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 Originally Posted by 10cats
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Another dok lee video and book on eBay "art of controlled violence".
If anyone cares. Well you know, life goes on. People believe me or not. I have told the truth or not. Be safe. Be well. I know my life is not average, and most people don't believe a word I say. But honestly just because you did not witness it, does not mean it didn't happen. |
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No, there are plenty of things that can be proven that we have not directly witnessed. You, however, can provide no substantiation whatsoever for your claims, which means they are false.
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Hi ,
To shed light on all this KUTA controversy. Firstly It is real. Secondly I neither doubt nor endorse mr woodalls claims, for I do not know him, nor do I want to judge him based on a few comments left on a forum board. I personally have trained with Al Abidin, I have Jack Savages material, and I have the DOK Lee package. Also I was introduced to Kuta (HIKUTA was a term according to my original teacher that the company that made the book/video package coined to make it sound more commercial- and DOK Lee didn't care for the name) From a coworker, who personally knew and trained with DOK Lee or Lee (leroy?) Crull (as ypu can easily learn from the internet). My trainer which I will not name, but will call FRED, was with Lee until he passed, and started a business with Lee and another gentelmen to train kuta (hence the "other" site nobody seems to know who started - crossover-. FRED and the other gentlemen (not Lee) apperared on the danny bonaducii radio show in dtroit back in '97 which I have the recording of the live broadcast where danny gets flown back over the couch and bites his tonge and starts shaking. I have a video to prove FRED's involvement with lee, as they appear together training on it. I also Have footage of Lee training someone back in the summer of '92, going over all types of strikes, and multiple attacker scenarios as well as commentary that solidifies that mans credibilty (in my opinion). The problem I think a lot of people have is because it is possible to deliver a kuta blow with very little practice, it is rare and intermittant. In my experience you need to develop your strtle or sneeze reflex by doing the hot stove drills relentlessly and religiously... after that it is very important that you practice the moves as fluently (fluidly) as posslibly SLOWLY, gradually working up your speed... until you master each move... When done properly the move is done instantaneously with EXPLOSIVE SPEED AND ENERGY, triggered from the MIND!. When it is done properly you will say to yourself WOW how did that happen! It happens so fast your body becomes auto pilot mode. There is also an element to KUTA that I think sometimes gets lost in translation... That is the gentleness of the strike and contact, which is infintesimal... You are loose and relaxed when doing this art, it is VERY HARD TO BREAK YOURSELF FROM BEING RIGID AND IN CONTOL OF YOUR BODY!! I leave it at that! Sincerely and respectfully CODY FISHER ([email protected]) |
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Sadly phil still confuses me not jumping hoops for him, as me not being able to prove what I say. I have proof, but I am not going to waste time trying to convince doubters.
Certainly codini you are right, and correct about 'highlights of kuta' otherwise called hikuta. You are reasonable and wise to not trust everyone at their word. Certainly dok lee was great, and well able to teach many. Perhaps I am greater, perhaps not, but I did defeat him in combat, using hikuta, while he was using hikuta. Indeed he said no one would get the title of dok , if I did not accept it, because no one else was worthy. I waited until after his death to publicly accept the title, out of respect toward dok lee. Dok lee did not teach me, I learned from another teacher, my teacher's master also taught me. Yes I learned hikuta before (but just barely) drbill, although I did not learn it from dok lee. Yes proper technique comes before power in practice of learning to repeat a strike well. And certainly in many martial arts slow practice develops not only the 'practice' of the art, but also the smaller more fine muscles build and get used to the positions of the 'art', and so allow one to be more exact, because of the gaining of muscle to control exact moves. |
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For Mr. Woodall... Out of curiosity, Did your teacher call it the ancient science of KUTA, or did he give it a different name? did he have any ideas where he thought it originated from? Also, did he know Lee? I am not a doubter, but someone always trying to learn more about this fascinating art 'eating the meat and spitting out the bones'.
When I watch my DOK LEE strikes training tape (not something you can buy on eBay or from anyone for that matter), that is over an hour long, and has DOK Lee going over many, many moves, in all different scenarios, I have a feeling of awe! It is truly an incredible honor for me to have been introduced to this "Science"... Watching him move and "go through the motions" is for me a very humbling and fascinating experience. When I first "did it" correctly, I knew it was real... I, out of stupidity thought I would try a pulled punch, on my sister (willing doubter, my same age) while she held a phone book. I was going to barely touch the face of the phone book while she held it to her body. I tried the fisrt time... nothing, we both started to laugh... I tried a second time and WHAM!! I barely touched the book, but my body moved so fast and my hand whipped so quickly, it was almost unbelievable... I remembered thinking to myself , I have never moved that fast before. Truly I was on autopilot mode, My body was triggered to move in the trained motion, with explosive instantaneous speed, from my mind thinking of the strike. My sister just stood there, I did not think I "got her" but I asked, well, did you feel anything? She just stood there as tears rolled down her face, she was not crying though... I told her to sit and she did... a few moments later she started talking, she said, what the hell was that? She said it felt like a concentrated bolt of lightning went through her chest and reentered and ran down her left arm! I said what? Are you serious, and she was dead serious... I felt bad. For a few days after that she said she felt like she had been in a car accident. I realized then, I should no longer practice on my sister, or anyone for that matter. |
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Just to say more about myself... I am currently 27, but learned kuta and did my first "wallop" (on my sister) within the first week of learning of the mechanics and principles at the age of 24. But want to clarify that you need to train the mind to train the body to train the mind before you can start to trigger this inherent ability we all have.
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"Kuta" is a fiction and anyone claiming to have mastered its incredible powers is either deluded or lying.
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Hi Phil... I have known of you for awhile, and have read your rebuttals and such... I find it interesting that you continue to debate the art if you feel it is non-sence. I often wonder why you put so much energy into it, You can't do it, so it must be untrue.. . For me it is very real, but I do understand why you may feel it is fiction, if you cannot produce the effects. For if I did not experience it myslef I may have though the same way. There are high level Kung Fu styles called "internal" that produce the same type of effects, and in my opinion operate on the same source of power within the body. For example Mr. Al Colangelo of MIND BOXING . Com. He is not an endorser of KUTA but trains in the same principles, of KNOWN martial arts in the KUNG FU world. I am no martial arts experet, In fact I know no fighting skills other than my street fighting I learned from having 3 older brothers around. The Kuta I have learned and practice is something I keep in my back pocket if my life is ever threatened. I don't feel this is something that martial artists and "hobbyists" should or need to get involved with.
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I continue to point out that it is nonsense because I hate the thought of honest students of self-defense wasting their time and money on it -- not to mention getting a false sense of security from learning a contrived system with a made-up history that won't really help them in an emergency. It's that simple.
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Well, that is where you are dead wrong Phil! In an emergency most martial arts fail to work because you freeze up... with KUTA your reaction happens instantly, afterward you have to think, what just happened.
Now Phil, I don't dislike you, and I don't want to start a bashing thread here... I just thought it was about time I said something concerning KUTA. I think your reasoning behind bashing KUTA is ill conceived at best. Not because you obviously cannot effectively do it, but rather because KUTA is not something that is taught in your neighborhood dojo, or self defense class, therfore people trying to learn BASIC self defence need not worry about being led astray... Most people IN the martial arts community in general never even heard of it so, I don't understand that logic... That being said, if you are serious about wanting to learn KUTA, I urge you to open your mind, and throw out all your prior training and natural tendencies, and give these few tips an honest and sincere try. First, you must practice all these drills with a RELAXED PHYSIOLOGY, MIND AND BODY. Second, remember the strike is TRIGGERED from the mind, the difference between throwing a bullet and firing a bullet. No matter how fast you are, your natural reflex or startle is faster, if you let it happen It's a matter of hardwiring your body... training the mind to train the body to train the mind. Third... you must mentally practice as much as physically practice. For instance the hot stove drill... picture an explosion in your mind... and trigger the body movement... in other words the thought becomes the strike Fourth RELAX RELAX RELAX... I like to consider it like hitting like a "wussy Girl"... Completely opposite of what most people do. Maybe why women have an easier time learning KUTA If you do it right you will not even feel the strike in your hand... you will not even really have control of your body for that split second of time. The trained movement will happen with the quickness and power of an explosion, triggered by the thought of striking in your mind. Practice. Practice, Practice, but practice the RIGHT WAY!! Loose and realxed is totally the key, as well as practicing with your mind, maybe more so than the physical movement itself. Phil, I Respect your comments, and I by no means think you are going to have an easy time with this, but I honestly and sincerely leave these tips, so that maybe you will re-think your position on something, that obviously grabbed your attention. Remember, it takes a lot of time to learn how to strike relaxed, and LET GO... letting your mind do the work. |
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Originally Posted by coopcuk
There are three sources of exposure to this contrived, made-up system. There's the Lee Crull ("DOK Lee") book and video package from the 1990s, videos made by his student Al Abidin, and videos made by his other student, Jack "Savage" Sellner. Abidin does seminars, too. Anyone who has learned the system learned from one of those people -- Abidin and Sellner are the only known students of Lee Crull active today. |
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Originally Posted by Codini
Everyone's time, effort, and money are better spent on legitimate martial systems than this ridiculous "Kuta" and "Hikuta" nonsense. |
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Well, Phil... I know for a FACT That there are at least 3 others that have been trained personally by DOK Lee. The guy on the video tape I have being trained (although the guy kind of looks like Al, it clearly is not him), and the two gentlemen that started the crossover business with him in the late 90's before he passed away. I think the training I have had (by my teacher and, mostly that on the strikes training tape)is more in depth than that of which Al or even Savage teach. I think by watching Lee move, and explain things on my video, anyone can clearly see this is no noncence at all, in fact it is quite amazing. I encourage you to provide me your personal e-mail address so that I might supply you with a small piece of evidence of my claims. I am not going to do this to try and convince you KUTA is real, rather to make you realize that KUTA is no more unrealisitic than the "internal" styles of Kung Fu... What do you think of Bruce Lees one inch puch? What do you think of Mr. Al Colangelo, and his trainer Mr Willie Wetzel?how about the video where Al Colangelo produces the shockwave through the lineup of guys (similar to how I "got" my sister) Its obvious to me that there are mysteries to the body, some call 'chi', that enable us to protect ourselfes in a mysterious and wonderous way, as God made us that way indeed, I personally choose to take advantage of that ability.
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No, you don't, and no, you didn't, and no, you aren't.
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Phil, I think at this point, your so deeply against KUTA, you don't want it to be proven to you. You didn't answer any of my questions, and are not even willing to examine some evidence... You are truly a fool of fools.
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Phil, I did tell that person who asked about my experiences, but not all of it did I put out on the board for public knowledge. Some of it I used the private message of this site to tell him and only him. Some things I am willing to tell anyone so I post it, other stuff I choose to remain private, and by the way phil, in the class when I was trained hikuta, there were 8 other people being trained at the same time. And there were classes earlier years before that. So my teacher, and his master taught me before drbill ever learned, but many others learned as well. In some styles you choose if a student proves himself worthy before you consider teaching, perhaps you are not ready to learn hikuta yet phil.
Maybe someday you will develop enough to be able to understand. But if you never learn hikuta phil that is okay, most police don't have to pull a gun in an entire career on the force, so perhaps you would never need it. After all phil you claim you can do a lot with the martial arts training you already have, and I believe it. Codini, the problem with phil and most middle level martial artists is a refusal to grasp that other martial arts can be of use. They hold to what they know about being able to do some moderate thing, and that is all they want. That is okay. I know some people who don't want to learn martial arts or any other way to try to protect themselves. That is okay. You and I have to realize, people can choose to be martyrs, people can choose to lose fights, people can choose to be helpless. Some people are not convinced no matter what happens. I have many a time knocked out professional boxers who were violent for no reason with me, I always explained they needed to stop, but if they did not, oh well. Beyond all that, as well as being the highest ranked martial artist in the world, I also have other abilities, and skillsets, attributes, training, purpose that allows me to do well when others would not have a chance, indeed my experience in such combat allows me to easily do what most can not birth. People often do not believe what happens in front of them, much less different viewpoints give different witness testimony, so do well and achieve. Be safe. 'respect your elders or at least your betters' eawoodall |
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You are both deluded and you are feeding each other's delusions. This is very, very dangerous because it's going to get both of you hurt, sooner or later; a false sense of confidence created by the false belief that you are capable of defending yourselves is doing you a huge disservice. It is my hope that one day both of you will let this fiction go and actually take the time and the effort to study a serious self-defense system, but I don't see either of you being willing to take that step. You're both too entrenched in what you want to believe.
This is fairly typical of people who embrace these contrived, easily digested fake systems. |
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This is my last "post" on this subject. I simply want to say that Phil, You are are babbling Moron. I think you are and idiot. Not your fault, your parents are probably idiots too! Most, allmost ALL Practitioners of HIKUTA are well trained, and proficient in many different POPULAR styles of martial arts, including those who commercially teach HIKUTA. Therefore it is non sense for you to say that we as a group are incapable of defending ourselfes, when you endorse the same martial arts systems. I personally am one of the VERY FEW people who chose not to study a martial art prior to learninig of KUTA because A) it never interested me before. B) I have been in enough fights to know what to do and what not to do, in a REAL situation from my experineces I have had already had growing up. C) I have never been impressed with anyone claiming to be a "blackbelt", when it comes down to a real fight, the first with the most, always gets the better deal D) as an adult I find it very RARE I will even be in a fight nowadays, because I know how to avoid those situations altogether. Except for the fact that I may be robbed, or jumped at some point in my life, beyond my control, I have as good a chance as anyone including YOU at surviving the attack, WITHOUT defending myself. If someone sticks a gun in my face and asks me for my wallet, out of the blue. I would glady give my wallet, to avoid trying to be a "hero" for a few bucks. You on the other hand would probably faint, because you are a mama's boy. I can tell by your appearance, and I am sure even if you did have enough hair on your nuts to use your "training" it would end up with you being shot! Here in Detroit, there's no such thing as a "hero". My KUTA abilities, are however A great resource I have developed, I am confident that if I need to use it, I will be able to, and most importantly, I will not need to look like a HOLLYWOOD HERO when doing it. I hope I never have to use it.
Nobody can outdance a bullet, and you Phil, are no different. Oh wait, your martial arts training shows you how to catch bullets with your teeth, I forgot |
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So, when confronted with the fact that you're deluding yourself by advocating a contrived martial system with an obviously made-up history, as detailed in the following articles...
"DOK Lee" Book Analysis "DOK Lee" Video Package Analysis Jack "Savage" Video Analysis ... your response is simply to start calling names like an angry child? That's not very surprising. People like you, who lack the ability and the will to pursue any real sort of martial training over the long term, often cling to these made-up systems and then get very, very angry when challenged on them. I feel sorry for you; if "Kuta" made you capable of defending yourself, or if you at least knew that it didn't and therefore didn't have a false sense of confidence, you'd be much better off than you are now. Good luck. You'll need it. |
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