[tomder55]

I did not say it was a religion . I said it was a faith . You have to believe there is no God to be as strong an atheist as Dawkins (yes I understand the distinction between strong atheism and the wishy washy soft brand that is really agnosticism )

[NeedKarma]

I did not say it was a religion . I said it was a faith .

Faith deals with believing what cannot be proven, atheism does not deal with such issues.

[inthebox]

But atheist have a faith that there is no God, right?

Question is why are they always asking believers to prove that there is a God that they supposedly don't consider.

Why do non- believer's, or at least those who do not accept the Bible as the inspired word of God, go to such lengths as to "prove " that there is no God?

Are they trying to "evangelize" believers in God to their belief that there is no God?





Grace and Peace

[NeedKarma]

but atheist have a faith that there is no God, right?

No, they don't think about it, they just go about their daily lives without considering it.

Question is why are they always asking believers to prove that there is a God that they supposedly don't consider.

I believe you have run across some militant atheists, most don't really care; people sometimes get riled up by their militant religious counterparts telling how wrong they are living their lives.

Why do non- believer's, or at least those who do not accept the Bible as the inspired word of God, go to such lengths as to "prove " that there is no God?

I don't know of any that do that, sorry.

Are they trying to "evangelize" believers in God to their belief that there is no God?

I haven't seen any go door to door to try to persuade others.

[templelane]

but atheist have a faith that there is no God, right?

Question is why are they always asking believers to prove that there is a God that they supposedly don't consider.

Why do non- believer's, or at least those who do not accept the Bible as the inspired word of God, go to such lengths as to "prove " that there is no God?

Because you can prove a positive i.e. chairs exist but you cannot disprove a negative.

As to the second question why do people go to such lengths to prove there is no God? They are bored and not smart enough to realise you can't disprove a negative?

[jillianleab]

but atheist have a faith that there is no God, right?

Question is why are they always asking believers to prove that there is a God that they supposedly don't consider.

Why do non- believer's, or at least those who do not accept the Bible as the inspired word of God, go to such lengths as to "prove " that there is no God?

Are they trying to "evangelize" believers in God to their belief that there is no God?

Not to be insulting or anything, but have you turned those questions around on yourself?

Why are there christians who are always asking non-believers to prove to them there is no god ("You don't believe in god, PROVE he doesn't exist!")?

Why do believers, those who accept the bible or other holy texts, go to such great lengths to "prove" there is a god to non-believers?

Why are believers always trying to "evangelize" everyone/everything they come in contact with?

Again, I'm not trying to insult you here, but it comes from both sides of the fence. Let's face it, there are members of BOTH sides which just won't be happy to let the other side carry on believing whatever they want. For the most part, I couldn't care less what someone else believes, it really doesn't affect my life that much. But there are theists in this world who make it their mission to preach to everyone and convert everyone they come into contact with that they think needs "saving". It's those people who inject themselves into my (supposedly) secular government and everyday life whom I have a problem with.

And before anyone gets on my case for arguing with theists on this board, no I don't care what you believe, I just like to debate. It's all in good fun! :)

[michealb]

I was woken up the other morning by two men knocking at my door they wore white short sleeve shirts and black ties. I am sure almost all of you know who these men were and what they wanted.
When was the last time an atheist knocked on your door telling you how great it was to not have religion in your life my guess is never. Have you ever seen the video of how people react to atheists going door to door and you will know why. YouTube - Door to Door Atheist!
As out spoken as I am here about being an atheist. I keep quite about it in my personal life not because I'm ashamed but because of other peoples problems with dealing with it. You can only defend yourself for so long before you decide its not worth the effort and avoid the subject.

[inthebox]

Jillean...

No offense taken, but

non- believers typically take what science tells us or take the Bible out of context to "prove" that there is no God.

We see and agree on the same things but interpret it differently.

For example, dna. It can be seen as some random chance that 4 different nucleotides in some chemical mush just decided to get together in specific pairing in specific sequences multiplied by the thousands, and over billions of years ribosomes and aminoacids and cell membranes all sort of just all go together purely by chance and the laws of chemistry and physics to make a cell that can reproduce and be subject to selective pressures. I see that and am amazed. Some accept this is by chance and can't prove it, others see it as a mark of the creator.

Believers, and I take it to mean of the big 3 religions, to different degrees want to share their version of salvation. Yes it can be annoying and a bother to non- believers, but is that really a bad thing? These religions share a belief in an almighty, that will judge according to his standards, and that there are eternal consequences. If we are wrong, we all die and end up as food for worms. At least from my Christian perspective, knowing that there is a loving and forgiving God brings comfort, peace and joy during this lifetime. If one of these religions is correct, do you want to be on the wrong end of judgement?

There are Christian ministrys helping the poor, visiting prisons, starting hospitals, building houses etc.. All because God has blessed us.

I don't believe in a theocracy, but believers have every right to participate in the political process.

And because we are all humans, there are rotten apples to spoil every barrel.
There are judgemental, hypocritical, un-loving, unforgiving Christians. I don't deny that.
I am that at times also. I strive to be holy, but rely on His grace.




Grace and Peace

[inthebox]

Michaelb

"I was woken up the other morning by two men knocking at my door they wore white short sleeve shirts and black ties. I am sure almost all of you know who these men were and what they wanted. "

At first I thought you meant the IRS.




Grace and peace

[jillianleab]

inthebox

Like you said, there are bad apples out there, and I think on both sides. I'm sure it is just as obnoxious for theists to have someone screaming in their face "God doesn't exist!" as it is for atheists to have someone screaming in their face, "The bible is the TRUTH!" There are atheists in this world out to "prove" there is no god, and those are the ones who get the most attention. However, those few don't really represent the majority. I remember seeing an episode of "Real Time with Bill Maher" (who is a rather outspoken atheist) in where he said something to the effect that anyone who believes in god is stupid, less intelligent, etc, etc. In my opinion, and in the opinion of all the atheists I personally know, that is not only insulting, but uncalled for. In that way, he's a bad apple. On the Christian side, remember the lady on that mom-swap show? The one who went nuts screaming about gargoyles and satan and unholy things? She's sort of a legend now... Anyway, during that show, the mom who switched into her life believed in god, but not the Christian god; this woman was insulted, treated horribly and ignored by people who were supposed to be "good Christians". Those are bad apples.

The thing about preaching salvation I have a problem with is the manner in which some people do it. Some people get in your face and yell and scream (we've had a few of those on this site, in fact), as if intimidation will make you submit. Others realize that won't work, but will preach non-stop about the goodness of god and how wonderful this and that is. If that is being directed to someone who is seeking a new faith (or first faith!), I have no problem with it. But it is a waste of time and energy to preach to someone who has no intention of changing their belief system. For example, I could tell you all the wonderful reasons to be an atheist, all the great things that come with it, etc, and is it going to matter? I'm going to guess not! So why would one think it would work in reverse? I'm well aware according to the "big three" I'm doomed, and I'm OK with that. I don't lose sleep over it, I don't worry about it. Do you worry that you are wrong and you've wasted your life praying and behaving in a certain manner all to become worm food? Again, I'm going to guess not!

I agree, there are ministries who help the poor and do humanitarian work. But there are some who do it conditional on belief in "their god", which I think is immoral. It should also be noted one does not have to believe in a god to perform good deeds and humanitarian work!

I also agree that people of all faiths have the right to participate in the political environment. The problem comes when the religion is directly injected into the way the country is governed. Let's take birth control for an example. Birth control, including condoms, to the best of my knowledge, is against the Catholic faith. If you are Catholic you wait until you are married to have sex and the only method you may use is the rhythm method. If our government outlawed condoms, the pill and all other forms of birth control because Catholics say it's bad, that's religion interfering in the government. That's what I don't want to see and what I hate to see.