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tomder55 · Aug 4, 2008, 08:54 AM

Even though Evita has said she does not want a symbolic roll call vote on the Convention floor ;her supporters are still planning on going to the convention to challenge "the one" .

They will not make the case that he bought the nomination by outspending Evita in caucus states and red states he most likely will lose in the general election. Instead their current strategery seems to be charging BO with buying the Super Delegates. The charge is that Congressional Super Delegates sold their support to him for contributions from his Hope Fund PAC .

Hope Fund donated $710,900 to superdelegates, more than three times as much as Hillpac. ($236,100).

In many cases Super Delegates threw their support to Obama even though their districts clearly supported Evita. Example ; Jason Altmire of Pa, in a district that Evita won by nearly 2 to 1 picked Obama Obama PAC gave Altmire $10,000 and Evita's Hilpac gave him zero.

There are similar examples in California, Ohio, Indiana etc... more here :
YouTube - Money Changes Everything :: Superdelegates Are For Sale

Evita got 18 million primary votes. As much as Obamanation and the DNC leadership would like it ;they are not going away ;"getting over it" quietly.

This month should be a blast !

George_1950 · Aug 4, 2008, 10:14 AM

On June 7, 2008, "Hillary Rodham Clinton suspended her pioneering campaign for the presidency on Saturday and summoned supporters to use "our energy, our passion, our strength" to put Barack Obama in the White House." Hillary Clinton Concession Speech: Suspends Campaign, Endorses Obama
Things have been a bit boring, other than admiring Obama's solo flip-flops.

tomder55 · Aug 4, 2008, 10:46 AM

Yes I realize that Evita has made the necessary political moves to continue here career as a viable contender for the Democrat candidate in the future. However ;I was addressing her rabid supporters who have not given up hope that the convention or the designate could explode .

They are the ones chanting No Bama and threatening to bolt and support McCain. I'm just doing my part to encourage them and egg them on.

However it is worth further examination by the FEC to see if his donations were within the campaign finance laws.

spitvenom · Aug 4, 2008, 11:12 AM

I was thinking say Obama Loses the election in November and it is because of "PUMA". What really makes them think that when Evita (I love that name Tom) runs in the 2012 Primary that the 18 million or so Obama supporters are going to vote for her? I mean aren't they shooting themselves in the foot with this crying.

tomder55 · Aug 4, 2008, 11:23 AM

Good question . The factions of the Democrat party are pretty strained right now with each group thinking they are entitled and it's their time. The traditional Dems may also bolt because of the growing influence of the MoveOn Soros /Hufpo take over of the party (we bought it we own it) .

That is why McCain is such a compelling candidate . He is a safe alternative to none of the above . (that's why the Republicans reluctantly picked him ). If the election continues to be a referendum on Obama then McCain's snowball has a chance of surviving .

BABRAM · Aug 4, 2008, 03:03 PM

McCain's an alternative to coherent balance that we currently need in place, a pendulum swing, not that the Democrats are endless solutions by no means. The Clinton's better hope that Obama wins this election or their political careers are cooked. A nation filled with first time voters will give up on American poltics. We then would more than likely lose a whole generation. As for the subject, if Hillary's loose canon combatants want to charge that Super Delegates were bribed then they better be prepared for defamation counter charges. I know who ends up winning that judgment.

purplewings · Aug 4, 2008, 03:36 PM

After reading the massive number of both Democrat and Republican indicted senators, governors and other 'ranking' politicians, I've begun to think it doesn't even matter who we vote for. It's all been preset to keep the same bloodlines in public office, and short of a revolt, there is nothing we can do about it. They're pretty much all in it for the money. Cheney and Obama are 8th cousins and it seems Bush and Obama are 11th cousins. It's all part of the original plan from the first century that Royal blood marries Royal blood and maintains control everywhere and forever. I think all Royal blood means is people with wealth - and they do try to keep it in the family. 'Curbing the money power was one of Woodrow Wilson's ambitions, albeit naïve, in pushing the Federal Reserve Act of 1913. In his "New Freedom" speech of 1912, Wilson worried: "We have been dreading all along the time when the combined power of high finance would be greater than the power of the government'. It didn't work as he'd intended.

And especially now, it all boils down to money. You must have plenty to get on the ballot in the first place, and you must leave office with much, much more and they make sure of that.

I'm disheartened. Imagine! For most of my life I actually believed our leaders really cared about our country and citizens.

What then, are we supposed to vote on? Personality or appearance?

George_1950 · Aug 4, 2008, 04:48 PM

Originally Posted by purplewings

After reading the massive number of both Democrat and Republican indicted senators, governors and other 'ranking' politicians, I've begun to think it doesn't even matter who we vote for...
I'm disheartened. Imagine! For most of my life I actually believed our leaders really cared about our country and citizens.
What then, are we supposed to vote on? Personality or appearance?

You having a bad day, pw? It's OK to be skeptical, but don't be a cynic. This is a great country because the majority enjoy freedom and humankind has an 'internal' compass to find and affirm it.

George_1950 · Aug 4, 2008, 04:51 PM

Originally Posted by BABRAM

McCain's an alternative to coherent balance. The Clinton's better hope that Obama wins this election or their political careers are cooked. A nation filled with first time voters will give up on American poltics. We then would more than likely lose a whole generation. As for the subject, if Hillary's loose canon combatants want to charge that Super Delegates were bribed then they better be prepared for defamation counter charges. I know who ends up winning that judgment.

This is pretty lame coming from you, Bobby; more like partisanship. There is no liability when it comes to defaming public figures. First time voters are not about to give up on American politics. You having a bad day, too? If Obama were to win, he will be a one term president. The majority of Americans are not about to head down his road.

BABRAM · Aug 4, 2008, 04:58 PM

Originally Posted by George_1950

This is pretty lame coming from you, Bobby; more like partisanship. There is no liability when it comes to defaming public figures. First time voters are not about to give up on American politics. You having a bad day, too? If Obama were to win, he will be a one term president. The majority of Americans are not about to head down his road.

Huh? Where have you been for the last three decades? Our government has promoted every thing possible to get the vote out. Ads are especially targeted to the youth to have them involved. We desperately try to get people involved into the system. Why would stating a fact be lame to you, George? Perhaps your day was worse than mine? I had a great day! ~ Lean on me... when you are down... I'll be your friend... :)

tomder55 · Aug 5, 2008, 03:06 AM

A nation filled with first time voters will give up on American poltics.

I was in San Diego last week and noted that everywhere I went there were Obama operatives registering new voters. (it helped that many were gathered that the freak show Comic -Con)
I saw no similar effort from McCain.

The million dollar question is ;will thy actually come out to vote ? Young voters are unreliable. Note that the "Obama girl" who did that music video about him was out partying the night of the NY primary and did not vote.

I don't understand what you are saying . Unless Obama wins this generation will become disillusioned ? That's quite a burden on 'the one' .

You've started to believe
The things they say of you
You really do believe
This talk of God is true

And all the good you've done
Will soon be swept away
You've begun to matter more
Than the things you say
(Heaven On Their Minds from "Jesus Christ Superstar")

spitvenom · Aug 5, 2008, 06:07 AM

Originally Posted by tomder55

The million dollar question is ;will thy actually come out to vote ? Young voters are unreliable. Note that the "Obama girl" who did that music video about him was out partying the night of the NY primary and did not vote.

I think more young voters will vote in this election then they did in 2004. I remember going to "free" concerts all of Philly and NY in 2004. They were free if you were already registered to vote or if you registered right then and there. Tons of young people there. I even brought my younger cousins to some of them. But when Nov 4 rolled around Most of them didn't vote. So they just got a free concert out of it.

But this time I think more of them will because I haven't seen any of those free concerts if you register to vote. If you register to vote with out getting anything out of it except the right to vote then you actually want to vote. If you register to vote because you got to go to a concert then you aren't going to vote.

purplewings · Aug 5, 2008, 06:23 AM

I agree from what I've seen around here in Michigan. The younger generation are happy to think the world as they know it, will change if Obama is elected. Not just the black Americans but all of them.

Even older Americans like me would get excited at that prospect - if it were someone I had some confidence the change would be in a positive direction.

tomder55 · Aug 5, 2008, 06:46 AM

I haven't seen any of those free concerts if you register to vote. If you register to vote with out getting anything out of it except the right to vote then you actually want to vote. If you register to vote because you got to go to a concert then you aren't going to vote.

Spitvenom
Well his biggest crowds at rallys have been the results of free concerts. This was true in Seattle

Barack Obama | SFBO blog: Student Rewind: In Concert

And it was true in Germany :

Bratwurst-and-beer stands shared space with vendors who were selling an array of Obama products, including a T-shirt that declared, “The World For Obama '08

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/25/us...s/25obama.html

Why not ? It works ;and to me is no different than a politician serving bar-b-que at an event.

But ;If the hope of a generation rests in a populist politician then that generation is most likely lost anyway.

spitvenom · Aug 5, 2008, 07:37 AM

Tom I got this from the link you had on your post

"The New York Times described it as a“rally/fund-raiser/concert.” The first featured musical guests Ne-Yo and the Goo Goo Dolls and drew more than 4,500 supporters at the Gibson Theatre in Hollywood on Tuesday. Still, Senator Obama was the biggest star there, and upon entering the stage at the end of the event, received a tremendous ovation. You can read more about the event"

The difference with this and 2004 is I would say 70% of those kids were there to actually see Obama speak They weren't there just to register to vote because they got a free concert. In 2004 They were just going to go to a concert. It's not like The Roots got off stage and John Kerry came on and the place went nuts. That's the Big difference!

Do you really think If McCain did the same thing in Germany that 200,000 people would show up. Be Honest Tom (not that I ever think you are dishonest).

tomder55 · Aug 5, 2008, 07:44 AM

Clearly Obama is a personality . I guess we will find out if he is a statesman and /or a competent leader . His resume is a blank slate so I have nothing to measure it against except his words and (dare I say it ?) his associations.

McCain as I have said already is that safe alternative to "none of the above" . He barely fills a building at a town hall event . But I have no doubt about his leadership ability . I see no energy in his campaign and the election is clearly Obama's to win or lose.

spitvenom · Aug 5, 2008, 08:23 AM

I think The Blank slate is what intrigues young people about Obama and it is what turns some older people off to him.

excon · Aug 5, 2008, 08:43 AM

Originally Posted by tomder55

clearly Obama is a personality ..... McCain as I have said already is that safe alternative to "none of the above" .

Hello tom:

Of course, he's a personality. You guys on the right don't like that the people like him.

Nobody likes McCain. Not you, not his party, not his fellow senators, and not the voters. Yet, you're going to vote for him anyway. I don't know about you guys.

In my view, we're in for some tough times ahead. The dufus in chief has made us LESS safe and spent us into the ground. I don't think it's time to play it safe. Besides, electing a 72 year old isn't safe at all.

excon

BABRAM · Aug 5, 2008, 09:37 AM

McCain has a personality also. He just bores us all to death with same fatiguing views that we heard from the Republicans, election after election before.

tomder55 · Aug 5, 2008, 10:38 AM

more from the cult

There'd be love and respect, but I think you'd have it even bigger than Clinton. With someone like Obama, I think the whole country, the whole world will coalesce. Every election is about change, and change takes a long time because there are big issues that can't be changed overnight. But the one thing that will change dramatically is how we're viewed around the world. Once Obama is in there, the world will view us in an entirely different light. And that, to me, is a good thing...
Rob Reiner