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Diet Pepsi Girl · Jan 9, 2009, 07:51 AM

My cousin gave me his mom's diamond necklace, and said it's from Cartier. It's in a Cartier box, and it's absolutely beautiful. I took it to a jewler who looked at it and told me it's not a real Cartier because it doesn't have a Cartier stamp on it and all Cartier diamonds are stamped.
Any truth to this? It's an old necklace, probably at least 25 years. I think it's just under a carat, and it's a kind of snowflake shape. I don't think my cousin would have any reason to lie to me about it being a real Cartier, and the jewler, hoping I would sell it to him, would have a reason to lie to me. Do you have any idea?

Thanks,
Diet Pepsi Girl

ISneezeFunny · Jan 9, 2009, 08:01 AM

Well, most diamonds are stamped or laser-engraved with microdots that tell you where the diamond is from (distributor). If the jeweler told you that it's a fake, chances are, it is. I suggest taking it to another jeweler and have them take a look at it.

Diet Pepsi Girl · Jan 9, 2009, 10:39 AM

Originally Posted by ISneezeFunny

Well, most diamonds are stamped or laser-engraved with microdots that tell you where the diamond is from (distributor). If the jeweler told you that it's a fake, chances are, it is. I suggest taking it to another jeweler and have them take a look at it.

OK, but if it's an old necklace, it can't be laser inscribed right? What about old Cartier? Was that always marked as well? I have no idea how old it is exactly, but it was my cousin's mother's and he is 50!

briolette · Jan 18, 2009, 07:00 AM

You could do some preliminary research yourself and comb through any books on Cartier jewelry to see if that design, or something similar turns up. An experienced jewelry appraiser should be able to tell you one way or the other. A Cartier Jewellery Store should be able to help you with provenance, as well. If all else fails, it might be worth it to you to take/send it to Sotheby's or Christies Auction House(s) for verification. They will definitely know.

briolette · Jan 18, 2009, 07:14 AM

... that's Sotheby's or Christies New York, as opposed to London or Switzerland.

pigeon knows · Jan 31, 2009, 09:21 PM

Hello,

We've just bought my mum a cartier ring from the boutique and I can honestly say, that even if it's the real thing, anything over 3 tiny diamonds in a pendant on a cartier necklace goes for well over 8 grand... so it's a super expensive and special gift to give to someone. I wouldn't rely on the box, as it looks pretty plain and would be easy to imitate. I haven't heard of diamond stamping, as I'm not really knowledgeable in that area, but all their jewellery, at the least, is engraved with the cartier signature, on the inside.
I think I'd def. trust the jeweler, as they could tell by the look and shine, and I guess by the stamping. I think you could also take it into a cartier boutique, as they have 'experts' on site, in case you live in a city where there is a cartier store.

Good luck, and enjoy the necklace, whether cartier or not :)

pigeon knows · Jan 31, 2009, 09:25 PM

I forgot to mention,
Cartier always gives out a certificate of authenticity with the purchase, in a small red case that matches the red box.

Yellow_montu · Feb 2, 2009, 06:31 PM

I have never heard of diamond stamping, we don't stamp ours. I would have thought it impossible to do anything of the sort to a diamond, its too hard a substance and even laser you'd see if the diamond was flawless so would take the price of the diamond down.The metal that the diamond itself will be stamped though. You're better off getting it valued not just by any old jeweller by someone who has the proper GEM qualifications. If you have any big name Jewellers near you e.g. Goldsmiths, Ernest Jones etc they will normally hold "valuation days". If you have any queries you should contact cartier and describe any marks you can see on the metal, normally next to the clasp, and they will be able to tell you if its theirs as it will have their own manufacturers mark.

Fr_Chuck · Feb 2, 2009, 06:55 PM

No, stamping, esp now with laser is very popular, I will as always be a little rude that I can't believe anyone who is in the business does not know this is how they are identified now, esp the most rare.

And they can even lesser ones are ID'ed by marking for safety and security

DiamondTrade - LaserScribe - Certified Diamond Wholesaler

Beyond that, all of the better stores will be making the setting on the metal with a mark that identifies their store.

Yellow_montu · Feb 2, 2009, 07:01 PM

I was merely expressing my opinion and that I haven't heard of it, probably because I don't grade diamonds, I'm not qualified to that level, the only thing we got told when I did my Diplomas was to do with the metals and assay office, 4 C's etc. You may be rude but it was inappropriate and you could have backed up your initial post with them links to further it in the first place. Since I am just expressing an opinion and this has nothing to do with the askers original post now this ends here so as not to spam the board up.

Diet Pepsi Girl · Feb 3, 2009, 05:25 PM

I don't know what you all are talking about but... I looked at it again last week. There are no markings anywhere. Not on the chain, not on the diamond. How small of a marking are we talking here? Would it just say "CARTIER"? Or would it be a number, or a symbol? Remember, this thing is at least 30 years old, probably more like 50.

Yellow_montu · Feb 3, 2009, 05:34 PM

Hallmarkings are, usually if on a necklace, see where the fastener is, there will be abit of metal that's just abit thicker next to it joining it to the next part of the necklace, it will usually be some kind of picture, doubtfull it would say cartier, also points as to how much the diamond weight is and carat of metal or whatever type of metal it is like 375/750 etc. Hallmarking has been around since about the 1700s but it depends, as I don't know much about cartier hallmarking but I would presume the piece would still have to be assayed in some form r other regardless of if its cartier or some other make.

Yellow_montu · Feb 3, 2009, 05:36 PM

If you have a look at this picture (just a random picture) next to the round clip the next ring is abit thicker than the rest - It "should" be hallmarked on that part.
http://www.silvershaven.com/cn170.JPG

if that helps x

briolette · Feb 3, 2009, 08:58 PM

Hi DPG... I've posted a link here of a ring for sale at Rubylane that has a very good picture of Cartier's HALLMARK (metal content), MAKER'S MARK (signature logo), and COPYRIGHT insignia with date.

18K Cartier Men's Tri-Gold Wedding Band - cartier18ktrimansband

Most, if not all, famous jewelry houses apply very distinctive Maker's Marks (logo) to their pieces, which often become as famous as the jewelry itself. Having the ability to identify whether it's the likes of Cartier or Tiffany or Harry Winston and such becomes vitally important to the valuation of the piece, because it will raise it considerably above mere intrinsic value.

That is why you've been asked here to look for "markings" on your jewelry. If it is Cartier, it will likely say so, even if it is 30 years old - which, incidentally, isn't very old at all - jewelers were marking their creations long before that. You should be able to find engraved, or stamped, etchings somewhere on the metal portion of your necklace, particularly on the reverse side of the clasp and/or on larger, metal ornamentation.

Also, I'm not suggesting that it's impossible for you to have an unmarked necklace that isn't Cartier, but the probability is low. If for any reason they did, in fact, produce some unmarked pieces, then you will require expert, knowledgeable eyes to identify it. And, not any jeweler or appraiser is so qualified. Let's be clear about that. That's why earlier I suggested Sotheby's or Christies in New York, if you don't have access to someone in your area with the experience and education to assess it, especially if it is unmarked. A Cartier piece can be verrrrry valuable, so you don't want to put it in just anyone's hands. Unscrupulous jewelers have been known to exchange stones in jewelry, so don't be penny wise and pound foolish with it. Whomever you take it to, I would suggest having them appraise it right in front of you, never leave it and come back later. Even if it turns out not to be a Cartier, it still sounds like a valuable piece of jewelry.

DPG, I am a retired gem dealer/jewelry appraiser who has been out of the business now for more than 20 years, so I'm not up on the most recent occurrences in the market. However, some things remain constant - identifying and valuing Cartier is one of them.

P.S. -- If you have a well-known auction house in your region - like a Skinner or Wexler or Sloan's - that's a really good place to go for the kind of appraisal you need. They will have an expert on hand who is well-versed in identifying "period jewelry" and Makers, marked or unmarked. You might have to pretend like you're interested in selling it to get an appointment though. I don't know if they do independent appraisals these days, they may I just don't know. Worst comes to worst, you'll at least walk away with some idea of its value and whether you should insure it. Or, wait until PBS's Antique Roadshow comes into your area, and take it to them.