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cadillac59 · Oct 20, 2008, 10:40 PM

This is a follow-up derived from another thread. I've maintained, as a gay man, that bisexuality in men is a myth which can be explained as either a confusion over definitions of sexual orientation or a denial of being gay, or both. I have no opinion about bisexuality in women (that might be possible, I have no idea). Of course, others disagree.

Sexual behavior does not equate with sexual orientation; in other words, behavior does not define orientation. That's a common misunderstanding. Yes, there is a fairly loose connection between behaviour and orientation- the one may point to the other in a certain way but it is only an indirect connection. Sexual orientation is about arousal, not what a person does. I was married for years but was gay all along and am still gay to this day and will be the rest of my life. Something like 25% of gay men were married at one time (to women) and about 40% claim to have been bisexual at some point in their lives but later dropped the nonsensical "bi" label and simply decided they were gay. Whatever anyone may say about bisexuality one thing is certain: it is virtually non-existant beyond a certain age. In fact, past probably 40 no male even bothers claiming to be bi, they just give up the fight and admit they are gay.

Choux · Oct 21, 2008, 08:48 AM

My opinion is that folks are predominately homesexual or heterosexual, that they get their most powerful sexual experiences from one or the other orientation.

I think bisexual is a term for people who decide to have sex with both males and females for reasons other than powerful sexual desire... maybe just for fun or for social reasons or to lie to themselves or whatever.

smoothy · Oct 21, 2008, 09:19 AM

I believe people can be fully oriented in one direction or the other... but also to a varying amounts somewhere in between for some people. I base this not upon any particular study but from what people in this situation have told me.

No its not professional or scientific, but I've found no cases where two absolutes (an example black or white) are the only choices. There is always an infinate number of grey between them in every case in nature.

cadillac59 · Oct 21, 2008, 01:15 PM

Originally Posted by smoothy

I believe people can be fully oriented in one direction or the other...but also to a varying amounts somewhere in between for some people. I base this not upon any particular study but from what people in this situation have told me.

No its not professional or scientific, but I've found no cases where two absolutes (an example black or white) are the only choices. There is always an infinate number of grey between them in every case in nature.

The process of developing a sense of one's sexual identity can take a long time in some men. In others it's a fairly rapid matter resulting in some guys coming out in their teens. Others, for varying reasons take much longer and, as part of that process, some men- and maybe only a minority- assume they are bisexual and tell others that. It can be a transitional phase brought on by confusion or simply a refusal to accept that they are gay. Eventually most such men throw off the bisexual label and just accept that they are gay. As many of us say in the gay community, "bi today, gay tomorrow."

hollylovesbrandon · Oct 21, 2008, 02:07 PM

Well, one of my friends is the best example I can give. He for quite some time has known that he was different... bisexual that is. He LOVES women, boobs and such turn him on so bad. But also, he loves penis. I mean, LOVES penis. He watches gay porn and straight porn. He has been in relationships with men and women. He is not ashamed of his sexuality. He will tell anyone how he is. He has no problem with it. Right now, he is with a girl... but continues to, as some would say, use his dildo.

I think you can very much have that "grey area"... or at least I know my friend does.

ChihuahuaMomma · Oct 21, 2008, 02:14 PM

I think Bisexuality is based on confusion for the most part. They don't know if they are gay or straight.

cadillac59 · Oct 21, 2008, 03:02 PM

Originally Posted by hollylovesbrandon

well, one of my friends is the best example i can give. He for quite some time has known that he was different...bisexual that is. He LOVES women, boobs and such turn him on so bad. But also, he loves penis. I mean, LOVES penis. He watches gay porn and straight porn. He has been in relationships with men and women. He is not ashamed of his sexuality. He will tell anyone how he is. He has no problem with it. Right now, he is with a girl...but continues to, as some would say, use his dildo.

I think you can very much have that "grey area"...or at least I know my friend does.

I'd first wonder how old your friend is. The younger he is the more likely he is to be confused. Again, I've never met any guy that is truly bi and those that say they are usually come out later and admit they are gay.

Xrayman · Oct 21, 2008, 03:29 PM

I'd first wonder how old your friend is. The younger he is the more likely he is to be confused. Again, I've never met any guy that is truly bi and those that say they are usually come out later and admit they are gay.

Precisely. You have never met a bisexual man over the age of 40.

Guess what, I am!

I'm 41, happily married (to a wonderful woman) for the last 18 years, and I'm bisexual-definitely NOT GAY, or as you put it, confused.

PLEASE stop spreading YOUR unfounded and flawed theories here. Because you are a newbie, I have gracefully been as tactfull as I can be toward you, however I would appreciate it if you would NOT continue with this non-sensical debate. If however, you choose to persist, I will not respond further to any more of your posts on the subject.

I'm positive I know bucketloads MORE about this subject than you and I would very much like you to desist from forcing your opinions down the throats of others.

Thank you.

lovebug2140 · Oct 21, 2008, 03:34 PM

I think bisexuals are just really confused... I mean sure, they may like both sexes but they lean more toward one.. I think its just a phase.

Fr_Chuck · Oct 21, 2008, 03:44 PM

I believe the statement is pure bull, reminds me of the inmates I used to deal with that made up big talk using a lot of big words to impress people.

The fact is that before and still today many men are ashamed to admit they are gay, so they get married and live in the closet, and for some reason being bi is considered more socially acceptable or because they are having sex with both that would be the label.

But of course there are men and women who just enjoy sex of any type, with men, or with women, both and even in groups. There are a lot of sexual tastes and to try and deny that these people exist is as bigoted statement as a person who says a gay person can not really be gay, and need to be cured.

Synnen · Oct 21, 2008, 03:50 PM

Being bisexual myself (and a woman), I resent people telling me that I'm just "confused" about my sexuality. I mean, do YOU know what YOU are attracted to? Why shouldn't have have that same idea of what I am attracted to?

I think that people who are completely straight or completely gray just don't get how someone could be attracted to BOTH sexes. I love the cock... my husband is a great lover. But I love having another woman to play with too--and have had relationships with women in the past.

I fell in love with my husband, and chose to marry him, but that could as easily have fallen into me loving a woman and choosing to marry her. It honestly didn't matter to me which gender the person was--I was, and am, attracted to BOTH.

So---just because it confuses YOU that someone can be bisexual (by which I mean being able to be passionately and sexually attracted to BOTH sexes) doesn't mean that the people who ARE bisexual are confused.

I think, personally, it's the people that don't understand it that are "Just confused".

CuteKami782 · Oct 21, 2008, 04:42 PM

I really do not understand why the concept of loving more then one person is so hard. I am a bi-sexual woman and have no problems saying that. Is it a phase? Well let's see I'm 25 now and I realized I was bi at 16. Let's see ten years down the road will I still be bi? Yes. I personally think there is no confusion there. I don't feel confused. Being Bi or confused is 100% up to the individual. So basically if you haven't been in that situation to know what it feels like how can you say a bi person whether female or male is just outright confused?

cadillac59 · Oct 21, 2008, 04:45 PM

Originally Posted by Xrayman

precisely. You have never met a bisexual man over the age of 40.

guess what, I am!

I'm 41, happily married (to a wonderful woman) for the last 18 years, and I'm bisexual-definitely NOT GAY, or as you put it, confused.

PLEASE stop spreading YOUR unfounded and flawed theories here. Because you are a newbie, I have gracefully been as tactfull as I can be toward you, however I would appreciate it if you would NOT continue with this non-sensical debate. If however, you choose to persist, I will not respond further to any more of your posts on the subject.

I'm positive I know bucketloads MORE about this subject than you and I would very much like you to desist from forcing your opinions down the throats of others.

thank you.

I'd be the last person to try to tell you what you are or how you feel. That's for you to say and I respect that. Maybe you are the 1 in a million exception to what I've been saying. That's fine. But all I am saying is that bisexuality is not a stable sexual orientation as is heterosexuality and homosexuality and it can almost always be explained as confusion over definitions of sexual orientation or simple denial. A great number of gay men once identified themselves as "bisexual" only to come out later and drop that label and just accept that they are gay.

I was married for a while myself but I was always gay. I know that now but I never wanted to admit it. I have to also admit that I never claimed to be bisexual since I never found the female body arousing in the least. That I also knew.

I've met several formally married gay men and most of them claimed to be bisexual at one point or another; yet, once they came out of the closet, sex with women was forever a thing of the past.

cadillac59 · Oct 21, 2008, 04:52 PM

Originally Posted by Synnen

Being bisexual myself (and a woman), I resent people telling me that I'm just "confused" about my sexuality. I mean, do YOU know what YOU are attracted to? Why shouldn't have have that same idea of what I am attracted to?

I think that people who are completely straight or completely gray just don't get how someone could be attracted to BOTH sexes. I love the cock...my husband is a great lover. But I love having another woman to play with too--and have had relationships with women in the past.

I fell in love with my husband, and chose to marry him, but that could as easily have fallen into me loving a woman and choosing to marry her. It honestly didn't matter to me which gender the person was--I was, and am, attracted to BOTH.

So---just because it confuses YOU that someone can be bisexual (by which I mean being able to be passionately and sexually attracted to BOTH sexes) doesn't mean that the people who ARE bisexual are confused.

I think, personally, it's the people that dont' understand it that are "Just confused".

When I started this thread I was careful to point out that I was referring to claimed bisexuality in men only, not women. I have no opinion about whether bisexuality can exist in women. Maybe it can, I have no idea not being a woman myself.

Xrayman · Oct 21, 2008, 05:24 PM

It seems that you are quite comfortable with the fact that it MAY (as you put it, exist in women),

You also AS A MAN were married and living a lie/being bisexual/and as you put it , were "CONFUSED" because you were married yourself?? What are you on about?

You are contradicting yourself about the existence of bisexual behaviour in men-yet you yourself were acting in a bisexual fashion-so YOU WERE CONFUSED ABOUT YOUR SEXUALITY.

I and many others HERE are not.

Please note this will be my final post to you.

Cheers.

cadillac59 · Oct 21, 2008, 05:49 PM

Originally Posted by Xrayman

It seems that you are quite comfortable with the fact that it MAY (as you put it, exist in women),

You also AS A MAN were married and living a lie/being bisexual/and as you put it , were "CONFUSED" because you were married yourself???? what are you on about??

You are contradicting yourself about the existence of bisexual behaviour in men-yet you yourself were acting in a bisexual fashion-so YOU WERE CONFUSED ABOUT YOUR SEXUALITY.

I and many others HERE are not.

please note this will be my final post to you.

cheers.

Having sex with my wife didn't make me straight or bisexual. I was gay the whole time pretending to be someone I was not. I repressed who I really was due to societal pressures and expectations and because I wanted to be straight. That's all there was to that. After a while I decided how crazy it was to live a lie and I left my wife and came out as a gay man. It's a very common story and there are plenty of gay men out there who went through the same experience.

What I have never found is a man who truly believed himself once to be straight and then decided he was gay (gay men know they are gay from the beginning usually fairly early in life); and, I've never met one who claimed to once be gay and then decided he was straight. But there are several out there who once truly thought they were bisexual and then decided they were gay later on (those are a dime a dozen). This is one of the reasons I think bisexuality can be seen as a temporary transitional phase of sexual identity: a guy is gay from the beginning, suppresses that identity, has heterosexual experiences, others see him as straight as he himself, he knows he has same-sex attractions but tries to hind them and decides he's bisexual as a result only later to realize he was gay all along.

Fr_Chuck · Oct 21, 2008, 05:52 PM

So at no point did you ever enjoy or ever have any sexual desire for your wife ?

The idea of having sex with her was repulsive?

cadillac59 · Oct 21, 2008, 06:05 PM

Originally Posted by Fr_Chuck

so at no point did you ever enjoy or ever have any sexual desire for your wife ?

The idea of having sex with her was repulsive ??

Well, I can't say that I never enjoyed sex with her, only because sex is obviously pleasurable. But then while having sex with her I always thought about guys the whole time so it was kind of weird in that respect. I don't know if I would use the word "repulsive"in reflecting on sex with my wife-- I would certainly say that having sex with her now (or with any woman) would be repulsive to me (oral sex with any woman would be especially repulsive). After a while I got to where I never wanted to have sex with her at all and always made excuses and that led to an end to the marriage. It all was an unfortunate mistake. I'm sorry having put her through it really.

After leaving her and having my first real boyfriend (I mean other than quick encounters behind gay bars) I truly experienced love and it was really unbelieveable - amazing in fact, and I had never felt like that with a woman ever.

hollylovesbrandon · Oct 21, 2008, 06:06 PM

This thread is just offending me. The fact that people have such closed-minded things to say pisses me off. I know more than one bi-sexual male... truly bisexual. These men are men that you say don't exist. Well, they do. Regardless of what you may think, they do. I suggest you live with it because reality is nothing but that, reality. It's all around you.

cadillac59 · Oct 21, 2008, 07:25 PM

Originally Posted by hollylovesbrandon

this thread is just offending me. The fact that people have such closed-minded things to say pisses me off. I know more than one bi-sexual male...truly bisexual. These men are men that you say don't exist. Well, they do. Regardless of what you may think, they do. I suggest you live with it because reality is nothing but that, reality. It's all around you.

It's not being closed minded at all. All I am saying I suppose it that a vast number of these so-called bisexual men out there are really just gay men who for any number of reasons have sex with women (maybe they are trying to prove they are not gay for example) - that we know to be true- and how do you differentiate those from the supposedly "real" bisexual ones who you insist exist? All I am saying is that I don't think there are truly any bisexual males anywhere. Men who have sex in prison, for example, are just typically straight guys who go back to women once released. They're not bisexual but often confused as such.