[cozyk]

Okay Arcura,
FAITH literally moved that mountain. I think you got in trouble when you used the word "litterally". I picture a mountain "moving over a few feet". What DO you mean faith LITTERALY moved a mountain?

[arcura]

cozyk,
They took the Gold and silver out of the rocks and dirt of the mountain and put the "litter" (refuse that was left; the crushed gravel and dirt) 1/3 mile away.
But when I posted that what I meant “literally”. I am not the best word speller by far.
Peace and kindness,
Fred

[TexasParent]

Thank you for responding so quickly. I do agree a lot of what you had to say. Especially the part about getting bent out of shape about it. I happen to know and love wonderful, love filled, love giving people who happen to be atheist. I fear for their souls IF
the christian hell is indeed true. I can't let myself believe this and it gets under my skin so much that this theory is endorsed by so many "people of God" . there is a very slight chance that they are right and the preachers that hammered this into me as a child are right. It scares the ever loving daylights out of me. Especially the hell described to me as a child. For MANY YEARS,I was devestated because I believed my dead, non church going , grandfather was actually burning, on fire, with unspeakable pain, for all of eternity. What kind of image is that to give to a child? It's cruel really.

I feel I'm right, I pray that I am right, I just have to rid myself of the years of hell fire and brim stone that was drilled into me for so many years.:o

It's a funny religion at times, with different interpretations and emphasis on different things at different times. The hell fire and brimstone days have been removed from the public eye to a large extent, now it's all about God's love; that's much more likely to get converts these days rather than the old tactic of scaring the begeebers out of people.

Which strikes me as a move to the center if we were to speak in political terms. Often those of us who don't specifically believe in the Christian biblical account of things often describe our personal experiences with the God of our understanding with terms of love and selflessness. Again, are Christian's and the rest of us so far apart these days? No, and yes; the fundamentalist group of Christian's will always get the most press, because the moderate branch won't get ratings on the news. So for those who happen to meet very nice Christian people in practice are completely turned off by the intolerance and hypocritical behavior of some Christian's that are reported in the news.

You wouldn't know most Christian's to see them, the good ones in my mind are out their making a difference in peoples lives and are not promoters of their belief but are happy to share their experiences and their faith only when asked.

Christian's aren't bad people, they are people who have come to need a handbook for living. My wife is like that, she is a book learner and a Christian. She likes having a handbook for life. As for myself, I have never been a book learner; I have acquired my wisdom (however small that may be) from personal experience, observation and reflection and a God given sense of what is right and wrong from when I was a child.

[TexasParent]

Okay Arcura,
FAITH litterally moved that mountain. I think you got in trouble when you used the word "litterally". I picture a mountain "moving over a few feet". What DO you mean faith LITTERALY moved a mountain?

This is often where there is a disconnect between religious people and secular people. It's the language of faith. Faith or belief can make anything possible. Faith or belief sprinkled with a lot of imagination allowed mankind to travel to the moon. There was a time when this was considered impossible, but with faith, belief and imagination it became a reality.

A religious person normally ties most things back to God when it comes to incredible things happening in their lives, or when incredible events happen. Some religious people see miracles even when they are in part human accomplishments because they belief God works through people for good. When Christian's work together to help other they describe themselves as the Body of Christ.

Acura is absolutely right, but will always give the credit to the God of his understanding. Whereas a secular person will explain it as a human collective effort which made it possible. Frankly, Acura's and my wife's view of the world where everything is because of God's grace/love is very romantic and a nice way to view life.

If the purpose of believing in God and Jesus is to align yourself in a state of receiving love through rose colored perception then Heaven on Earth can be achieved and is quite likely the reason why people do believe once they find that gratitude. It's simply a comforting and joyous way to live for some people and I can see the attractiveness of it.

Faith and some human effort and inventiveness can indeed move mountains. I am a believer that God within can achieve anything. Yet, I am not a believer of 'poof' miracles where mountains suddenly move by themselves without explanation.

[arcura]

TexasParent,
I believe that there is an explanation for everything, sometimes many of them depending on ones knowledge, experience, and or faith.
Often many explanations one gets are incomplete, slanted or unfairly given with important parts twisted or left out for various reasons depending on the explanations provider.
In my case I believe that God is involved some way in everything, but I often do not mention that.
However I do thank God privately for everything.
Example: I am a diabetic with a bad heart.
So I thank God he has allowed me to live and watch my grandkids grow up as well as whatever else is happening.
I also thank Him for the doctors, nurses, and technicians that have helped me and others.
Also for the people involved in researching, discovering, making, and distributing medicines as well as Him for providing the materials that went into the making progress.
When I say grace I have at times not only thanked God for the food but also I thank Him for the Farmers and everyone else who was responsible for getting the food on my table.
See what I mean?
God is involved some way in everything.
Peace and kindness,
Fred