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Depressed in MO · Nov 1, 2007, 08:49 AM

Lets say I live on my own with my children, and their father gets visitation rights, even though he sells and does cocaine (along with some other things), but I can't prove it in court. My question is, what if he gets raided or pulled over having these things found in his possession while my kids are with him?

Could they be taken away from me too? Because even though I know he does these things, I can't prove it in court, so they are not just going to NOT allow visitation, right?
Are the courts going to prove me an unfit mother because I let the kids go visit their father (Only because it is court ordered, not because of my own free will)?

I live in Missouri.

Right now this is a just a case scenario. I am just asking WHAT IF? It is important to me to know the right thing to do for some major life changing steps I'm beginning to take.

And please let me know if my question is unclear.

Thanks so much for your opinions and replys.

T

N0help4u · Nov 1, 2007, 09:08 AM

YES they CAN say you are unfit for letting them go with him.
What all have you done about this so far?
Can you refuse to let them see him?
Do you have a court order that states what/when his visitations are?
Have you gone to CPS/family court and officially voiced your concerns?
If you don't have a court order specifying when visitations are to occur then don't let them see him any more than you have to.
If you do have an order saying every other weekend or whatever, you need to go to family court and tell them your concerns and tell them you don't want it to come back on you in any way, shape or form if anything happens while they are with him because you are following the court order. Document every day, time, person, and what was said and done to prove you have been fighting this. Insist he get drug tested. Keep on them too because if you don't at least check back every now and then with updates and ask things like if there is any progress with helping you find answers, or where can you go from here, or what are your rights in pursuing legally (like can the kids testify what they see and know) and so forth.
They do love it when you can show you were pro active and kept on top of things.
They hate it when they feel you are personally attacking them. I think that is why I couldn't get mine back. I asked too many questions like why are you people allowed to lie in court? And why are you two spending all my visitation time going over notes with each other about another family?

J_9 · Nov 1, 2007, 09:16 AM

Originally Posted by Depressed in MO

he sells and does cocaine (along with some other things), but I can't prove it in court.

Oh, yes you can prove it in court. The judge CAN order drug tests to be taken and he get visitation according to his drug status. If clean, he gets the kids, of not, well then he is out of luck. The court can schedule weekly, monthly, or bi-weekly tests.

You just need to voice your concerns very loudly to the attorney handling your case. You know the old analogy about the squeaky wheel...

cjonline · Nov 1, 2007, 09:35 AM

I agree with J_9 you most definitely can prove it. Go to court. Say it all and let the Judge ask your ex questions. If your ex claims that you are lying and he's clean then you attorney can speak up and say there is no reason for him to deny the test then. If he starts making up reasons not to take it then everyone will know he's using. Be prepared to have to take the test too though. The judge might want to see that both of you are clean. Or he may be one of those Judges that are like 'whats good for the goose is good for the gander.'

Depressed in MO · Nov 1, 2007, 10:45 AM

Originally Posted by N0help4u

YES they CAN say you are unfit for letting them go with him.
What all have you done about this so far?
Can you refuse to let them see him?
Do you have a court order that states what/when his visitations are?
Have you gone to CPS/family court and officially voiced your concerns?
If you don't have a court order specifying when visitations are to occur then don't let them see him any more than you have to.
If you do have an order saying every other weekend or whatever, you need to go to family court and tell them your concerns and tell them you don't want it to come back on you in any way, shape or form if anything happens while they are with him because you are following the court order. Document every day, time, person, and what was said and done to prove you have been fighting this. Insist he get drug tested. Keep on them too because if you don't at least check back every now and then with updates and ask things like if there is any progress with helping you find answers, or where can you go from here, or what are your rights in pursuing legally (like can the kids testify what they see and know) and so forth.
They do love it when you can show you were pro active and kept on top of things.
They hate it when they feel you are personally attacking them. I think that is why I couldn't get mine back. I asked too many questions like why are you people allowed to lie in court? And why are you two spending all my visitation time going over notes with each other about another family?

I have done nothing yet. I am in the first stages of leaving him. I have gone to the doctor, was tested for STD's (all good results thank goodness). He has taken $400.00 out of my account as of last Friday. I have 15.00 left in my account and another week to go before I can get another paycheck.
Anyway, back to what I was saying... My doctor did put me on an antidepressant, I hope the courts will not use that against me or else I WILL not take them, even though they are helping me a lot.

I have counseling sessions set up for me and the kids next week (was the earliest I could get in). My babysitter has documented things the kids have said (she will definitely help me out in any way she can)

I have begun counseling and decided to go through that before I actually leave because of this. I have tried to leave him before. He said that I could take him to court (if I can find him. But if he has to pay child support, then he is DEFINITELY going to see his kids. When I brought up the fact about his drug abuse, he threatened to kill me and my family. So I stayed.

I'm getting counseling to see what help they can offer me if I were to testify in court about his drug use. I do not want to lose my children-they are the only reason I am alive. They need me and I have taken care of each of them since they were born.

For now, we are OK, as he is only home ONE day a week, so I feel safe. But I know what he is doing out on the streets and with other people and I want to get away from him completely.

I'm not one of those parents who want to keep the father's kids away from him because I'm pissed off about the way he treats me. I want him to be a part of their lives. But since he is only home one day a week anyway, he obviously does not want to be now. But he will fight me on that once I leave and take them with me. OK Fine. But he needs to get his act together and be right when he is around them.

This is the reason I asked the question.

Again thank you for your replys.

N0help4u · Nov 1, 2007, 10:54 AM

You need to document everything and tell the Judge that if he is to have visitation you feel they should be supervised. Don't worry about taking depression meds. The CPS workers look at that as pro active. They fought me for years to get a prescription 'for my depression' that I didn't have. If they do make a negative issue out of you taking meds. Then tell them you are willing to quit them.
I had the same problem with my ex I couldn't trust him with my kids. I would have loved more than anything for him to have joint custody BUT!
It is a shame the moms that keep their kids from their dad for spite when there are moms like us that wish more than anything that our kids could have a dad.

Depressed in MO · Nov 1, 2007, 12:27 PM

I hope it is OK to vent. All I can do is document what he has said to me and the kids.
My oldest child cries every night when I pick her up from the sitter's house because she doesn't want to go home even when he is NOT there. She hates him because of the way she has seen him treat me.

Back to the documenting everything... Wouldn't it be a she said-he said kind of thing?
I mean, anyone could say anything... But proof? Last night, he took the two little ones trick-or treating (the oldest one is mine from a previous relationship). He took the two little ones out with him and one of his friends. Ok fine, It hurts but OK. So I took my oldest one out trick or treating.

Well I had to go meet him to pick up the little ones and go home (we both went to separate neighborhoods) when they were finished and on the way home, my middle child (who is 6) told me that daddy told my youngest one (who is 2) that mommy is a .

Anyway, is that the kind of stuff I should be documenting?

cjonline · Nov 1, 2007, 05:17 PM

Yes. Keep a journal for yourself. Write dates and who said what. It might be he said she said but enough of it and the judge would see that there may be something to it.

I had to go to court for a visitation hearing during my divorce and I took the sheet I had kept of every time my ex didn't show or there was a problem with the visitation. The judge asked him questions based on my notes and denied him his motion because half of what he was saying was exactly what I wrote, you could tell the judge knew that the other half was too. He was ordered to parenting classes before he could see the boys again. So it did help in my case.

Depressed in MO · Nov 2, 2007, 05:35 AM

"yes everything that you or your kids don't feel comfortable with but don't make it come across or look like knit picking or spitefulness"

Well, there is a lot-how far should I go back-there is seven years worth of these things?
I'm afraid it will sound like knit picking or spitefulness. But it is all true with no exaggeration.

Can I use anything that the kids say in counseling? Only the six year old will be in counseling, the other one I have with him is only 2 years old. I'm taking my oldest daughter, she has a lot to say, but she is not his child.
UGGGGGGGGGGH-I feel like crap. I just want to do the right thing for once.

Thanks for all your help. Please stay with me here.

Thanks everyone,

T

cjonline · Nov 2, 2007, 08:50 AM

Maybe go back a couple of weeks or a month then go forward. You may want to start with a sheet of big things that have happened over the years. Then just move on. Don't go back to write anything after the date if finished. If something new comes up then date it the day it came up and note what date it happened. Your not trying to create lies your just noting what's going on. Maybe write a letter to him if its something big or something that happens a lot. A small but important thing... handwrite it out don't type it and print. Something typed can sometimes look fake and done the day before.