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Lenovo · Jun 10, 2007, 04:53 AM

For his own sake, I won't say his name, but he is a retired corrections officer, now working as a security officer with me. No, I'm not his boss, I'm just someone who works with him, he and I are more or less at the same level in terms of "authority" on the job.

Any way, one day, I went on the computer in the office, while it was incredibly slow, and got some information I needed, and instead of printing it out, I wrote it down and set it off to the side. When I went to another portion of the building to relieve the other guard, I forgot about the papers, and left them in the office, however I figured it was fine, because at the end of the day I would be going back to the office anyway.

The end of my shift came, and this other guard I mentioned before (I'll call him Mr. Doe:cool: if I refer to his name again) came to the part of the building I was at so as to relieve me so I could go home. He was a little later in showing than usual, but I really didn't care. Anyhow, I got back to the office and went to get the papers I had set off to the side, but they were gone, so, naturally my first thought was, he saw them, figured it was garbage and tossed them out, so I checked the garbages, and they weren't in them. After that, I checked my mailbox, again, not there.

Know how Mr. Doe is, I looked in another mailbox and sure enough, they were there, in my bosses mailbox:mad: , with Mr. Doe's handwriting, my name written in the corner. So, naturally because it was information I needed I took MY papers back.

Basically my question is, what is his deal, is he really so bummed that he isn't got any special authority anymore that he has to be the company's "rat"? Or, is he simply trying to get me fired, cause in my opinion, no matter what was on that paper, it was none of his business, if he absolutely HAD to move the papers, the most he could have done, was put them in MY mailbox:mad: , and come to me about them like a man.

I'm not sure if Mr. Doe has the internet, or if he goes on this site, but if he does, and he is reading this message, he knows who he is, the message below is for him. Just in case there is another situation like this, his first initial is "T".

**A message for "Mr. Doe", if you are on this site and know who I am, You know who you are, could you at least come to me like a man, not a mouse**

shygrneyzs · Jun 10, 2007, 06:20 AM

My question is, when you sat at that computer and looked for information, were you within your boundaries? Was it information you had a right to look at and was the information considered needed for your job? Or were you at a site you had no business on, getting information that was not lined to your job?

You wrote the information down on a piece of paper and left it at your desk. Why would you think that piece of paper is privileged? Yes, it was on your desk (is this your private desk or one you share with other shifts), and in your handwriting, but you knew this Mr. Doe was someone who would be browsing. Some people just cannot help but look what is on another's desk. Fact of life. You should understand that no one leaves things on a desk that someone else could come along and take. If the information was that important, you should have put it in your pocket.

Without Mr. Doe here to defend his actions, I am not going to say if what he did was wrong. I don't know what was on that paper. To say Mr. Doe is a "rat" - I do not know that either. I have worked in places where that kind of action is allowed and encouraged - the looking over other employees shoulders to catch them doing something not quite kosher.

Am sorry I am not really on your side here and I am not on Mr. Doe's side either. I just wonder what all really transpired.

Lenovo · Jun 10, 2007, 06:32 AM

Thank you for the response, and I do appreciate your honesty. To go a little more in depth, I was told by my boss that we may go on the internet, even if seeking information for ourselves, as long as its not an innappropriate site, he gave examples such as myspace/chat rooms, pornographic sites, or any site that depicts and/or promotes violence. And I was completely within the boundaries, it wasn't a chat room, or myspace, it wasn porn, and it had no violence relating to it at all. The information were a few spells I was looking for, and I'm thinking maybe Mr. Doe didn't like it, or wasn't into that stuff, so he decided to give it to my boss. However, I know my boss isn't really into that kind of stuff either. As for the desk, it's the same desk for all three shifts.

shygrneyzs · Jun 10, 2007, 08:03 AM

Did your boss ever write that computer policy down? Not sying that he would go back on what he said, but it has been known to happen to people before. I had a supervisor who would tell her regional office heads something and would never back her staff up on it. Her famous words, "you can't quote me on that." It got so that we started to refuse to comply with her until she wrote it all down on an official memo, so at least we had some paper trail on her.

Mr Doe sounds like someone who might not really like his job and is looking for ways to increase his value there. Why else would he take it upon himself to be the bearer of news to your boss? It could well be because of the nature of the information. Spells can be considered part of a religious practice. Work and religion don't mix, unless you work for a church or company (you know what I mean).

You can bet that Mr. Doe will follow up with your boss and ask if he got the piece of paper you wrote on. Can you beat Mr. Doe to this? Explain to your boss what happened and how you handled it. Ask your boss how he would have wanted you to handle the situation. That opens the communication and tells your boss that you are willing to learn from him and keep the lesson for future needs. I would do it that way and try to diffuse Mr. Doe. If there is a lump to be taken by your boss, take it and go forward. It shows you are not trying to be deceitful.

Good luck to you.

JoeCanada76 · Jun 10, 2007, 08:09 AM

Originally Posted by shygrneyzs

My question is, when you sat at that computer and looked for information, were you within your boundaries? Was it information you had a right to look at and was the information considered needed for your job? Or were you at a site you had no business on, getting information that was not lined to your job?

You wrote the information down on a piece of paper and left it at your desk. Why would you think that piece of paper is privileged? Yes, it was on your desk (is this your private desk or one you share with other shifts), and in your handwriting, but you knew this Mr. Doe was someone who would be browsing. Some people just cannot help but look what is on another's desk. Fact of life. You should understand that no one leaves things on a desk that someone else could come along and take. If the information was that important, you should have put it in your pocket.

Without Mr. Doe here to defend his actions, I am not going to say if what he did was wrong. I don't know what was on that paper. To say Mr. Doe is a "rat" - I do not know that either. I have worked in places where that kind of action is allowed and encouraged - the looking over other employees shoulders to catch them doing something not quite kosher.

Am sorry I am not really on your side here and I am not on Mr. Doe's side either. I just wonder what all really transpired.

I have worked in places where that kind of action is allowed and encouraged - the looking over other employees shoulders to catch them doing something not quite kosher.

You know what. I work in a place like that every single day. It is not nice having to look over your shoulders all the time and workers trying to kiss the bosses butt just to make themselves look better.

Joe

Lenovo · Jun 10, 2007, 08:13 AM

I would try that only, the thing is, like I said I know my boss isn't into that stuff, and maybe he might justify that as a reason to get rid of me, I just don't want to set myself up. My original plan was to simply not say anything, and if my boss asked me, deny everything, and act like I don't know what either one of them is talking about. Then, hopefully, my boss would think its some type of spirit or something playing a trick on the co-worker.

JoeCanada76 · Jun 10, 2007, 08:16 AM

Originally Posted by Lenovo

I would try that only, the thing is, like I said I know my boss isn't into that stuff, and maybe he might justify that as a reason to get rid of me, I just dont want to set myself up. My origional plan was to simply not say anything, and if my boss asked me, deny everything, and act like I dont know what either one of them is talking about. Then, hopefully, my boss would think its some type of spirit or something playing a trick on the co-worker.

Maybe it is not your co worker.

Maybe it is a spirit or something playiing a trick on you??

The possibility is there especially where you work and the things your interested in??

Lenovo · Jun 10, 2007, 08:22 AM

Wow, I didn't even think of that, but then why would HIS handwriting be on the paper saying its mine? I'm almost positive it was him, he's done similar things before. For example, I printed out the weather report, and I forgot to pick it up from the printer, and he turned it to my boss saying I was "misusing th printer".

But I didn't think a spirit would be playing the trick on me because I didn't just haphazradly jump into this, I've been practicing this kind of stuff for a little over a year. I feel I have become quite friendly with the spirit world, then again, maybe the spirit world is just having some casual fun with me, showing spirits do have a "sense" of humor.

Wondergirl · Jun 10, 2007, 08:36 AM

Another thing to think about--You removed your papers from your boss's mailbox. At the place where I work, the rule is that no one removes anything from anyone's mailbox unless he/she has explicit permission from the owner (and can prove that later). If Mr. Doe tells the boss that he put those papers into the boss's box and you later removed them from the boss's box, will that be a problem?

I agree with someone earlier who said that you should beat Mr. Doe to the boss and throw yourself on the boss's mercy.

JoeCanada76 · Jun 10, 2007, 08:40 AM

Originally Posted by Wondergirl

Another thing to think about--You removed your papers from your boss's mailbox. At the place where I work, the rule is that no one removes anything from anyone's mailbox unless he/she has explicit permission from the owner (and can prove that later). If Mr. Doe tells the boss that he put those papers into the boss's box and you later removed them from the boss's box, will that be a problem?

I agree with someone earlier who said that you should beat Mr. Doe to the boss and throw yourself on the boss's mercy.

The thing is, I think that this person should not have put his personal papers in the bosses box in the first place. These were his papers, hand written for that matter. It would be one persons word against somebody else's. There is no proof.

Joe

Wondergirl · Jun 10, 2007, 08:49 AM

But cyber-nephew Joe, Lenovo said that "know[ing] how Mr. Doe is, I looked in another mailbox and sure enough, they were there, in my bosses mailbox, with Mr. Doe's handwriting, my name written in the corner." Mr. Doe's argument to the boss might be that Mr. Doe's handwriting is on one of the papers and then he, in fact, put them in the boss's box. It would give Mr. Doe's case a little bit more weight.

If the mailboxes are not "holy", like they are at my workplace, there's no problem with Lenovo's removing her papers from the boss's box.

(I'm beginning to feel like this is one of Sherlock Holmes' cases.)

Lenovo · Jun 10, 2007, 08:57 AM

Originally Posted by Jesushelper76

The thing is, I think that this person should not have put his personal papers in the bosses box in the first place. These were his papers, hand written for that matter. It would be one persons word against somebody elses. There is no proof.

Joe

Exactly, even if he did tell the boss he put the papers their, like I said, I can easily deny it, there's no cameras watching the boxes, no workers guarding the boxes, no one saw me take the papers out, so as J-helper said, its my word against his.

JoeCanada76 · Jun 10, 2007, 09:25 AM

Originally Posted by Wondergirl

But cyber-nephew Joe, Lenovo said that "know[ing] how Mr. Doe is, I looked in another mailbox and sure enough, they were there, in my bosses mailbox, with Mr. Doe's handwriting, my name written in the corner." Mr. Doe's argument to the boss might be that Mr. Doe's handwriting is on one of the papers and then he, in fact, put them in the boss's box. It would give Mr. Doe's case a little bit more weight.

If the mailboxes are not "holy", like they are at my workplace, there's no problem with Lenovo's removing her papers from the boss's box.

(I'm beginning to feel like this is one of Sherlock Holmes' cases.)

I think you are right.

(I'm beginning to feel like this is one of Sherlock Holmes' cases.)

Lenovo · Jun 10, 2007, 09:39 AM

Originally Posted by Wondergirl

If the mailboxes are not "holy", like they are at my workplace, there's no problem with Lenovo's removing her papers from the boss's box.

(I'm beginning to feel like this is one of Sherlock Holmes' cases.)

OK, for the record, I'm a guy.

Wondergirl · Jun 10, 2007, 09:47 AM

Yes, they were personal papers and handwritten, but Lenovo left them out in public and in plain sight, so they were fair game for anyone to trash or read or take home or whatever. Of course, the honorable thing for anyone would have been to hand them to Lenovo and say, "Hey, are these yours? I found them near the computer." Lenovo should have been more responsible with personal stuff. (But then, how many times has each of us done the same kind of thing?? )

Sorry that I made you a "her", Lenovo. "Lenova" would be a " would be a ".

JoeCanada76 · Jun 10, 2007, 09:48 AM

Originally Posted by Lenovo

ok, for the record, I'm a guy.

Ouch, that stings. Well just for the record, I knew you were a guy the whole time.

We all make blunders sometimes, I missed that one until you pointed it out.

I personally think you should go with your instincts and do what is best for you. You know what I think about it already.

Best of luck with everything.

Joe

JoeCanada76 · Jun 10, 2007, 09:50 AM

I also think you should take all of the advice here given. Whether you agree with it or not. We all have different opinions and takes on it. I think you should look at all the advice and figure out what would be the best outcome in your situaiton.

excon · Jun 10, 2007, 09:56 AM

Hello Len:

You did nothing wrong. Therefore, you have nothing to deny, and no reason to ask for forgiveness or mercy.

You DO have a political problem, however. Since, you have nothing to hide, I would do the opposite of hiding and disclose everything. Here's what I would do:

Put the papers back along with your own letter explaining what you did and what you found, and WHERE you found it. Mention that you expressly did NOT want to remove them from his mailbox. (I think wondergirl is right!) He'll figure out who the good guy is. If he doesn't, it's time to move on.

You're always going to have snitches and back stabbers around. You've just got to be one step ahead of them. Don't let yourself get embroiled into their trap. Act - don't react!

excon

QueenD · Jun 10, 2007, 09:58 AM

I would say be a man an own up to what you did if asked, but you have people that will try anything to hurt someone else. Maybe this Mr Doe is a very depressed person and feels that he needs to be in charge. When you are in corrections you tend to be bossy telling the inmates what to do and when he retired he feels less than a man when it comes to authority. I would say talk to Doe and see if he has a problem with you and what have you done to him for him to be so spiteful towards you.

Lenovo · Jun 10, 2007, 10:00 AM

Originally Posted by Wondergirl

Yes, they were personal papers and handwritten, but Lenovo left them out in public and in plain sight, so they were fair game for anyone to trash or read or take home or whatever. Of course, the honorable thing for anyone would have been to hand them to Lenovo and say, "Hey, are these yours? I found them near the computer." Lenovo should have been more responsible with personal stuff. (But then, how many times has each of us done the same kind of thing????)

Sorry that I made you a "her", Lenovo. "Lenova" would be a "her".

Exactly my point, I would have liked him to either put the papers in my box, or give them to me. Not go behind my back and put them in my bosses mailbox. What if I completely forgot about them and my boss saw them? Then I certainly would have gotten an a** reaming. I really think he is going out of his way to try and get me fired. I don't know, maybe I'm just paranoid.