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dimpls · Feb 8, 2008, 11:18 PM

If you are a natural born citizen and your husband is naturalized citizen and you just find out he got married to another women in another country, can you have his citizenship revoked and have his passport taken away from him?

JudyKayTee · Feb 9, 2008, 07:19 AM

Originally Posted by dimpls

If you are a natural born citizen and your husband is naturalized citizen and you just find out he got married to another women in another country, can you have his citizenship revoked and have his passport taken away from him?

No, you cannot get his citizenship revoked -

I don't see any grounds for having his passport taken away from him unless he is charged with a crime and found guilty... and even then it possibly won't affect his passport status.

Why don't you just divorce him and get him out of your life?

dimpls · Feb 9, 2008, 10:32 AM

I know you think it's that simple. First of all, I have children, second, he doesn't even live in America. Third I definitely want to hurt him the way he hurt me and my children. You see he took his citizenship and moved out of America. He only uses and renews his passport so that he is protected under the American laws in other countries and it make it easier for him to enter other countries without a visa. This would limit his movements and he would be stuck in his country of origin. He also hasn't given me any money or even recognized the kids. Its like he met someone had an affair over the past five years and then decided to marry. No regards or respect for the mother of his children or the woman that gave him 20 years ( of which the past five have been a living nightmare ). Or my poor kids that he's damaged do to the fights and late nights and in the end not even a phone call. I know I'm hurt but there must be something I can do if I prove him to be a bigamist ( it is still against the law ).

JudyKayTee · Feb 9, 2008, 10:48 AM

Originally Posted by dimpls

I know you think its that simple. First of all, I have children, second, he doesn't even live in America. Third I definitely want to hurt him the way he hurt me and my children. You see he took his citizenship and moved out of America. He only uses and renews his passport so that he is protected under the American laws in other countries and it make it easier for him to enter other countries without a visa. This would limit his movements and he would be stuck in his country of origin. He also hasn't given me any money or even recognized the kids. Its like he met someone had an affair over the past five years and then decided to marry. No regards or respect for the mother of his children or the woman that gave him 20 years ( of which the past five have been a living nightmare ). Or my poor kids that hes damaged do to the fights and late nights and in the end not even a phone call. I know I'm hurt but there must be something I can do if I prove him to be a bigamist ( it is still against the law ).

What does your divorce attorney advise? Probably wait until the divorce is over and then pursue it any way you want.

Am I correct - you are legally married to him and then he married someone else?

If he was married to someone else and then to you, contact your local DA - yes, bigamy is a crime.

I have always found revenge backfires but if you want to pursue that avenue it certainly is your choice.

Fr_Chuck · Feb 9, 2008, 12:48 PM

There is no way you can take any citizenship away from him. First it is not yours to take away,

If he is still married to you, and you can prove he is now married to someone else ( unless he is living in a county where pural marriage is allowed) you can attempt to have him charged with bigomy. This may effect his ability to travel between nations,

Part of the bigomy issue is that it is not illegal everywhere, so where he is living is the issue, since he did not marry a second person here in the US, so actually it may be a crime in the nation he married at.

What you really want to do, but I know you are not going to listen, is move on with your life, get a divorce and go on raising your family and try and get over the hate, you will not be your best or ever the best for your family full of hate for someone.

dimpls · Feb 10, 2008, 08:28 PM

Ahh but bigamy is bigamy if you're an american.
It really doesn't matter if he is or isn't in a country that allows it. He will be stopped if he came here. But I do understand that you think its better to move on and your right. I will but there are unsolved issues that he is not fessing up to. I do want some control of it all or I can't just submit. Do you understand that. You shouldn't be allowed to do that and then there be no reprocutions. It should not be that simple at least not that easy legally.

jp242 · Feb 11, 2008, 08:42 AM

Originally Posted by dimpls

ahh but bigamy is bigamy if your an american.
It really doesnt matter if he is or isnt in a country that allows it. He will be stopped if he came here.

But it does matter what state you are in. Each state has their own laws regarding bigamy and whether it is a felony (usually class 5 or 6) or a misdemeanor. In short, no you will not be able to get his citizenship revoked. I would get a divorce based on abandonment, see if you can get a child support declaration against him. I remember reading a news story a year or two again when the new passport laws came into effect that individuals with owed child support (they used the term deadbeat dad) could not renew or get a passport until they paid the debt. That will hurt him more than anything, trust me.

BMI · Feb 11, 2008, 08:49 AM

You cannot take his citizenship away period. Forget the bigamy thing as this will not affect his status as much as you would like to think it will.

Spite is a terrible thing and I think you should remove yourself from this situation as soon as possible. You seem to be going to great lengths to get back at this person, focus on what it is turning YOU into rather than spend time and energy on trying to wreck someone else's life.

JudyKayTee · Feb 11, 2008, 08:54 AM

Originally Posted by jp242

But it does matter what state you are in. Each state has their own laws regarding bigamy and whether it is a felony (usually class 5 or 6) or a misdameanor. In short, no you will not be able to get his citizenship revoked. I would get a divorce based on abandonment, see if you can get a child support declaration against him. I remember reading a news story a year or two again when the new passport laws came into effect that individuals with owed child support (they used the term deadbeat dad) could not renew or get a passport until they paid the debt. That will hurt him more than anything, trust me.

If the original poster's concern is the children of this marriage I would think revoking the husband's passport will hurt them more than it will hurt him - so consult with a divorce attorney and see what is recommended. Does the father travel on business? Costing him his employment will shoot you in the foot.

jp242 · Feb 11, 2008, 09:07 AM

Originally Posted by JudyKayTee

If the original poster's concern is the children of this marriage I would think revoking the husband's passport will hurt them more than it will hurt him - so consult with a divorce attorney and see what is recommended. Does the father travel on business? Costing him his employment will shoot you in the foot.

The OP stated that she wanted to stop his movement:

You see he took his citizenship and moved out of America. He only uses and renews his passport so that he is protected under the American laws in other countries and it make it easier for him to enter other countries without a visa. This would limit his movements and he would be stuck in his country of origin. He also hasn't given me any money or even recognized the kids

If that is what she seeks to accomplish, this might do it seeing as how she cannot get his citizenship revoked. OP also states that he currently pays NO money, so it isn't like that money is going to stop showing up. She can still seek a divorce and seek child support. I would never advise a client not to seek child support if the father has disappeared. Freezing his passport might be the only way to get some type of justice.

JudyKayTee · Feb 11, 2008, 11:08 AM

Originally Posted by jp242

The OP stated that she wanted to stop his movement:

If that is what she seeks to accomplish, this might do it seeing as how she cannot get his citizenship revoked. OP also states that he currently pays NO money, so it isn't like that money is going to stop showing up. She can still seek a divorce and seek child support. I would never advise a client not to seek child support if the father has disappeared. Freezing his passport might be the only way to get some type of justice.

I never said not to seek a divorce or child support - I said if he travels on business and she freezes his passport he might lose his employment (while he's sorting things out) and that would not help her get support for her children.

I realize you are an Attorney and I am not but how would you get jurisdiction over someone in an other Country who (according to the OP, if I understand her correctly) does not come back to the US?

jp242 · Feb 11, 2008, 12:49 PM

Originally Posted by JudyKayTee

I never said not to seek a divorce or child support - I said if he travels on business and she freezes his passport he might lose his employment (while he's sorting things out) and that would not help her get support for her children.

I realize you are an Attorney and I am not but how would you get jurisdiction over someone in an other Country who (according to the OP, if I understand her correctly) does not come back to the US?

He is a US citizen and therefore the laws of this country apply to him regardless of whether he is present or not. She is seeking a way to halt the use of his passport (a US issued one). While she wanted to get his citizenship revoked (which I believe all of us agree would not happen) in order to keep him from getting the benefits of free travel using the passport, what I am saying is that an outstanding child support judgment that is unpaid will freeze his passport when he tries to renew it. I am not saying this so she can get money out of him (which she is getting none of now) rather it would most likely achieve her objective of getting him landlocked somewhere. So yes, he is in another country, but according to the OP he is traveling on a US Visa which our government can freeze at any time. He does not need to be present in a divorce proceeding to have child support judged against him. All he needs is notice of a hearing for the proceedings, it is up to him to decide if he will show up or not. Any judgment entered there after is valid and can be used by our government to hold up renewals of government benefits, such as passports. Now, of course, this will have no bearing on him if he were to get a passport from another country and he would be free to travel on that as he wished.

JudyKayTee · Feb 11, 2008, 06:48 PM

Originally Posted by jp242

He is a US citizen and therefore the laws of this country apply to him regardless of whether he is present or not. She is seeking a way to halt the use of his passport (a US issued one). While she wanted to get his citizenship revoked (which I believe all of us agree would not happen) in order to keep him from getting the benefits of free travel using the passport, what I am saying is that an outstanding child support judgment that is unpaid will freeze his passport when he tries to renew it. I am not saying this so she can get money out of him (which she is getting none of now) rather it would most likely achieve her objective of getting him landlocked somewhere. So yes, he is in another country, but according to the OP he is traveling on a US Visa which our government can freeze at any time. He does not need to be present in a divorce proceeding to have child support judged against him. All he needs is notice of a hearing for the proceedings, it is up to him to decide if he will show up or not. Any judgment entered there after is valid and can be used by our government to hold up renewals of government benefits, such as passports. Now, of course, this will have no bearing on him if he were to get a passport from another country and he would be free to travel on that as he wished.

This could go on forever but I thought the problem was that he was out of the country, moved out, hadn't come back - I know all about service and Court appearances and all of that. I don't understand how to get jurisdiction over someone, citizen or not, living in another country.

Rather than have this go on forever and bore everyone to death, myself included, I'll just look it up tomorrow.

I did not know the Government could pull a passport based on unpaid judgments, child support or otherwise. This is very useful info to me.

dimpls · Feb 11, 2008, 09:47 PM

I have learned a lot and appreciate the response. I think you all have a good idea of the situation and I now know what can be done. Now on to the other issue of bigamy. What about that? Will they stop him when he goes to renew his passport for that? Will they deport him to stand trial for that? Bigamy is against the law where he has his other citizenship also, but he did't marry there either. The only problem with that is they don't care as long as he doesn't legally claim her as his wife there. I can also not afford a lawyer there.

jp242 · Feb 12, 2008, 06:32 PM

Originally Posted by dimpls

I have learned a lot and appreciate the response. I think you all have a good idea of the situation and I now know what can be done. Now on to the other issue of bigamy. What about that? Will they stop him when he goes to renew his passport for that? Will they deport him to stand trial for that? Bigamy is against the law where he has his other citizenship also, but he did't marry there either. The only problem with that is they don't care as long as he doesn't legally claim her as his wife there. I can also not afford a lawyer there.

No no and no. The US is not going to extradite someone for bigamy (unless the other woman is actually a child, in which case the real crime you are dealing with is rape). I highly doubt you will get anywhere on the bigamy laws, it is just not that high up there when it comes to crimes. In a lot of states it is simply a misdemeanor.

Judy~ From what I have read, they do not pull passports for unpaid child support rather they can be held up for renewal until judgments are paid. This was a huge issue in the last few years with the new passport regulations. I will see if I can find an article on it. As for :

I don't understand how to get jurisdiction over someone, citizen or not, living in another country.

The US retains control over the passport, which the individual is traveling on. It is not so much jurisdiction over him in the sense that all laws apply to him, etc. rather if he wants to travel using a US passport, he needs to meet the requirements of getting and keeping a passport from the US. He, of course, can get a passport from his other country and the US would have no say in how he travels

ETA: here is a link to the ACF page on passport denial. There is a floor amount of support owed of $2500. FPLS Brochure - Passport Denial

JudyKayTee · Feb 12, 2008, 09:39 PM

[QUOTE=jp242]Judy~ From what I have read, they do not pull passports for unpaid child support rather they can be held up for renewal until judgments are paid. This was a huge issue in the last few years with the new passport regulations. I will see if I can find an article on it. As for : The US retains control over the passport, which the individual is traveling on. It is not so much jurisdiction over him in the sense that all laws apply to him, etc. rather if he wants to travel using a US passport, he needs to meet the requirements of getting and keeping a passport from the US. He, of course, can get a passport from his other country and the US would have no say in how he travels

I wasn't addressing renewal of the passport. I was addressing your statement "So yes, he is in another country, but according to the OP he is traveling on a US Visa which our government can freeze at any time." I didn't think the Government could freeze it at any time and that is what I questioned. I realize renewal can be held up or refused, it was the freezing at any time that I questioned.

I was also addressing service on this person in any type of Matrimonial/Family Court action. It was my understanding that he is wherever he is and does not return to the US. How would you get jurisdiction over him - in accordance with your statement: "He does not need to be present in a divorce proceeding to have child support judged against him. All he needs is notice of a hearing for the proceedings, it is up to him to decide if he will show up or not."

There has been a case bouncing around the Pennsylvania Courts involving a husband in India and a wife in the US and the inability to get jurisdiction over him.