[gromitt82]

Last September 14t, we Roman Catholics celebrated what we call The Exaltation of the Cross.

In that day's Gospel (Jn 3:13-17): Jesus said to Nicodemus, «No one has ever gone up to heaven except the one who came from heaven, the Son of Man. As Moses lifted up the serpent in the desert, so must the Son of Man be lifted up, so that whoever believes in him may have eternal life. Yes, God so loved the world that he gave his only Son that whoever believes in him may not be lost, but may have eternal life. God did not send the Son into the world to condemn the world; instead, through him the world is to be saved».

I just want to copy part of the commentary on this Gospel.

"Today, the Gospel is a prophecy, that is, a glance into the mirror of reality that plunges us in its truth, far beyond what our own senses tell us: the Cross, the Holy Cross of Jesus Christ is the Saviour's Throne. That is why Jesus asserts, «the Son of man must be lifted up» (Jn 3:14)"

I think we should all agree on the truth of these words: whoever believes in him may have eternal life:) :)

[gromitt82]

i don't know how a cross can be a throne. also, if someone you knew was killed with a knife, you wouldn't exalt a knife as an expression of that's person's meaning to you.

If you do not mind, Cog, let me remind you that here WE ARE NOT referring to someone being killed with a knife. WE ARE JUST REFERRING TO JESUS, THE SON OF GOD, WHO CHOSE TO DIE IN THAT CROSS PRECISELY TO REDEEM YOU AND ME... There is a "small" difference, don't you think so? :):)

[Fr_Chuck]

A reminder, This is not the religious discussion board, but the christianity board, posts that attack christian beliefs and faith are not permitted. While there are different beleifs within all faiths, those teachings that are against the basic teachings of christianity are not allowed.
This thread has been seriously cleaned up of such posts, and replies to such posts

[cogs]

I should have made myself more clear. I am a christian, I support christians. I accept jesus' sacrifice for our lives. In the links I gave (no longer here), the links speak against pagan religions that have intermeshed with christianity, and mock jesus and god, with a false mother/child religion, under the auspices of mary and the baby jesus. And to take a pagan symbol, a cross x, and overlay it on the death of jesus, as to make it seem holy, is making the point of jesus' death into a rite of idol worship. We should eject the pagan influences of christianity, but we can't see what they are without study.

[Tj3]

i should have made myself more clear. i am a christian, i support christians. i accept jesus' sacrifice for our lives. in the links i gave (no longer here), the links speak against pagan religions that have intermeshed with christianity, and mock jesus and god, with a false mother/child religion, under the auspices of mary and the baby jesus. and to take a pagan symbol, a cross x, and overlay it on the death of jesus, as to make it seem holy, is making the point of jesus' death into a rite of idol worship. we should eject the pagan influences of christianity, but we can't see what they are without study.

The cross has been a symbol of the death and resurrection of Jesus from the very start:

Phil 3:18-20
18 For many walk, of whom I have told you often, and now tell you even weeping, that they are the enemies of the cross of Christ: 19 whose end is destruction, whose god is their belly, and whose glory is in their shame--who set their mind on earthly things.
NKJV

Gal 5:11-12
11 And I, brethren, if I still preach circumcision, why do I still suffer persecution? Then the offense of the cross has ceased.
NKJV

[germain]

I believe everyone should read the bible and interpret what it means to be a Christian for themselves. Everything you need to do is in there. It doesn't say use the cross as my symbol.. man made that. It doesn't say ask forgiveness from a priest.. man made that. It doesn't say pray to Mary.. man made that. And by man I mean the church. The Vatican has clearly said that the pope is God in the flesh. It is written in their documents. Doesn't the bible call that blasphemy? All this stuff is made to promote their power. Religion is a personal thing. Follow the word of God as you see fit. It's about what YOU believe the word of God to be. Not what other men have set as guidelines for you.

[germain]

I take back the cross part lol.. now I remember even Jesus said take up your "cross" and follow me. The other stuff stands!

[cogs]

Stauros and xulon are the original words. Cross is a translation into english of these words. You can't be nailed to a cross, but to a tree, and/or plank.

[germain]

Word of God, scripture, bible, all the same stuff. Just thought Word of God sounded more pleasant to the reader :)

[Tj3]

I believe everyone should read the bible and interpret what it means to be a Christian for themselves.

We should allow the Bible to interpret itself - otherwise we end up with conflicting interpretations. Scripture itself says that men are not to interpret it.

It doesn't say use the cross as my symbol.. man made that.

As I showed, the cross is used throughout the NT as a symbol of the gospel.

It doesn't say ask forgiveness from a priest.. man made that.

Absolutely right. In fact in the NT we see that the priesthood was done away with.

It doesn't say pray to Mary.. man made that.

Quite true. Scripture condemns communication with the dead.

The Vatican has clearly said that the pope is God in the flesh. It is written in their documents.

Now I am not a Catholic, but I am very familiar with Catholicism, and I have not seen that. Could you provide a reference?

[germain]

I hope this does it for you Tj3

“The Pope is not only the representative of Jesus Christ, but he is Jesus Christ, Himself, hidden under the veil of human flesh.” — Catholic National, July 1895.

“The Pope and God are the same, so he has all power in Heaven and earth.” — Pope Pius V, quoted in Barclay, Chapter XXVII, p. 218, “Cities Petrus Bertanous.”

“We hold upon this earth the place of God almighty.” — Pope Leo XIII, Encyclical Letter, June 20, 1894.


I am sorry to any catholics/christians out there who read what I am about to say (keep in mind I am a catholic)

[gromitt82]

I am also a Roman Catholic, and I entirely disagree with the 2 first quotes. As for Leo XIII, what he says has more sense, in my opinion, although it can be also argued.

The history of Christianity is unfortnately full of Popes that probably were closer to the antithesis of GOD than anything else. Others, instead have been clear instances of what a true representative of GOD should be down here. But be what it may a Pope is just a man that, as Pope John XXIII told us when he was in Barcelona, "is full of defects and should be GOD's humblest servant..."

I think calling the Vatican the anti-christ is a little far-fetched. I agree, though, many things could be done better. But the wonderful thing, in my opinion, is that, despite all these defects and failures, Christianity has been growing all the time. GOD's intercession should have something to do with it, don't you think?

[Fr_Chuck]

Warning one can give their opinion of Gospel and the such, name calling of certain denominations will not be allowed and can cuase the person to be banned for such name calling

[gromitt82]

Warning one can give thier opinion of Gospel and the such, name calling of certain denominations will not be allowed and can cuase the person to be banned for such name calling

I do not know whether you are referring to me or to somebody else; but, should you be referring to one of my last posts I would very much appreciate if you could point out where I may have unproperly proceeded, so that I can apologize accordingly. I try always to be as careful as possible, but I cannot discard that I may have eventually failed to do so inadvertently. Thank you very much

[NeedKarma]

Gromitt, it wasn't you, it was germain.

[gromitt82]

gromitt, it wasn't you, it was germain.

Thank you for clarifying!

[Fr_Chuck]

Yes, he attacked those of the Catholic Faith

[Fr_Chuck]

Well obviously some people never learn, germain has been banned for short period.

[gromitt82]

well obviously some people never learn, germain has been banned for short period.

I'm sorry to hear that but I guess sometimes there is no other solution to teach manners but to have recourse to some kind of punishment. Hope he/she will eventually learn!