[Alder]

Holy crap she's even been deleted from the member's list!

[spyderglass]

Hmm. Let me try Askshar.com-that's weird. Maybe she did something bad on another post?

[spyderglass]

Spiritual guidance website.

[Mokrie]

Kylezazu--I wish to extend my apology as my answer to you was condecending and thoughtless. Yes much of our fiction and mythology has it's basis in fact and often truth even though most people would never admit it as that's too frightening for them to handle. The thing to remember is any evil feeds on fear. If we can conquer our fear we can face down anything and win.

[kylezazu]

Im sorry if I came off strong on the subject. Its just that I have seen these creatures up close and personal. Ive woken up on several occations to them hovering over me or sevewral standing around me. They whisper in strange words that terrify me, I'm actually looking into it to see if it has anything to do with tounges from christianity. But the thing is they actually make it so you can't move. Scientist have tried to say that it is sleep paralysis. I don't by that being asleep and having something feel likeit is sitting on your chest is not the same thing. My girlfreind has even started saying she's been having weird ecounters similar to mine since we started dating. She really freaked me out when she told me soemthing was freezing her and making her terrified as it spoke in a strange language.

[kylezazu]

Also as to the movies... I believe that humans are really tapped out in the creation department. I don't think that there creations are based off there own ideas anymore. SO many culktures speak of creatures so similar its scary. Vampires for example were spoken of legends in europe before they ever crossed the seas. At the same time legends of Camoratz the Bat God was spoken in central america by the mayans. Its just my belief that everything in the fairy tales does have a spec of truth to them, even if its not the same thing there is something to base it off. I truly believe these shadow people are evil. And no I won't say it to Michaels face I respect him too much. Uriel, the ark angel of death who I think is the grim reaper legend on the other hand I'm not so sure about. Im starting to theorize that these shadow people may have something to do with him.

[kylezazu]

I know this may sound strange but do you guys know of nephilim, if not I will explain. They angel came down to earth and mated with females (genesis 6:4) great hers and creatures were born known as the nephilim. IF the grim reeper steriotype is true about uriel, wouldn't the shadow people fit the picture of the sons and daughters of uriel. Just a thought... In the bible it says God destroyed the nephilim with the flood, who's to say more nephilim were not conceived. And if they were evil then, they might still be evil.

[kylezazu]

Sorry this is just my approach to explaining these creatures. Sorry if I am offending anyone by speaking my christian views.

[Mokrie]

Kylezazu, If you were raised christian then of course everything you experience will be viewed from a christian viewpoint. From what you describe with the weight on your chest it sounds like vampires. Not the movie Dracula but the in between worlds type that drain the living of energy in order to maintain their existence. Believe it or not they usually are not evil though they can scare the bejeebers out of you. Most offten they are deceased relatives or friends that don't want to leave the world and people they love or care about. They have no clue that they are causing harm they only know they feel better after being near you. Since they work on a psychic level and not a human level you can repel them with your mind by being honest and telling them you care about their well being and want them to go where they will never have to be alone or afraid again. That you wish them happiness and that they are causing you harm even though they don't mean to. This actually happens to many more people then you imagine and often within 6 months of a family or friends death. The fact that they appear as shadows or dark figures is also nothing to be frightened by. It, sort of like looking at an old photograph negative. Everything in the photo that was white looks black and everything that was black looks white. If we were to enter their realm they would be in living color and live people would look like shadows to us. It's just a matter of perspective. Try talking to them in a friendly caring way and you can do this in your mind if your unable to speak out loud. What the heck it's worth a try. Oh and if it is an entity that is fond of you it will also go to see your girlfriend out of courtesy.

[kylezazu]

I understqand what you are saying but forgive me if I'm skeptical of it. I really don't think they are human spirits. I really do believe in a fine line between white and black... between good and evil. These things know what they are doing, and they are not any friends of mine. On a dream level I run from them, in a physical level I am terrifed. I don't quite believe in vampire magic as in the movies dracula. I believe in vampires on a biological approach such as it being a strange strain of the zombie virus or other ideas like that. I do believe in the supernatural though.

[Alder]

To jump back into the conversation...

Kyle have you tried any means to keep these creatures at bay? I would assume you would prefer something from your faith tradition--crosses, blessings, holy water maybe? (BTW I was raised Catholic, and still am, albeit with a lot of other stuff thrown in that most people would probably say is incompatible). If so, how did it work?

If you are willing to step outside the strictly Christian tradition, we could discuss doing some shamanic work around this. Shamanism technically doesn't belong to any religion, any more than medicine or music.

I've never been too sure what a vampire is myself. I tend to use the term "vampirism" more, meaning the act of feeding off someone else's energy or life. There are living human beings who do that, either trained in some magical art or simply doing it unconsciously (ever met someone like that, who just drains everyone around them?). And I could certainly see how the spirit of a deceased human could engage in that behavior, as Mokrie describes. Once I was helping a couple of child ghosts, and discovered they were being kept in a state of fear and pain by some other creature (did I mention this in an earlier post? Sorry if I'm repeating myself) that was a real dark nasty thing. I didn't think it was or had ever been human, but then, I didn't stop to ask it. It was all I could do to keep it from attacking me.

Weird you should mention the nephilim. I was thinking about them just the other day. You see, I have some past life memories, going back quite a long way to a time when I was one of a group of people who lived in a dimension parallel to earth. We left our home as the gateway between it and earth was closing, and have dwelt here ever since. It was hard for us to explain to primitive humans about the multi-dimensional gateway thing. We just used the analogy of it being like an island that sank under the sea. But, yes, back in the day we were both very powerful and very arrogant, and meddled with the earth beings as we saw fit. And since coming here we've migrated all over this planet, into every human culture. So by this point, everyone alive is of the nephilim to some extent. You all have a little of the Old Blood, the DNA and the mitochondria and a sliver of the Light of "the ones who came from there" (as we call ourselves).

I know what I just said may not jive with your beliefs (and may even make you think I'm straight nuts). But it is weird that I was thinking of that verse from Genesis just yesterday, and then you mentioned it like that. In my way of life, synchronicities like that mean something. Although it can be a trick figuring out what.

And I suppose it is only fair to disclose to the folks who are participating in this discussion that I don't consider myself entirely human. I believe the term usually used on the internet is "otherkin." So it is fair for you to ask, if it came down to conflict between shadow people and humans, where would my own allegiance lie? If it turned out that they are beings on a different level of reality, just impacting earth's level enough to cast a shadow here, and they did turn out to be my distant kin--the ones who stayed behind when the gateway closed, well...

[kylezazu]

Once again... there pure evil and yes I know the difference. I dotn understand what you were saying but its fine that's not really relevant. I think you were speaking for psychic vampires... I'm not stupid, I know a lot of things I've never learned if that makes any sense. I believe the gift is called the gift of knowing or soemthign like that among the gifts of the spirit in the bible (not sure if you are familiar with them) As to what you were saying about your faith a mix of different religons I kind of know what you mean I believe every religon is connected like a certain theory I'm making concerning the Greek Gods as actually fallen or other typews of angels. Similarties such as Ezequal the fallen angel who gave the gift of predicting weather to humans to zues the god of the sky or Boreas the god of wind. Or even Atlas and Azriel, or even kronos and uriel. They all share very similar characteristics. Anyway I haven't quite seen shadow people lately but when I saw them frequently I did try crosses and holy water and what not even protection spells (if they even worked) didn't do me much good. Im concerned that some dof the reports I get from other people who see them, report seeing them as very close to human shape standing aroudn them, as if they are doing something. Im concerned that they are in fact doing something in ritual sense or something else. I'm concerned they might be plannings omethign bigger then we know. This might sound a little parnoid but... The mayan callender so far has predicted 3 of there 4 great changes corectly. And the final one is coming up. Now with the elections of who I presonaly will think become the antichrist coming up I don't know. Something is going on. I just know what. Any imput?

[spyderglass]

I saw them when I was a child an 'innocent' and I never feared them. Maybe they feed off fear? If they are here to get things ready, then they have been getting things ready for 20 years. The Mayans believed that everything happens in cycles, circles. They believed that 'the end of the world' had happened before, and would happen again when the stars were in the correct alignment. Maybe there will be a disaster in 2012, maybe the shadow people are harbingers of a disaster like the Mothman. I don't think anyone knows for sure, that is why Alder started this thread, to see what these shadow-people are all about. Maybe the only reason I see them as a fact of life is because they have always been a part of mine. Maybe they are afraid of YOU for some reason, and that's why you have been singled out. Have you ever tried just ignoring them? Until you stop seeing them?

[kylezazu]

If by ignore you mean pull the covers over my head yeah I've tried that they just stand there sometimes staring at me. I know this is probably irrevlevent but my friend who has been having major contact with these creatures and describes them the same way I do just happens to have the exact birthday as me down to the last hour. Don't think its relevant just thought id add it. Circles 4 circles, this is the final one of the mayan callender, and each for there circles has predicted some great change or disaster in how the earth worked. Ive read all the throys from... hell alien invasions to changes in the earths electrical current and gravitational pull from the two poles. Everyone's predicted something and what ever its been has been in the planning for a lot longer then 20 years. We are at a major life changing event in the next few years. Whether it's the rise of the antichrist or the collapse of earths gravity, hell for all we know it could be the end of are sun (not likely) eternal eclipse mabe. For example if the earths gravitational pull would for some reason alter the moons path say to stationary it could put us in some type of eternal eclipse blocking out the sun. Just mixing a fewe theorys anyway I'm sorry that is not the point. THE PO

[kylezazu]

Int is that these shadow people I believe may have a significant role if not the casuers then something they are evil I intend to find out what they want. Hey alder I know you have been asked this before, but what's an inner animal spirit?

[Mokrie]

They say if you look into the darkness long enough it will start to look back. There is always the possibility that the more we fear evil the more we have the ability to give it form. If you don't think of any entity as evil it just may change it's actions or your perception of it will change.

[Alder]

int is that these shadow people i believe may have a significant role if not the casuers then something they are evil i intend to find out what they want. Hey alder i know you have been asked this befor, but whats an inner animal spirit?

I wouldn't claim to be an authority on the subject of evil, Kyle, so I don't know whether these beings are evil. I can only look at my own life, and the times I have caused harm by acting out of rage or fear or pain or foolish pride. That is evil. My own sense of the shadow people was an alien-ness, not anything malignant. And then there's Spyderglass, who says that to her they seem neither malignant or alien. While I think they are somehow connected to the changes I sense taking place in our world, Mokrie does not see that correlation. I live in a multi-dimensional enough universe that I don't require one right answer.

I do not discount the paralysis experience you describe when they have been near you. Other people have reported the same, although there are plenty of people who have seen or even touched them who did not. As I mentioned in an earlier post, I felt a little of that same thing one time when I was close to them. But I cannot conclude from this that they are evil. Some people are allergic to the dander of cats, others aren't. I wouldn't say that makes cats evil (though they have been accused of evil and witchcraft more than once in our history). I have yet to conclude the shadow beings are doing this to hurt you. It may simply be a side effect of their presence to which you are more sensitive than some.

April also mentioned she had felt they were attacking her, but as she described it further, it sounded like it may have been their possibly ham handed attempt to communicate.

Well, that's why I want to investigate them. I want to know what they want, what they are doing. Are they trying to influence the human universe, and if so, is it an influence I would support or oppose? Ideally we will find someone who knows how to talk to them, or learn to communicate with them ourselves.

But for me, I equate evil with selfishly causing harm. People like Bush are too quick to call others evil. Evil is when a free-willed being chooses to act in a way that denies the connection that being shares with all beings, everywhere. A cougar that attacks a jogger is not denying the Oneness of being, quite the opposite! But that doesn't mean I sprinkle Adolph's on my body and go jogging in cougar country. Some things are dangerous and need to be treated with respect. But evil, well, until I've walked a mile in their robes and fedoras, I don't know that I can say. I judge spirits by the content of their character, not the color of their ectoplasm. ;)

Sorry, Kyle. I have a tricksterish sense of humor. But that does not mean I belittle your ideas. Nothing could be further. I can see you have considered these issues carefully and thought about them deeply. A voice of caution like yours is helpful. If we do learn to communicate and cooperate with these beings, it's good to remember these kind of cautions; to stop and check ourselves and see whether we are being tricked or co-opted into doing something with an ultimate goal (or a means) that is unsound.

Oh, you asked about power animals. Power animals are a kind of guardian angel that takes animal form for some reason. In many cultures all around the world, when someone enters a shamanic trance (by drumming, fasting, taking sweat, ingesting entheogenic herbs, or some other means), they encounter this kind of animal companion to help and guide them.

[spyderglass]

I think that when you give something power, or call it evil. That is what it becomes to you. The only reason I disagree with you is because I have never had bad experiences like you have. That doesn't mean that you are wrong, or that I am wrong. I just think that you have to have good to have evil-and the other way around. The brighter the flame the blacker the shadow.

[kylezazu]

Look I'm not going to argue good or evil anymore with you guys it's a go no where conversation. (not trying to sound mean ro anything it just is) Anyway my belief is that they are evil, or perhaps possible we are talking of two different beings. A non poisonous snake and a poisinous snake are very much different, no matter hwo much they look the same. The creatures I have seen are evil.

For the advance in research my encounters with them have had other effects I just remember from years ago. They can some how make me enter rem almost immediately after I shut my eyes. They have some how entered my dreams. This might sound crazy but when I dream I have been known to be able to wake up in my fdream and countiously make choices while dreaming. They have been there chasing me. Im sorry but I feel they are evil and are here for an evil purpose. My friend and I really believe they are dmeons or some oither evil being. I found a story I wrote when I was little that talks of dark angels coming in from other demensions and messing with this reality trying to spread there evil. This is very similar. So everyone knows I write about things I see. I wrote stroies about apociliptic bible versus when I was little before I ever really understood thing sdaid in church. Its weird but I really feel that these creatures if not demons are some otehrsort of evil from either are reality or another but they really are evil, this will be my last post of this topic of whether they are good or evil. I check in time to time with my views and to see others.

[Mokrie]

Ok, I always like playing devils advocate. If we think about it there are human serial killers. There are psychopaths. There are sociopaths that are unable to feel empathy, pity or guilt. If the human realm has such beings then it is entirely possible that other worlds or dimensions has the equivalent. With this in mind it is then entirely possible that evil in these contexts exists there. If they cross over to here they may be responsible for the fear of demons or creatures of nightmares. Their brothers that look just like them may be benign or friendly but once humans encounter the bad ones they are all painted with the same brush. How'm I dooin?