact the state will not allow you to marry that is not really relevant and is a whole separate can of worms and I think is rather messed up and discrimination. However Until it is allowed by your state there is not a thing that will change regarding Social Services.

Also as stated it is Best to Always deal with Social Services in person
We have the ability to fax and mail things here and I have had more workers forget to add it and I get cut off due to their mistake more than I care to share.
So Always deal in person It is Best.

BIGBOPPER · Mar 15, 2009, 02:39 AM

This really has nothing to do with the marriage thing. A boyfriend and girlfriend living together are eligible.
I am going to link you to the actual websites, and you can see what I am talking about. I
Warn you that the State of Florida factsheet is a .pdf. Look at the section: Household Status.

http://www.dcf.state.fl.us/ess/fsfactsheet.pdf

This is the U.S. government website for the SNAP program which provides funds to the states to give food stamps. It takes a little while to get to the part that I am talking about, So I cut and pasted that here.
Eligibility

"Everyone who lives together and purchases and prepares meals together is grouped together as one household. However, if a person is 60 years of age or older and he or she is unable to purchase and prepare meals separately because of a permanent disability, the person and the person's spouse may be a separate household if the others they live with do not have very much income. (More than 165 percent of the poverty level.)" It goes on to talk about Diasabled and elderly recipients, but I do not qualify for either.

Like I said. I don't think that the food stamp office has a leg to stand on. I am going to go down there, but I know what they are going to say. "Oh, you want to question us? Here, jump through some more hoops before we get back to you."

*Sigh* been there, done that, wore out the T-shirt. Then had to go to the thrift store to get another one. :)

This has been very frustrating. I jump through so many hoops, between the food stamps I get, my school and the financial aid, and unemployment, it is maddening. I need a zen garden, I really do.

this8384 · Mar 16, 2009, 01:21 PM

The whole problem here, and I'm sure you know this by now, is that you didn't report your partner on your initial application. I'm curious as to why your case worker let you file without reporting your live-in partner's income, knowing full well that it existed.

Also, this has nothing to do with you being a same-sex couple. I used to rent to a lesbian couple; they received state assistance, no problem. All they did was list who lived in the household and provided proof of income.

I'm also confused as to how her making "$13.50 a week too much" has any bearing. My husband's work hours vary; some months we're way below the poverty level and other times we creep over it. Our case worker told us as long as we're close to the level amount, then we'll continue getting assistance; I can't possibly see them denying you because of an extra $54 each month.

BIGBOPPER · Mar 17, 2009, 12:30 AM

Originally Posted by this8384

The whole problem here, and I'm sure you know this by now, is that you didn't report your partner on your initial application. I'm curious as to why your case worker let you file without reporting your live-in partner's income, knowing full well that it existed.

You are right, I did leave out that part. I have no income whatsoever. I was on disability leave from my company until they laid me off, and the insurance let me go. In order to get food stamps, in the State of Florida, I have to prove that I get some form of income.
(this is stupid, because it discriminates against the homeless.)
So my girlfriend had to write a letter stating that she is supporting me and gives me X amount of money each week. Which is bogus, since both of our names are on our checking account, which they saw. So in effect she did not have to file, that I could file as an individual. We both thought it best that she not file at the time. She had interviews with three different hospitals, and if she was hired, they would have to terminate our food stamps immediately. Now you know that no job pays you right off the bat, so that could have potentially caused problems. Once she started getting paid, I would have then, as I did once before a few years back, reported it, and stopped my stamps.

Also, this has nothing to do with you being a same-sex couple. I used to rent to a lesbian couple; they received state assistance, no problem. All they did was list who lived in the household and provided proof of income.

In a previous entry, I told everyone what the lady that called said. The same phrase over and over. "Since you are not related, or married, she must file separately, and we cannot help you." Which as I stated before, and provided the web links to, contradicts both Federal and state rules.

I'm also confused as to how her making "$13.50 a week too much" has any bearing. Our case worker told us as long as we're close to the level amount, then we'll continue getting assistance; I can't possibly see them denying you because of an extra $54 each month.

This is the State of Florida I am talking about. Depending on the bureaucrat, either you get a break or you don't. Sad to say, but this is very true. This state is also in a money crisis. The current Governor, Charlie Crist, made a major mistake in revising the property taxes. Now the state does not have the income that it use to have. Our former Governor, G.W. Bush's brother, Jeb, also ran things so poorly, that the State doesn't have the capital it needs to maintain itself. Food stamps, by the way, are a Federal program, so the state's problems should not be affected by it, but the mentality since these are State paid employees, is different.
If the income varies like that, a person is not obligated to report the change, however, if the change is more stable, and permanent, then it must be made reported immediately. The State has the right to look at a person's financial records for up to three years after the fact, and if they suspect any foul play, they will investigate. Another stupidity. What if I won the lottery a year from now? Well okay I would have to buy a ticket...

I am looking for anyone else that has had this problem and how it was or was not resolved. I was also hoping that someone from the State DCF trolls these boards and could shed some insight into what I could do. I am trying to jump through all the hoops that are thrown in front of me, but this is disheartening. I have legal proof that we should be listed together, and some idiot with an agenda denied us. We are going to go down to the office soon, but a friend of ours said to try reporting again, which I did, and so far (which may be a good thing,) we haven't heaqrd a word.

LadyStanwyck · Mar 21, 2009, 07:36 AM

This topic is one I have to have experience with as I live in Florida, was on food stamp years ago when my children were young, and have had recent experience with the agency on my daughter's behalf, as well as an old homeless guy I have befriended.

First of all, for those of you who do not live in Florida, the ACCESS office is not much more than a room where you can get online on one of the state provided computers to apply for benefits. There is staff there to assist you with the process of inputting your information, however they are not case workers and can not tell you what will or will not happen with your case. They will fax paperwork to the main office if there are documents that are required as well.

You can apply online at home if you like. You are not required to go to this office.

Next you receive a letter telling you that you MUST have a PHONE interview within x number of days. In several cases I have seen this letter DATED one day before the REQUIRED date. (With mailing time you get the letter AFTER you missed the "appointment". You then have to CALL in and answer all of the questions they have. They might ask that you fax documentation to them, etc.

Then you wait and wait and wait.

They must decide your case within 30 days unless you have NO income then it is expedited. You receive a "Notice of Case Action" that tells you if you are approved or not approved, how much you will receive and on what dates.

As for this woman stating that she is being discriminated against, I believe that she is correct!

When I was receiving assistance years ago I had a roommate who helped cover the rent and utilities. We were just friends and not romantically involved whatsoever. I was required to report him as part of my household because he lived under my roof however since he prepared all of his own meals (actually he ate out a lot) he was not given food stamp benefits. (He did not want them, nor did he apply for them, but he WAS considered part of my household.)

More recently...

My daughter lives with her boyfriend. He was recently laid off from work as a welder. She just applied for food stamps, medicaid, etc. They are NOT married. They are NOT related. They were approved for benefits as a household.

First off, I would suggest asking for the case worker's supervisor's name. Try to speak with the supervisor. If you can not reach the supervisor by phone, write a letter and send it certified mail to the supervisor asking for a review of your case and a WRITTEN response to your inquiry. Keep copies of all letters, faxes, etc. that you send.

Also, check the "Notice of Case Action" letter you received. There should be a process outlined on there for appealing any decisions made regarding your application.

If you do not receive a response, check the website for the state and there should be a place for filing complaints. Document ALL calls you have made, including date, time, who you spoke with and what they told you.

Read every letter you receive CAREFULLY. Make sure you follow there instructions to the letter otherwise they will have an excuse to deny your request.

I hope this is helpful. Good luck. J

this8384 · Mar 21, 2009, 07:56 AM

I don't see a case of discrimination whatsoever. You stated that your roommate's income was counted as household income, as it should have been by law. The OP's issue is that her case worker did not do their job when she filed her initial application; her partner's income should have been included at that time. Your personal situation was handled properly, from what I can see.

I don't know why they refuse to let her add her partner now, unless they simply don't want her to increase her benefits by adding another person to her case.

I agree that the state doesn't always do things the right way. We have some friends who had a baby; after delivery, they took the mother off Medicaid and refused to let the father be on the application for WIC or food stamps. They moved to an adjoining county and reapplied; the mother now has Medicaid and the father also receives the benefits. I don't know which case worker screwed up, but somebody did.

Either way, the OP could find herself in a lot of trouble for "not reporting income" even though she claims her case worker said she didn't have to. She may have to repay some or all of the benefits she received in the past if FL learns that she had someone supporting her and wasn't counting it as household income.

BIGBOPPER · Mar 21, 2009, 03:24 PM

Originally Posted by this8384

Either way, the OP could find herself in a lot of trouble for "not reporting income" even though she claims her case worker said she didn't have to. She may have to repay some or all of the benefits she received in the past if FL learns that she had someone supporting her and wasn't counting it as household income.

I filed initialy as one person. As such, the state only has to look at my income. They require that I have proof of income, so that is why I had my girlfried state she was supporting me, (which she is.) Since only I am applying at that time. The only thing that mattered was my income. This would be similar to an adult child moving back into their parent's house, and the parents supporting them. They would have to claim what the parents gave to them, but not what the parents make, since they are not applying. Now in our case, we are trying to amend my case to add another individual. That individual's income would be reported, and compared to the limits of two people living in the same household. This would be similar to having another person move in with me.

this8384 · Mar 21, 2009, 04:01 PM

Originally Posted by BIGBOPPER

I filed initialy as one person. As such, the state only has to look at my income. They require that I have proof of income, so that is why I had my girlfried state she was supporting me, (which she is.) Since only I am applying at that time. The only thing that mattered was my income. This would be similar to an adult child moving back into their parent's house, and the parents supporting them. They would have to claim what the parents gave to them, but not what the parents make, since they are not applying. Now in our case, we are trying to amend my case to add another individual. That individual's income would be reported, and compared to the limits of two people living in the same household. This would be similar to having another person move in with me.

I don't think you quite understand this. When you apply, you are supposed to report household income, not individual income. You didn't do that because you say that your worker said you didn't have to, which is completely inaccurate - at least in my state. I opened the PDF file in the link you supplied regarding assistance; it doesn't address individual income as you're claiming was all you had to provide - it addresses household income, which is earned by you, your partner and/or any roommates you may or may not have had.

If you were only required to report onw person's income, millions of families across the country would be on state aid because of stay-at-home-parents; they'd be able to go into the office, show that they personally had no income, and start getting benefits. That's not how it works.

Fr_Chuck · Mar 21, 2009, 04:59 PM

It may well be since you did not properly report all income at the beginning, you are being denied now for a period.

Also if you are ONE dollar over, you are denied, they have amounts, if you earn... to... you can get this much, if you earn... to... you get this. If you earn one dollar over the amount to get any, you don't get any. That is just the way it works.

If your household income is too much, you are not suppose to get it, should not get it.

All the other factors are merely and I will call it like I see it, excuses, reasons to claim to be a victim

Food stamps are based on need, earnings, you either qualify or don't

JudyKayTee · Mar 22, 2009, 06:23 AM

Coming in late but I see an incorrect initial filing (for whatever reason - mistake, fraud, who knows) followed by a change of heart followed by a "need" to be a victim.

I agree with what others have said, including Frchuck - "You either qualify or you don't."

I worked for the Feds - we weren't mindreaders. We based decisions on what people told us initially.

bella2120 · Apr 19, 2009, 09:06 AM

I have applied for Food Stamps twice in Boynton Beach Fl. Both times numerous amount of people from the hot line have told me that a household is all the people that buy food together. I have no income besides my boyfriends. I do not work, but he does. I was denied food stamps because we live in the same household and buy food together. A lot of those people that work at DCF give false information. I have been told things that have not been correct. This is from the DCF website:

Household Status
Individuals who buy and cook food together are one household for food stamp purposes and must have their eligibility determined as a group. There are situations where we must include individuals in the same household, regardless of how they buy and cook their food. Examples include parents and children under age 22, adults exercising parental control over minors in the home, and spouses.

http://www.dcf.state.fl.us/ess/fsfactsheet.pdf