Originally Posted by
schwedjesk
If it were useful in a fight you would see it in the Ultimate Fighting Championship or similar events.
I hate to disagree with you, but you are incorrect. UFC rules, and those of the other MMA leagues list the following "fouls"
Fouls: [Top]
1.
Butting with the head.
2.
Eye gouging of any kind.
3. Biting.
4.
Hair pulling.
5.
Fish hooking.
6.
Groin attacks of any kind.
7.
Putting a finger into any orifice or into any cut or laceration on an opponent.
8.
Small joint manipulation.
9.
Striking to the spine or the back of the head.
10.
Striking downward using the point of the elbow.
11.
Throat strikes of any kind, including, without limitation, grabbing the trachea.
12.
Clawing, pinching or twisting the flesh.
13.
Grabbing the clavicle.
14. Kicking the head of a grounded opponent.
15. Kneeing the head of a grounded opponent.
16. Stomping a grounded opponent.
17.
Kicking to the kidney with the heel.
18. Spiking an opponent to the canvas on his head or neck.
19. Throwing an opponent out of the ring or fenced area.
20. Holding the shorts or gloves of an opponent.
21. Spitting at an opponent.
22. Engaging in an unsportsmanlike conduct that causes an injury to an opponent.
23. Holding the ropes or the fence.
24. Using abusive language in the ring or fenced area.
25. Attacking an opponent on or during the break.
26. Attacking an opponent who is under the care of the referee.
27. Attacking an opponent after the bell has sounded the end of the period of unarmed combat.
28. Flagrantly disregarding the instructions of the referee.
29. Timidity, including, without limitation, avoiding contact with an opponent, intentionally or consistently dropping the mouthpiece or faking an injury.
30. Interference by the corner.
31. Throwing in the towel during competition.
The ones that I bolded are rules that specifically prohibit pressure point and joint manipulation attacks. So your statement is incorrect. If these types of attacks were allowed, they certainly would be used. And in fact, in true no rules fighting (which UFC was in the beginning) such techniques are used. In fact, Royce Gracie used many pressure points and joint manipulation techniques (without people recognizing it) during the first few UFC events, before they created rules for them.
You will get these die hard pressure point practitioners telling you that it is too dangerous to use in that situation. If they can practice it with fellow practitioners and not kill them then why not in the UFC etc.
Hey, it's MMA that banned their use. Why not ask them?
In my opinon it is more of an art like Tai Chi. There is nothing wrong with that you just have to realize its limitations. A one year Brazillian Jiu-Jitsu guy can beat a 10 pressure point guy. I guarantee it.
Do you have evidence to prove it? Because I have recently seen the exact opposite... a BJJ guy who walked into a Kyusho Jutsu dojo and tried to tell the Sensei he could help him teach.
The Sensei put him up against a friend of mine, a 2nd dan, and the BJJ guy took about 20 minutes to manage to even grab hold of the Kyusho guy. Every time he tried to grab the Kyusho guy, he got jabbed in various pressure points and was forced to let go. Even when the BJJ guy tried to shoot the Kyusho guy, the Kyusho guy jabbed him in various points on the sides and back of the neck, and forced the BJJ guy to back off. After 20 minutes, the BJJ guy managed to finally do a shooting take-down, but was never able to gain control because the Kyusho guy grabbed his fingers and bent them backward... and where the fingers go, so goes the rest of the body. Yeah, it broke the rules of MMA, but a real fight has no rules. (The teacher also pointed out that if a BJJ guy managed to get a takedown and mount someone during a bar-fight, his opponent's friends would kick the stuffing out of him as he rolled around on the ground. BJJ is great in a one-on-one fight, but street fights and bar fights are rarely just one-on-one. BJJ is almost useless against multiple opponents.)
So I question whether your statement that a 1-year BJJ guy can beat a 10-year pressure point guy. Or perhaps the BJJ guy in question had less than 1-year of experience. :confused:
But again, something that most BJJ and MMA guys fail to notice is that quite a few of their techniques are pressure point techniques. A T-cross arm bar is essentially an attack against the TW-12 pressure point on the back of the elbow using the hips as the fulcrum rather than the arm. A bare-naked-choke-hold is an attack against several pressure points in the neck that are used by Kyusho guys as well. A leg-lock is a joint attack that falls into the teachings of both Chin Na and Kyusho Jutsu.
Do you really think that the best MMA fighters fail to study the anatomy of fighting... where to hit (head, body, kidneys, legs, etc.) and at what angle and with which technique? Of course they do. They aim for specific points in order to get the knockout or the TKO. THAT is pressure point fighting, whether they learn the names of the points or not. They tend to aim most often for the parts of the body where pressure points are clustered so that if they miss one, they hit another. That way they don't need the precision of a Kyusho fighter. But the theory is the same... aim for the parts of the body that are weakest, use that weakness to force the opponent into a specific position or action that gives you control over him. (ei: a body-blow that forces the opponent to double over so that you can follow up with an uppercut, or a ground-and-pound that forces the opponent to give you his back so that you can get the rear naked choke). The only difference that I see is with regard to the precission of the techniques.
And in fact, Kyusho jutsu doesn't teach a specific fighting style... it is a concept that can be applied to any fighting style, from Grecco Roman wrestling to MMA, to Tai Chi to Karate to American boxing. It just teaches you WHERE to hit for maximum effect by giving you an understanding of anatomy and areas of greatest weakness on an opponent.
As a side note, Muhhamud Ali used to spar with George Dillman, the person who brought pressure point fighting into American martial arts. Clearly Ali saw something that Dillman had to offer. Otherwise, why would the world's greatest boxer (at least at that time) bother with some know-nothing karate guy who had nothing to show him?
Something to think about.