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Momtoafew · Jun 29, 2005, 04:57 PM

Can anyone let me know what to do? I have a new maytag (toploader) washing machine that has been working fine for 5 months. Last week, I noticed suds backing up from the drain area (where the pipe empties water and suds into the wall). There are only suds spewing out, no water. I called Maytag and the service guy said my machine is fine and suggested me getting a roto rooter guy out to snake the drain. Did that the other day. The rotor rooter guy snaked about 15 feet and no "build up" came up. Also should mention my home is only 15 years old and I DO NOT HAVE A SEPTIC TANK. :( So I figured everything should be working fine now, but again, I'm getting suds spewing out all over. I don't use a lot of soap suds to begin with, as I always was told that there's no need to use a cup for a load. But I'm still getting this backup situation. I'm thinking of calling maytag in again and telling them that I've got the drain snaked so it must be a maytag problem, right? Is it possible that the mechanism in the machine is for some reason agitating too quickly to make the suds so "sudsy"? Any thoughts or comments to help me...

Flickit · Jun 29, 2005, 06:46 PM

Originally Posted by Momtoafew

Can anyone let me know what to do? I have a new maytag (toploader) washing machine that has been working fine for 5 months. Last week, I noticed suds backing up from the drain area (where the pipe empties water and suds into the wall). There are only suds spewing out, no water. I called Maytag and the service guy said my machine is fine and suggested me getting a roto rooter guy out to snake the drain. Did that the other day. The rotor rooter guy snaked about 15 feet and no "build up" came up. Also should mention my home is only 15 years old and I DO NOT HAVE A SEPTIC TANK. :( So I figured everything should be working fine now, but again, I'm getting suds spewing out all over. I don't use a lot of soap suds to begin with, as I always was told that there's no need to use a cup for a load. But i'm still getting this backup situation. I'm thinking of calling maytag in again and telling them that I've got the drain snaked so it must be a maytag problem, right? Is it possible that the mechanism in the machine is for some reason agitating too quickly to make the suds so "sudsy"? Any thoughts or comments to help me....

... using no soap whatsoever. This will rule out the plumbing as being 'backed-up'.

Momtoafew · Jun 29, 2005, 08:02 PM

And noticed quite a few others here had similar issues. From looking at past responses from some plumber guru's (hoping "road runner" and speedball1, might help! ) my question is about the drains and hoses in the washing machine.

First one of you guys mentioned in another post something about a "2x1 1/2 compression fitting" for the top of a stand pipe? Is the stand pipe the thing that is going into my wall? Is there something that can be simply snapped onto the drain pipe and prevent spillage of suds? I would think the drain pipe would not operate correctly if it were air sealed around it, as doesn't the air help make the flow of the suds and water go out the pipe? Someone also mentioned hoses might be the problem. Now the hoses bring the water into the machine, so am I understanding that maybe a hose with a smaller diameter (hot and cold hoses) would help my machine not to give out too much water and thus less suds?

By the way, I noticed too that in the regular cycle, I get suds all over the place (out the drain pipe and onto the floor), but on the delicate cycle I have no problems.

I'm a total chick alone in this situation, and like I said before I've already had the Maytag man out and my house (according to him no problems) and the roto rooter person (snaked and no problems). Should I now hire a professional plumber? If I should, can you all tell me what exactly to say is the problem so I don't need to give him a 4 paragraph thing (as in this case).

Also, why would the problem all of a sudden come up, as I have had no suds overflow problems since the purchase of this maytag... it's just been all of a sudden. I haven't changed operating habits, soap, or changed out parts, etc. so I just don't get it... Also worth noting is that I have no problems in my entire house as far as plumbing, backups,etc. and the house went thru' heavy inspection before buying it. :rolleyes:

Momtoafew · Jun 29, 2005, 08:34 PM

The model of my maytag is SAV3655a. It has a "powerful 2 speed, 1/2 horsepower motor".

Flickit · Jun 29, 2005, 08:42 PM

Originally Posted by Momtoafew

and noticed quite a few others here had similar issues. From looking at past responses from some plumber guru's (hoping "road runner" and speedball1, might help!!) my question is about the drains and hoses in the washing machine.

First one of you guys mentioned in another post something about a "2x1 1/2 compression fitting" for the top of a stand pipe?? Is the stand pipe the thing that is going into my wall? Is there something that can be simply snapped onto the drain pipe and prevent spillage of suds? I would think the drain pipe would not operate correctly if it were air sealed around it, as doesn't the air help make the flow of the suds and water go out the pipe? Someone also mentioned hoses might be the problem. Now the hoses bring the water into the machine, so am I understanding that maybe a hose with a smaller diameter (hot and cold hoses) would help my machine not to give out too much water and thus less suds?

By the way, I noticed too that in the regular cycle, i get suds all over the place (out the drain pipe and onto the floor), but on the delicate cycle I have no problems.

I'm a total chick alone in this situation, and like I said before I've already had the Maytag man out and my house (according to him no problems) and the roto rooter person (snaked and no problems). Should I now hire a professional plumber? If I should, can you all tell me what exactly to say is the problem so i don't need to give him a 4 paragraph thing (as in this case).

Also, why would the problem all of a sudden come up, as I have had no suds overflow problems since the purchase of this maytag... it's just been all of a sudden. I haven't changed operating habits, soap, or changed out parts, etc. so I just don't get it... Also worth noting is that I have no problems in my entire house as far as plumbing, backups,etc. and the house went thru' heavy inspection before buying it. :rolleyes:

... Speedball1 is the one to answer your plumbing questions (maybe signed off for today) but if you are making too much suds to begin with, it sounds like something in the washer is the culprit. Did you check the drain with a load of plain water to see if the drain is working properly?

speedball1 · Jun 30, 2005, 05:39 AM

Originally Posted by Momtoafew

Can anyone let me know what to do? I have a new maytag (toploader) washing machine that has been working fine for 5 months. Last week, I noticed suds backing up from the drain area (where the pipe empties water and suds into the wall). There are only suds spewing out, no water. I called Maytag and the service guy said my machine is fine and suggested me getting a roto rooter guy out to snake the drain. Did that the other day. The rotor rooter guy snaked about 15 feet and no "build up" came up. Also should mention my home is only 15 years old and I DO NOT HAVE A SEPTIC TANK. :( So I figured everything should be working fine now, but again, I'm getting suds spewing out all over. I don't use a lot of soap suds to begin with, as I always was told that there's no need to use a cup for a load. But i'm still getting this backup situation. I'm thinking of calling maytag in again and telling them that I've got the drain snaked so it must be a maytag problem, right? Is it possible that the mechanism in the machine is for some reason agitating too quickly to make the suds so "sudsy"? Any thoughts or comments to help me....

Hey Mom,

I'm not impressed by a plumber that only puts out 15' of snake, charges you for a call and leaves you with the same problem you had before he walked through the door.
Let's look at this problem sensibly. Your machine has performed OK for 5 months. We can assume you haven't "souped" up the pump so it is more powerful and pumps out more discharge then your system can handle. So what's that leave us? The drain line. Any time that I have a back up it is ALWAYS been a partial blockage in the drain. I have a rule that I use on repair calls. "IF IT EVER WORKED ONCE, THERE'S NO REASON IT CAN'T BE FIXED TO WORK AGAIN". In my opinion, the fault lies not in the washer making the suds too "sudsy" but in the drain line that fails to carry the washer discharge away.
Flickit put his finger directly on the problem when he said, "Did you check the drain with a load of plain water to see if the drain is working properly?"
Let us know what you come up with. Regards, Tom

Momtoafew · Jun 30, 2005, 07:23 AM

I have tried just using the washer cycle with water only, and no problem the hot or cold water flows fine. When I add soap, that's where I get into trouble. The backup is always suds/soap. No water ever comes up, out of the drain pipe. About a handful of soap, comes up and stays on the top of the drain pipe. The problem is that small amount of soap, dribbles down my wall, and onto my floor and in the week that I've noticed it, I've already got water damage on my wood floors from the dribble. A tray on the floor would be ideal, but in all honesty the suds are sticking to the wall and dribbling down the wall, so I don't even think the bottom tray would help my floors! So should I demand Rotor ROoter to come out again? Is there a standard measurement to snake? i.e. 20 feet, 30 feet, etc. Should they be snaking any other line, other than the washer (I have had no other backups in my house). The line to the washer is alone and then hooks up with another line to my small bathroom and then to the city sewer. No problems with the bathroom at all.

Thanks for your help.
:rolleyes:

Momtoafew · Jun 30, 2005, 05:07 PM

OK... I'm fiddling with my drain pipe today, as I'm not sure what to do. The rotor rooter guy snaked the drain, and in all honesty I don't think I have any clog, as if I had a clog, there would surely be water backing up and not just suds. And the maytag repairman said everything was going fine too... who else to call?

Anyway, I was fooling around with the drain pipe and discovered that the hose from the washing machine goes about 30 inches up the back of my machine, then loops around and clips to the top of the maytag in one of the matag's clips. Then the drain hose was in my wall pipe, but only about 4-5 inches down in the drain. So what I did was pulled some more slack of the drain hose, so I didn't have this loop and then shoved the drain hose about 8-10 inches into the wall (drain pipe). I'm running it's first cycle right now, and you know what no suds backup. Could this of been my problem all along??

When checking the internet, I could only find one website which talked about how far to push the drain hose into the drain pipe. All it said was "make sure you don't push the drain hose too far down the waste water pipe. This is an extremely common mistake..." "There should be a plastic hoook that the end of the drain hose clips into. This forces eht end of the drain hose into a shepherds hook. Approximately 6 inches of the drain hose should stick out of this hook..."

Now I ask, above the above quote... how far is TOO FAR? Also, my new maytag has a white drain hose with NO CLIP on the end. It just sort of is smaller at the end of the hose than the main part of the hose. There isn't a clip, so I just shoved as much down as I could into my wall. So now if I get a handful of suds, I gather they are about 10 inches down in my pipe, so now I'm not getting all those suds ontop of the wall pipe? Am I a good student, or am I causing more problems?

Let me know your thoughts. :o

Flickit · Jun 30, 2005, 05:53 PM

Originally Posted by Momtoafew

OK... I'm fiddling with my drain pipe today, as I'm not sure what to do. The rotor rooter guy snaked the drain, and in all honesty I don't think I have any clog, as if i had a clog, there would surely be water backing up and not just suds. And the maytag repairman said everything was going fine too... who else to call??

Anyway, I was fooling around with the drain pipe and discovered that the hose from the washing machine goes about 30 inches up the back of my machine, then loops around and clips to the top of the maytag in one of the matag's clips. Then the drain hose was in my wall pipe, but only about 4-5 inches down in the drain. So what I did was pulled some more slack of the drain hose, so I didn't have this loop and then shoved the drain hose about 8-10 inches into the wall (drain pipe). I'm running it's first cycle right now, and you know what no suds backup. Could this of been my problem all along???

When checking the internet, I could only find one website which talked about how far to push the drain hose into the drain pipe. All it said was "make sure you don't push the drain hose too far down the waste water pipe. This is an extremely common mistake..." "There should be a plastic hoook that the end of the drain hose clips into. This forces eht end of the drain hose into a shepherds hook. Approximately 6 inches of the drain hose should stick out of this hook..."

Now I ask, above the above quote... how far is TOO FAR? Also, my new maytag has a white drain hose with NO CLIP on the the end. It just sort of is smaller at the end of the hose than the main part of the hose. There isn't a clip, so I just shoved as much down as I could into my wall. So now if I get a handful of suds, I gather they are about 10 inches down in my pipe, so now I'm not getting all those suds ontop of the wall pipe? Am I a good student, or am I causing more problems?

Let me know your thoughts. :o

... as if the water was hitting a sudden bend (elbow, T or what Speedball1 can tell you it is) and doing just what the agitator is intended to do... make suds from soap.

Momtoafew · Jun 30, 2005, 07:26 PM

Thought I was a true fixer upper, but no luck. There were not a lot of suds backed up this time around (with the drain hose tucked in the wall about 10inches), but there were still some suds seeping out of the wall and down to my floor.

I just don't know what to do. I mean I will pay someone big $$$$ to fix the stupid thing, but who do I call? I can call roto rooter (I paid them $150 to snake 12-15 feet of drain) and called my maytag repairman (no charge as the unit is less than one year old)... but who to call next? Should I just call my regular plumber? What is this all about venting the roof top vent? Would roto rooter do this? They didn't mention it to me in the first visit. Again, is what I have truly a "backup" if actual water isn't being backed up? :mad:

Momtoafew · Jun 30, 2005, 07:46 PM

In another question to talked to a fellow about "compression fittings". And how you can place one on a washing machine drain pipe. When I was searching the internet for these fittings, all I could find were metal fittings for things like toilets and sinks. I'm assuming you are talking about a different kind of fitting, and was hoping to see a photo of what you are talking about or maybe a link to a website with a photo of what exactly you are referring to. I am thinking of heading down to the Ace hardware tomorrow to inquire about these fittings, but wanted to know exactly what they look like before heading there! Thanks (and I apologize for not knowing the exact terms of what I am talking about) :)

labman · Jun 30, 2005, 09:14 PM

I hope you can find Tom's compression fitting, and it works. It sounds to me like you have a partial plug. The suds add an enormous volume. Gravity can only force so much through through a given cross section. Even a little restriction reduces the flow by a large factor. Gravity has much less effect on the suds. Being mostly air, they almost float. If nothing else works, try adding a few drops of a liquid that doesn't dissolve in water to the stand pipe. Gasoline or paint thinner would do. Even liquid cooking oil may work, a spray lube, I prefer a silicone to WD-40. It will destroy the suds like magic.

Momtoafew · Jul 1, 2005, 07:12 AM

I do have wd40. Should I spray that into the drain pipe? Will that resolve the plug (if I have one) in the drain? Should I buy some stuff like Drano? Again, I'm just wanting the thing fixed, so I'm curious if you all think I should call roto rooter again, and insist they snake more than 12-15 feet which I gather is not enough. Or if I should call my regular plumber, as he is wonderful with all my other plumbing issues. Meanwhile, I have a washing machine that is not working and the laundry from all my kids is piling up! :eek:

speedball1 · Jul 1, 2005, 11:27 AM

Originally Posted by Momtoafew

I do have wd40. Should I spray that into the drain pipe? Will that resolve the plug (if i have one) in the drain? Should I buy some stuff like Drano? Again, I'm just wanting the thing fixed, so I'm curious if you all think i should call roto rooter again, and insist they snake more than 12-15 feet which i gather is not enough. Or if i should call my regular plumber, as he is wonderful with all my other plumbing issues. Meanwhile, I have a washing machine that is not working and the laundry from all my kids is piling up! :eek:

Hey Mom,
Save the Draino and the WD40. They just ain't going to get it. Call your plumber back and have him run his snake down the washer vent until it hits the bend at the base and then put out 25' more to be sure he gets out of the branch and into the main. In the mean time you might do what I did when the suds from my washer started to bubble out the top of my standpipe. Install a compression fitting on the standpipe and connect the washer hose to it. To see what a slip to compression fitting looks like click on http://www.plumbingwarehouse.com/pvccomp.html and go to the bottom of the page. You will have to get the compression end the same size as your washer hose and adapt the slip side to the same size as the stand pipe. In the meantime why not wrap some wet rags around the hose and use t6hem as a "caulk" to contain the suds as you wash. That way the kids clothes can get cleaned. Good luck, Tom

labman · Jul 1, 2005, 11:48 AM

Spraying a little WD-40 or something into the pipe will only break the suds down so they flow out the drain better. I only suggested it as a way to get a few loads done before you can remove the cause. Draino might or might not help. Auguring drains is Rotorouter's business, one of several arrows in the plumber's quiver.

speedball1 · Jul 2, 2005, 03:04 PM

Originally Posted by Momtoafew

thought I was a true fixer upper, but no luck. There were not a lot of suds backed up this time around (with the drain hose tucked in the wall about 10inches), but there were still some suds seeping out of the wall and down to my floor.

I just don't know what to do. I mean I will pay someone big $$$$ to fix the stupid thing, but who do i call? I can call roto rooter (i paid them $150 to snake 12-15 feet of drain) and called my maytag repairman (no charge as the unit is less than one year old)... but who to call next? Should I just call my regular plumber? What is this all about venting the roof top vent? Would roto rooter do this? They didn't mention it to me in the first visit. Again, is what i have truly a "backup" if actual water isn't being backed up? :mad:

Call Roto Rooter back. They charged you and didn't complete the job. Tell them you were advised by a plumber to snake from the washer vent on the roof. Tell them I said go run out at least 20 to 25 feet of cable after they hit the bend at the base of the stack to be sure they clear the branch. Oh! You have water backing up in the line OK. The clog just isn't bad enough to stop it from draining through. However when the discharge does hit the clog and starts back it pushes the soap suds far ahead of it so it's just the suds that come out. Clear the drain line and your problem will be solved.
In the mean time you might do what I did when the suds from my washer started to bubble out the top of my standpipe. Install a compression fitting on the standpipe and connect the washer hose to it. To see what a slip to compression fitting looks like click on http://www.plumbingwarehouse.com/pvccomp.html and go to the bottom of the page. You will have to get the compression end the same size as your washer hose and adapt the slip side to the same size as the stand pipe. In the meantime why not wrap some wet rags around the hose and use t6hem as a "caulk" to contain the suds as you wash. That way the kids clothes can get cleaned.
Cheers, Tom

Momtoafew · Jul 5, 2005, 03:38 PM

Different roto rooter guy, but he seemed to know what to do. I told him that we needed to snake down about 30 feet. He did. I inquired about the roof vent. I guess the roof vent requires a camera, and a different appointment. He said it was highly unlikely there was a block in the roof vent. Anyway, of course the washing machine DID NOT OVERFLOW WITH SUDS when he ran his test, but sure enough, on my first load of laundry, I'm getting suds backing up. I just installed the compression fitting. The one I purchased was from "Fernco Inc." in Davison, MI (bought it at home depot). I doubt this will do anything, as there are small holes ontop of the compression fitting, but running a wash right now and I'll let you all know if I get suds coming out of it.

Also, I have a question about the drain pipe from the machine. Does it matter how many inches the drain pipe goes up in height before coming down into the stand pipe? I'm trying to now have the drain pipe not attached to the white "u" clip on the back of my machine. Instead I have the pipe pressed against the wall going up about 8 inches above the machine and then down into the stand pipe... I'm wondering if this will allow for less suds action of any sort.

Anyway, I guess I need to schedule my visit with roto rooter again for the roof vent. By the way, should I call a regular plumber for that or roto rooter... any experiences with roto rooter? Are they the same as a plumber or do they just snake drains? I just want the siuation fixed. I'd be happy to pay $500 just so I don't have to deal with my floor getting warped from all the suds/water. I'm starting to think roto rooter might not be the best choice and I should get my plumber out here for the roof deal.

Also, I'm assuming that a roof vent inspection would be an added cost (I paid $150 for the first roto rooter visit, and nothing today in money as work was warrantied).

Momtoafew · Jul 5, 2005, 03:41 PM

http://www.fernco.com/HG.html

speedball1 · Jul 5, 2005, 04:10 PM

Originally Posted by Momtoafew

http://www.fernco.com/HG.html

Fill the top holes with epoxy and seal it off and you will have solved your problem.
Where did the plumber from Roto Rooter send his snake down? We snake from the vents,( No cameras) because it's the straightest way to get to the washer branch. I never thought your vent was blocked and if it was I wouldn't need a camera to tell me it was. Running a snake down the vent does that. Hope you had a great day. Tom

Momtoafew · Jul 7, 2005, 03:52 PM

Roto Rooter came out again! 3rd time. No problem in the line. Now, I'm starting to think about calling the Maytag repairman again. Has anyone heard of a washing machine that somehow is clogged up and prevents the suds from flowing correctly?? I noticed that after I washed a load (with little soap), that a lot of the clothes still had soap in them. I rewashed the same load without adding soap, and when opening the lid, noticed it looked like I put a cap full of soap in there... maybe for some reason the soap is getting caught up somewhere in my machine and not discharging at the correct times of the cycle, thus at the end having an enormous output of suds, of which my drain (or any drain) simply can't take. I'm going to call maytag, and request a different repairman, to see if he can see something that the first guy missed. Any thoughts? Can the soap hide somewhere in the washing machine and then just get aggitated so much that I get this large of an output of suds, meanwhile all my clothes have suds all over them? :mad: