[albear]

maybe because the USA is highly religious and they see it as a sin against god that's why they don't have it, I mean I'm supprised there is even one state that allows it, oh you don't fly out at the last minute you fly out wel in advance

[In Sorrow]

Not everyone dies as horribly as you think and describe. My father died between breaths at a church meeting, and after dessert too! His mother had died peacefully in her sleep. My father's brother died peacefully during a morning nap. My aunt (who had ALS--Lou Gehrig's disease) had trouble breathing toward the end, but there was no gasping or death rattle. I actually look forward to dying--another adventure.

Well my mother did, the Day she was dying, I received a phone call at work saying she was taken to the " ICU " Room at the hospital because she was having problems breathing.
When I went to see her after I left work, she was on some machine taped to her mouth, her hands were ice cold, but her face was still warm. She looked like she was very uncomfortable and in pain, although she was unconscious she could not express herself but that does not mean she did not feel anything. I know the week before that she was in great pain as I was there and she was telling how sick she felt and how much pain she was in. Well that night 3 hours after I left the ICU, she Died. It was a horrible experience for me. I even watched my Cat die, many years back he had Feline Lukemhemia and he was gasping for breath as he was dying and his eyes were all glossy and just staring into space. My experiences with Death have been horrible, with my family and pet. Also it is known that when people are dying they get " Dyspena " which is difficult breathing and very painful at that, then towards the end when they are taking their last breaths they do the " Death Rattle ". It is just awlful what we have to go trough when we are leaving this world. I don't mind leaving, but I want to leave in Peace and tranquality, not in suffering.

[Wondergirl]

maybe because the USA is highly religeous and they see it as a sin against god thats why they dont have it

That's not why active euthenasia is illegal. Passive euthenasia is legal though.

[Wondergirl]

Also it is known that when people are dying they get " Dyspena " which is difficult breathing and very painful at that, then towards the end when they are taking their last breaths they do the " Death Rattle ". It is just awlful what we have to go trough when we are leaving this world. I don't mind leaving, but i want to leave in Peace and tranquality, not in suffering.

Only some do. Perhaps there's a low pain threshold in your family? And why did you allow your cat to suffer? Your family could have done something about that.

[In Sorrow]

maybe because the USA is highly religeous and they see it as a sin against god thats why they dont have it, i mean im supprised there is even one state that allows it, oh you dont fly out at the last minute you fly out wel in advance

Yes there is one State that I believe it is legal here in the USA and that is in the State of Oregon, but that is the only State I heard of so far. The USA considers it Suicide or Assisted Suicide, that is why they don't allow it. But animals are allowed to be put painlessly to sleep, so they don't suffer. I Should think that Humanity should get the same treatment , as I would rather be put to sleep that to die from lack of air, suffocation. :eek:

[In Sorrow]

Only some do. Perhaps there's a low pain threshold in your family? And why did you allow your cat to suffer? Your family could have done something about that.

Actually when my Cat Died my Father had just passed away one week ago, and my mother and myself was in a very bad state of mind. My Cat I had taken to the Vet a few weeks ago, he told me that Cats maybe can through it off, not like people. So I paid the vet 575.00 just to help save my cat, actually Felix my cat belonged to myself and my Father
But you are right, that cat should have been put to sleep. We put our first cat to sleep Smokey who had developed Feline Luhkemia also. That was a very hard time for myself and my mother, when my Dad passed, then right after I lost my cat.

Well my mother had her Leg amputated from Gangerne, that is painful in itself. She was a Diabetic and was on Dialysis for failing kidneys, But no one in my family either on my mothers side or fathers side died peacefully. Actually even the ones who die in their sleep we don't know what they feel, as even people in Coma's can feel pain, just because they cannot express it does not mean they are peaceful. Actually I don't think there is any peaceful way to leave this world. Except if we are put to sleep like the animals are.

[firmbeliever]

In Sorrow,
Sorry to hear about your losses.

I agree with wondergirl, you have a lot of unresolved issues,concerning your losses and the information you seem to have acquired regarding death.
Death is different for different people,not everyone is struggling for breathe as they die,not everyone suffers during death,and we as onlookers seeing our loved ones dies maybe more painful to us than to the person dying.

Regarding your fear of the "death rattle" as you keep mentioning,you need professional help.

[In Sorrow]

In Sorrow,
Sorry to hear about your losses.

I agree with wondergirl, you have a lot of unresolved issues,concerning your losses and the information you seem to have acquired regarding death.
Death is different for different people,not everyone is struggling for breathe as they die,not everyone suffers during death,and we as onlookers seeing our loved ones dies maybe more painful to us than to the person dying.

Regarding your fear of the "death rattle" as you keep mentioning,you need professional help.

I Believe I do need professional help, because it is stoping me from living my life, I am waking up with my heart racing in my chest, at night I don't sleep, and I am even fearful at work, It is interfering with my quality of life. Yes I need to find a good support group perhaps or some Bereavement counseling, but I just don't know where to look . Actually to remove the fear of the Dying process, is hard because since we cannot stop it, the fear is only more real as each day passes, and I am terrified to inherit my mother's illness or just to die of Suffocation.

[firmbeliever]

In Sorrow,
Support groups are not that hard to find if you prefer the web support groups like these-
Lightning Strike Pet Loss Support :: Death of Pet, Sick Pet, Pet Loss Grief, Message Board, Chat Room
Grief Support Groups, Resources, Coping with Grief, Dealing with Death. H.O.P.E. Unit, Los Angeles California


According to the following article,you maybe just experiencing part of the grieving process.
---------------------
UCB: Responding to Death: Grief and Loss
II. Stages of Grief

Within the first few weeks to months after a death, you may find yourself riding on a roller coaster of shifting emotions. Most people go through these stages not in linear steps, but in unpredictable waves-- moving through one stage to the next and sometimes shifting back. Some people will also experience certain phases but not others. Here are several common, typical grief reactions:

* SHOCK/DISBELIEF
This is the numbing, disorienting sense that the death has not really happened, not really occurred. This reaction can be intensified and complicated if the death is sudden, violent, or unanticipated. Your mind may be telling you "there must be some mistake," or "this can't be true." These symptoms typically last from several hours to several days.

* ANGER
Your anger may be targeted at a number of sources. You may feel waves of anger at the doctors who treated your loved one, anger at your family members for not rallying together, anger at God over what seems senseless or unjust, even anger at yourself or the person who died and "left" you.

* GUILT
You may blame yourself for not doing more, not being there enough, or not being there when the death happened. You may feel regret over "unfinished business" -- conflicts you and the deceased never resolved, or feelings between the two of you that were never fully discussed or shared.

* SADNESS
You may experience a deep sense of loss. There may be moments when you find yourself at a loss for words, weeping, or bursting uncontrollably into tears.

* FEAR
There may be anxiety or panic; fears about carrying on, fears about the future. If the person who died was an adult (partner, sibling, parent), it may bring up fears about your own sense of mortality or sense of being left behind.
* DEPRESSION
You may go through periods of melancholy, or "blueness," where you feel inclined to withdraw or isolate yourself. You may lose interest in your usual activities, or feel helpless or hopeless.
-------------------------------

[Credendovidis]

No i don't care about the moral's of the USA, when a person is dying or suffering do you think they care about morals ?

I did not ask you if you cared about that or not. I stated that the real problem at your side is the USA moral, ethical, and political views, and not the dying process itself. Weekly I see people dying, but most of the time their suffering is mainly from fear for dying, and not caused by pain (pain can be taken to an extreme low level by medicines).

No the problem is when someone is dying and on their death bed, you don't have the physical strength to just pick yourself up and fly to another country, besides it all costs money, and many insurances do not pay for that.

Here you just make some phone calls, are interviewed by a psychiater and a lawyer, and you can make - if approved - an arrangement with a medical specialist in euthanasia on date and time. At home even, if you prefer (and most do that).

Besides i am dealing with the USA because i live hear, i wish the USA had the same thinking as Europe does, as when a person is dying they should be made as comfortable as possible, I mean it is their dignity we are talking about, they are dying anyway so why not go out peaceful. Maybe perhaps i would have to move to the State of Oregon before that situation arrives, because things like that we cannot wait for the last minuet.

If you have a problem with the fear of dying by people (the topic here) , than address the cause of that fear. I can not help that that is - in your case - caused by the USA mindset. Just start doing something about it !

Do you think that in Europe these changes in law did introduce themselves? Years of pressure were required before governments started to listen to the demands. Again : start doing something about it !

Of course I realize that this does not solve the problem of your present feelings due to recent losses.
I wish you strength in coming to terms with your feelings !

:)

[Choux]

If you don't die a quick death, the very best way to go, then you will be lying down and gradually stopping breathing. Medical science will make your death painless. Don't fight it, just let go.

Just relax and let go, as the oxygen in your blood decreases more and more, you will have an altered state of mind and then, slip away quietly into nothingness. Peaceful.

[Credendovidis]

Hello Mary Sue !

The problem here seems to be multiple : one is about getting to terms with recent losses.
Another one is about the facilities open to the dying for euthanasia.
Again another is about the lack of such facilities due to the local ethical and political views.

I am glad to live here, and be able to control - if necessary - when and how I will die, if there ever will be a need for that.

:)

[Credendovidis]

Post #5 : progunr disagrees: "If you really read her post, you would know that her fear is not of the afterlife, it is of the dying process itself".

In my reply I clearly stated that in my activities as unpaid volunteer compagnion and attendant in a local hospes, I meet many people at the end of their life. The strange thing is that the more religious people are, the higher their fear is for death. Not for death as a physical act, but for what happens after death.

So I referred to and addressed the actual dying process. But my findings as a specialist in these matters are that it is NOT the physical dying process that produces the fear of dying for most people. That fear is caused by the consequences of years of religious brain washing and inducing that fear to force believers to follow the suggested religious lines.

If progunr has a problem with my findings - findings that are based on actual working in a hospes, and clearly against his/her religious views - than he/she should address that. Not by rating my post negatively.

:)

[In Sorrow]

If you don't die a quick death, the very best way to go, then you will be lying down and gradually stopping breathing. Medical science will make your death painless. Don't fight it, just let go.

Just relax and let go, as the oxygen in your blood decreases more and more, you will have an altered state of mind and then, slip away quietly into nothingness. Peaceful.

Ah I wish it were that easy, but its not, I watched my mother and her breathing difficulties were very bad, you see when you are dying your Respitatory system shuts down, and yes you get what we call " Dyspena " labored breathing and gasping for air, which causes later on the " Death Rattle " which is most heard from people in the dying process.

[tsalagi7]

Ok we all know we have to Die someday, there is no if's an's or buts about it. But there is an Actual " Fear " of the Physical Aspect of the Dying Process. I am not afraid of Death itself per-say, but just the fact of Dying in pain, struggling for my last Breath, Labored Breathing which is very painful and uncomfortable, and that horrible " Death Rattle " that we do upon death.

Now knowing that we all have to die someday does not remove the " Fear " of The dying process, actually it only increases it, knowing that we all must die. I am 47 years old and i see that Death is coming closer and closer, and i just watched my mother die of a horrible sickness that i am afraid to get.

Now is there anyway that one can die a Peaceful and Painless Death without doing that Death Rattle and struggling for breath, that thought just terrifies me ? :eek: :confused:

I am so sorry for all that you've been through, but your mothers fate, as sad as it was is not yours from the day we are born we are also dying there can be beauty in both remember the body dies the spirit lives on:)

[Credendovidis]

Ah i wish it were that easy, but its not, i watched my mother and her breathing difficulties were very bad, you see when you are dying your Respitatory system shuts down, and yes you get what we call " Dyspena " labored breathing and gasping for air, which causes later on the " Death Rattle " which is most heard from people in the dying process.

I understand your feelings and sympathize with them, but the question remains : why did your mother had to go through this all? Why did nobody assist to end it before getting to this situation? Was it her wish to go to the bitter end? Or was it that no such facilities were available?

:)

[In Sorrow]

Assisted Dying is not allowed hear in NY, we were not even allowed to take her home, they kept her against our will, because she was a Dialysis patient and needed her treatments 3 times a week. When her breathing became labored they took her to the ICU room, the fact is before she was taken to the ICU Room she already had trouble breathing at that point she was already suffering as she developed Resipatory failure, so all they could do was take her too the ICU Room and monitor her condition, until she finally passed on three hours after I left. When I saw her she was as cold as ice, her hands and her arms, were already turning a dark color, I knew she was dying, she was unconscious and did not even know I was there, but I was crying so much even if she woke up I probably would not have been much comfort to her. She had her leg amputated due to developing Gangerne, that is when her condition became much worse, then it all started to go downhill from there.

[Credendovidis]

Assisted Dying is not allowed here in NY...

Yes, that says it all. And it shows the religious-ethical-political component that prevents people from living (and dying) the way they would select if they were free to decide for that themselves.

There are two approaches for you to react to this for your so horrible experience :

- learn to resign to the present general line of thought - that as human being you have no influence on the way you (have to) depart.
- start campaigning against that line of thought : become an advocate of euthanasia (within whatever level
- of restriction). This in memory of your mother and to prevent others to have to go through the same "hell".

I am sure the first alternative is the least demanding, though certainly not the most satisfying.

I wish you much strength in the process of coping with this experience.

:)

[In Sorrow]

Yes, that says it all. And it shows the religious-ethical-political component that prevents people from living (and dying) the way they would select if they were free to decide for that themselves.

There are two approaches for you to react to this for your so horrible experience :

- learn to resign to the present general line of thought - that as human being you have no influence on the way you (have to) depart.
- start campaigning against that line of thought : become an advocate of euthanasia (within whatever level
- of restriction). This in memory of your mother and to prevent others to have to go through the same "hell".

I am sure the first alternative is the least demanding, though certainly not the most satisfying.

I wish you much strenght in the process of coping with this experience.

:)

Yes you are absolutely right, as a human being we have no control over the way we die, that is what makes the " Fear " even more real, because I can't control it. So since I know what to expect I am terrified of it, it's like a prisoner on death row, he know he is going to be executed he can't control it, but deep inside the Fear is very real and it cannot controlled

Also me being an " Advocate of Euthanasia " would be great I am all for it, but it would take a lot more than just me saying this law needs to be past, even if I can start an entire rally in favor for it, the Stupid USA government sees it as Suicide, so they would not even pass that law. The only sure way would be if was to move to the State of Oregon, and hopefully by that time they will still be practicing it.

[albear]

Yes you are absolutely right, as a human being we have no control over the way we die, that is what makes the " Fear " even more real, because i can't control it. So since i know what to expect i am terrified of it, it's like a prisoner on death row, he know he is going to be executed he can't control it, but deep inside the Fear is very real and it cannot controlled

Also me being an " Advocate of Euthanasia " would be great i am all for it, but it would take alot more than just me saying this law needs to be past, even if i can start an entire rally in favor for it, the Stupid USA government sees it as Suicide, so they would not even pass that law. The only sure way would be if was to move to the State of Oregon, and hopefully by that time they will still be practicing it.

I disagree I think that we can control how we die, up to a certain point, yes there are more... horrible ways to die, and a lot of unexpected ones, but if we get to the point where we can feel that our time is soon then we can choose how we end it, carry on down the path of nature or end it by our own means, it's the unexpected ones that catch us off guard, but what I'm getting from you is that you want to be able to kill yourself legally (tell me if I'm wrog), but really it would be taking a life and that's murder and although many criminals would hope they change it from being against the law am afraid I just don't see that happening.