[helpmeprettyplease]

Hi- I really need some help VERY soon! Sorry, I'll try to keep it as short as possible.

I go to a hugh university and needed a room to rent. I called about an add the school paper and it was a guy who's parents and another family co-owned a 4 bedroom house. The guy lived in the house but was moving out in 3 weeks. He already had somebody to take over his room. He needed me to move in the last empty room.

I signed the contract. I was supposed to give him the security deposit of $350 at the time of signing the lease but I didn't have my check book with me. I told him I would bring it to him very soon.

The house was completely furnished (minus my room) and the furniture was very nice. I was told that the 2 guys who own ALL of the furniture were staying (there names were written on the lease as occupants). From this it was implied that they were under contract and would be there the entire time. Therefore all the furniture would be staying. This was very important to me as I have NO furniture besides for my room. I was also told (verbally) that I would be responsible for 1/4th of the monthly bills. The add also stated 1/4th utilities.

Well it is now a week after I signed the lease and I have learned that the 2 people with the furniture were on month to month contracts and they are moving out. I am supposed to move in in just 8 days and right now they have nobody else to fill the 2 empty rooms. If I move into the house there will be no living room furniture and I am going to have to pay 1/2 bills which I can not afford.

Does the fact that I NEVER paid a PENNY of the security deposit, was implied (and written on the contract) that the 2 people with the furniture would be occupants, and that I would be paying 1/4th bills void the contract?

Coincidently the reason that the 2 people moved out was because they HATE one of the owners of the house. I spoke to him today about needing to void my rent and he said "we'll i'll have to talk to my lawyer on monday".

I can't base my entire claim on the 1/4th utilites because they MIGHT be able to find 2 more people. So I want to focus on the security deposit not being paid, the furniture being removed, and the people listed as occupants on my lease leaving.

The 2 people that moved out called me and apoligized but said that they refused to deal with the co-owner any longer. They also said that he is a
"sly guy" ,very selfish, and not willing to give it to others.

If he sues me does he have much ground? If so, am I just looking at having to pay him the security deposit or could the judge force me to pay lots of rent?

All he has is my name and cell phone number. He doesn't have my home address, ss#, etc so that would make it harder for him to sue. (though I do have somewhat distinctive name.)

THANK YOU SOOOO MUCH!

[scri8e]

Depends on the language of the document you signed. Usually all party's are responsible for the entire rent if the others take a hike.
The document the 2 others signed has a effect on this also. Is it a lease a Month to month or what?

The deposit could be handled in a lot of different ways.

To answer your question NO not having paid any money on the SD is not your ticket out of this mess. You are bound by the agreement you signed.

[valinors_sorrow]

I would suggest you have a real estate attorney look over the document before doing anything else. If you still have a copy of that ad, take it with the lease too. It sounds like the owner is attempting to run a "boarding house" but not doing it exactly on the up and up. You have experienced enough for it to give me the willies about cooperating any further with these people. Where I live, the initial consultation on the lease document would run about $50 -- a bargain considering the hassle you could be in for.

[excon]

Hello helpme:

I don't think the fact that you didn't yet pay the deposit voids the "contract". However, the fact that he made misrepresentations regarding the furniture might. In any case, it's moot because you're not going to move in, and you don't need a reason not to.

I don't believe that you owe him rent (you never moved in), and I think a judge will agree. You're not going to avoid him though, so don't try. Of course, if you try to hide, you're going to look like you have a reason to hide, and you don't!

You changed your mind. You are entitled to do that. The provisions of the lease/contract (regarding notice, etc.) are NOT in force since you didn't move in. You need to give him no reason whatsoever, why you are not moving in. You do, however, need to let him know that you're NOT moving in. Call him, and follow up in writing with a letter sent certified, return receipt requested. Keep it simple. Just say you're not moving in.

You do owe him the deposit, though. If you send it along with your notice, I'll bet you never hear from him again. But, if you stiff him, he's going to come after you, and I don't blame him.

excon

[Fr_Chuck]

I get to disagree with excon on this one.

For a contract in the US to be valid, there has to be an offer, an acceptance, and consideration given. A contract signed without consideration is not normally inforcable and can be cancelled.

If you have already moved into the apartment, this is differnent, since you have though your actions showed that you have spent time and money moving in ( thus could be considered consideration) plus you acted on the contract thus putting it in force.

I would hope that you have it in writing that you only pay 1/4 of the ultilities, if you do they can not force you to pay any additoinal.

An assumed belief that other tennants would or would not stay with or without "their" furniture is not grouds, since it belonged to them, they were free to sell or give it away if they wanted, and were not obligated to keep it in the house even if they stayed there. Only furniture belonging to the landlord can be promiced.

And at this point, don't pay him a penny, that would actually set the contract in foce and make it valid.

They can then sue you for breach (even if there was not one) because in small claims court, not only the letter of the law is applied, but also the intent of the law is often looked at.


But of course this is opinion of basic contact law, not having read your contact, and not being a bar member, it is only opinion of what I would do,

Your best bet is have an attorney review it and give you an opinion.

[excon]

Hello Padre:

>>>For a contract in the US to be valid, there has to be an offer, an acceptance, and consideration given. A contract signed without consideration is not normally inforcable and can be cancelled.<<<

Absolutely true. I did consider this proposition, and concluded that consideration (her deposit) WAS given, in the form of a verbal promise. The fact that the promise has yet to be fulfilled isn't relevant, in my view. Clearly, the landlord relied on her promise and acted as though he had been given cash. Therefore, I suggest a contract WAS entered into.

But, what do I know? I'm an exconvict, for crying out loud.

excon

[helpmeprettyplease]

Thanks for the responses!

I still don't know what to do but I guess I will have to find a lawyer to look at the contract like you said.

As far as the contract goes it is a basic TAA (Texas Apartment Association) lease. However it is a house, not an apartment. Here is a link to a SAMPLE of the contract if it helps (its the same form but NOT my information or even the same town) : http://www.universityhouse.com/pdf/WVPSampleLease.pdf

Some of you were talking about the entire party being responsible. Well they rent out each room (4 rooms) individually. So therefore the other 2 guys are under no responsibility since they gave their 30-day notice.

And the whole [go ahead and pay the deposit and then he will probably let you go] is not going to work. From my one phone call with him and the opinions of the 2 guys that moved out, he will not work with anybody and is just looking out after himself.

The owner lives a little over 2 hours from the house so if he sued me wouldn't it cost him a lot of money and time to have "his lawyer" travel with him to the college town and fight this when there's a legitimate chance he could lose? Plus I'm not from here, he has no information other than my cell phone, so how would he find me? I'm not hiding but I'm not exactly going to send him my new address.

The ad reads: "Available now, roommates for 4/3 home, 906 XXXXXX ST., no-smoking, w/d, $325/mo. +1/4utilities. Call JaXXX at 97X-690-7XXX or 51X-557-7XXX."

Thanks!!

[helpmeprettyplease]

Something else I forgot to mention:

The two names of the other guys were written on the contract by the guy who gave me the lease contract. He did not have permission from the other two guys to have or write their name on the contract as being occupants.

What if they (the 2 guys moving out) demanded that a new contract be written because they had no knowledge or approval of their names being written as occupants.

[scri8e]

It's a lease all parties are responsible for the entire rent. This GUY who gave you the lease to sign? You signed it. Is this guy authorized to sub-lease? Who's signatures are on this lease?

You may not have a problem at all. The lease maybe invalid.

A lease is typically for one year. It can be a 6 months lease. The facts maybe that the two that left 'broke' the lease. Before the time of the lease was up. What I think this is... Is the guy who gave you the lease to sign is one of the 3 original roomates. The other two broke the lease leaving this guy responsible to pay the entire rent and utilities. He in turn is trying to get other room mates to help him pay for the place. I wouldn't be surprised if he bails as well. Get thee to a Lawyer STAT.
This is no deal this is trouble.

[Fr_Chuck]

I guess what others , excon and myself are saying, is that the very wonderful thing about the American legal system is, no matter what seems perfectly right or wrong can still be sued against by the other party. If it was always black and white ( and even when we think it is) the other side will still find an attorney who will find some loop hole or present the law in another manner.

So best advice consult an attorney,

Second best advice if you don't and if you just don't want to move in. give them written notice that you are cancelling the offer to lease, and that no contract was entered into and you will not be moving in. Do this in writing, and certified so you have proof of reciect. You may well still find yourself in court

[excon]

Hello again, helpme:

I didn't suggest that you pay, and HOPE he WORKS with you. I couldn't care less what he does. I suggested that you pay the deposit because you owe it, and I believe the courts will find that you owe it.

I reiterate; send a letter along with the deposit. You don't have to be nice. Tell him if he doesn't like it, to sue you. He just might. So what? If you do as I suggest, you should kick his butt.

excon

[helpmeprettyplease]

I am still confused as to why some of you think that the 2 guys who moved out are still liable.

There are 4 contracts/leases and one is for each room. Each contract and its terms are not affilliated with the other three contracts.

The 3 guys who currently lived there contracts ended in May and they were each individually on month to month contracts since then.

The guy who gave me the contract (one of the 3 guys living there and moving out next week): his parents co-own the house with the guy that I have been talking about who said he "would talk to his lawyers on monday".

The three people each completely fulfilled their individual contracts and have given their 30 day notice.

Why would they we responsible?

Thanks.

[LisaB4657]

As others have said, there are various ways this can be argued. And I can promise you one thing about this case: there is absolutely no way that anyone can know how a judge will rule in this situation. There is no clear-cut answer here. So here is my opinion:

You were attracted to the house by an ad that advertised 4 separate rooms for rent and that you would be responsible for only 1/4 of the utilities. When you were shown the room you were told by the landlord (or the landlord's representative) that the furniture in the living room would be staying there, as it was the property of other tenants whose names were listed in your lease. You signed the lease on this basis.

Now you have found out that the other tenants are leaving and taking the furniture with them. So one aspect of this house, on which you relied, no longer exists. Unfortunately I don't think a judge would let you out of a lease on that basis alone, since the lack of furniture does not make the place uninhabitable. But a judge might agree that your monthly rent should be reduced because of the loss of the furniture.

As for the utilities, I think the landlord could not require you to pay for more than 1/4 since it was part of the advertising for renting the room. So if you move in and then the landlord tries to charge you more than 1/4 of the utilities then, if I were you, I would not pay the additional and let him sue you. At that time you could counterclaim and argue that you're entitled to a reduced rent because of the furniture.

By the way, your claim that the lease is void because of the non-payment of security is not going to work at all. That's a failure on your part, not the landlord's part. I wouldn't even mention it.

So your options are as follows:

1. Don't move in. Send a certified letter to the landlord that they have misrepresented the premises to you and failed to live up to their advertising and promises, and therefore the lease is null and void. The landlord sues you and I'd say you have a 50-50 chance of winning in court.

2. Send a certified letter to the landlord that they have misrepresented the premises to you and failed to live up to their advertising and promises, and therefore you want a new lease with a substantial reduction in the amount of the rent. The landlord may work with you on this, especially if the house is currently empty.

3. Move in but don't pay more than 1/4 of the utilities.

The best thing you can do is speak to an attorney in the area where the house is located. Many attorneys will offer a free consultation and they may know of other options available to you.

Good luck!

[CaptainForest]

I agree with LisaB.

One thing I would advise is to consider option 1.

If the landlord is a real ***, perhaps it would be easier to find another place to live that will not cause you such a headache.

[helpmeprettyplease]

Yes option one sounds like the best one... I THINK the absolute MOST he would be able to sue me for is the deposit of $350 and then 3 months rent. That's $1400 total. It would cost him that much just to hire a lawyer, and then have him travel the 2+ hours where the court would be handled. Plus the guy would have to take off work to handle it. Also he would have to research where I will be living to be able to serve me the lawsuit which I don't see how he could.

On top of that the 2 guys that are moving out (who own all of the furniture) have agreed that if he does take me to court that they will come defend me stating that their names were never approved to be written on my lease at tenants.

I have found another place to live (no I have not signed the lease yet) but it is about $110 cheaper a month and about 7 miles closer to campus so think I will just sign the lease and take my chances... Bad idea? I have to move in 8 days either way!

I have one final question which is related to the one of the guys that is moving out. He lived in the house for 3 years. On his contract he WROTE "I will only be responsible and pay for 1/4 of the houses utilities" and initialed it. He did this because he was told that there would be 4 people in the house. However for 2 of the years it was just him and the co-owner's son who lived in the house and the last year there were 3 total people. He had to pay 1/2 the utilities for the first 2 years and then 1/3 for the last year. Does he have any ground to take the guy that wants to sue me to court? I guess my question is, by paying 1/2 and 1/3 of the utilities, was he agreeing to it. He's thinking about suing the guy for all the back utilities owed but doesn't know if he has grounds to win. (The statute of limitations for Texas is 4 years)

Thank you soooo much!

[CaptainForest]

I don't think your friend can win.

If only had to pay 1/4 and he paid 1/2 and 1/3, I bet the Judge will look like he agreed to pay the extra in bills.

However, nothing is ever absolute... he could win, but he probably will lose.

As for your situation…

From the sounds of it, I wouldn't want to move in with this landlord.

I would follow LisaB's first option and find a new place to live. That is, sign the new lease (but make sure you read the lease first and make sure that all verbal promises are written into the lease.)

If this new landlord says you must pay 1/5 of utilities, have that written into the lease!

[LisaB4657]

Of course it is up to you which option to take. But keep something in mind... the landlord has a lease that you signed. That is a very powerful piece of evidence in court. Once he shows the judge a signed lease, you have the burden of showing the judge that the premises the landlord delivered were not what he promised in the lease. You do have some evidence to that effect but as I said earlier, there is no way of knowing which way the judge will decide.

You seem to be relying on the fact that the landlord will probably not sue since he is so far away and an attorney can be expensive. But he doesn't have to use an attorney. And $1400 can cover a lot of his expenses when he's sitting with an otherwise empty house. He may figure that the worst that can happen is that he will have to take a day off work and that may make it worth it for him to try to sue you. So be aware that you are gambling when you choose this option.

I strongly suggest that you speak to an attorney in your area about this. They will probably be familiar with how the local courts work and whether the judges have a pro-landlord or pro-tenant inclination.

With regard to the guy who is moving out, of course he can sue. This is another one of those cases where you can't tell which way it will go, but the worst that can happen is that he loses and all it will cost him is the filing fee for small claims court. He won't be much worse off that he already is. If he sues, tell him to make sure he brings to court the lease that he signed and copies of ALL of the utility bills and ALL of the cancelled checks or proofs of payment.

Good luck to both of you!