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    excon's Avatar
    excon Posts: 21,482, Reputation: 2992
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    #1

    Jul 26, 2009, 11:12 AM
    In Jesus's name, or not
    Hello Christians:

    Does it diminish a prayer if the prayer leader ends it with just a plain Amen, instead of "in the name of Jesus, Amen"?

    I ask, because as I watch the NASCAR race, I'm offended when they pray to Jesus. It kind of leaves ME OUT. I don't like to be left out.

    I've also heard them end their invocation INCLUSIVELY, too. That is WITHOUT mention of Jesus. Are THOSE prayers less effective than those when Jesus's name is invoked?

    excon

    PS> Yeah, I complained about it right here several years ago... It STILL pisses me off.
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,025, Reputation: 5431
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    #2

    Jul 26, 2009, 11:19 AM

    Adding "in Jesus' name" definitely makes it a Christian prayer (Mooresville area IS part of the Bible Belt, if that's where the races are held -- my old stompin' grounds).

    Hmmmm, I'm guessing (educated guess) that any prayer honestly prayed is good to go, mention of Jesus or not. I don't imagine God picks around through all the prayers and tosses out the non-Jesus ones.
    jenniepepsi's Avatar
    jenniepepsi Posts: 4,042, Reputation: 533
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    #3

    Jul 26, 2009, 11:34 AM

    I agree with WG. I firmly believe that god doesn't worrie about what your words say. He listens to your heart. I don't think it makes any difference to god if we invoke jesus' name or not. I believe god to be more tolerant than that.
    Fr_Chuck's Avatar
    Fr_Chuck Posts: 81,301, Reputation: 7692
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    #4

    Jul 26, 2009, 12:59 PM

    It divides who you are praying to.

    When they prayed to a "mother goddess" at a music event I walked out till the prayer was over.

    If you are not christian, merely don't pray with a christian prayer.
    excon's Avatar
    excon Posts: 21,482, Reputation: 2992
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    #5

    Jul 26, 2009, 02:17 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Fr_Chuck View Post
    If you are not christian, merely don't pray with a christian prayer.
    Hello Padre:

    The thing is, you can't tell if it's a Christian prayer until they make it one at the end. It ain't right to say the whole thing and get snookered at the end.

    excon
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,025, Reputation: 5431
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    #6

    Jul 26, 2009, 02:22 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by excon View Post
    Hello Padre:

    The thing is, you can't tell if it's a Christian prayer until they make it one at the end. It ain't right to say the whole thing and get snookered at the end.

    excon
    If Jesus didn't creep into the prayer before the ending, consider it just a regular prayer. Some pray-ers remember at the end "we gotta stick Jesus' name on this or it ain't a Christian prayer" so heck it's just a name. Jesus was a Jew and good guy, so go with it.
    N0help4u's Avatar
    N0help4u Posts: 19,823, Reputation: 2035
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    #7

    Jul 27, 2009, 06:32 AM

    It doesn't leave you out of prayers EX.
    Prayers are said FOR US and interceded THROUGH Jesus.
    For example:
    Like a kid (you/us/we) goes to mommy (representing Jesus here) and asks mommy to intercede for him to daddy (representing God)
    To please reconsider an answer.
    Should the kid be pissed off at mommy because he asked through mom?

    Prayers can end in either Amen or in Jesus name
    They are still prayers either way
    Amen means so be it
    Jesus name means you are asking him to intercede
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,706, Reputation: 173
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    #8

    Jul 27, 2009, 03:44 PM
    It's that damned PC again EX you can't use the name of Jesus in a public place because you might offend someone. If Christians have come together in prayer I don't see the point of tacking Jesus name on it because when we are gathered in his name we have the assurance he is in the midst, but out in the open spaces at a secular event you would need to be specific

    One day Christians will learn that you have to go all the way
    s_cianci's Avatar
    s_cianci Posts: 5,472, Reputation: 760
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    #9

    Jul 27, 2009, 03:59 PM
    Any believing Christian will end a prayer "in Jesus' name" because a fundamental tenet of the Christian faith is that Jesus is the mediator between God and man (as in 'humanity.') But let me ask you this ; even if you don't believe in Jesus (perhaps in other than a strictly historical context), why would you be offended by the mention of his name? After all, if you truly don't believe, then it's not real and that's that and anyone who thinks it is is a poor deluded fool ; hardly worth taking offense at. Pity maybe, but not offense. After all, I don't believe in Santa Claus but I'm not offended by little children who do. And I don't get offended when I see people dressed in Santa costumes in department stores talking to children and posing for pictures with them. So why is it any different when it comes to religious matters?
    excon's Avatar
    excon Posts: 21,482, Reputation: 2992
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    #10

    Jul 27, 2009, 04:04 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by s_cianci View Post
    why would you be offended by the mention of his name? After all, if you truly don't believe, then it's not real and that's that
    Hello again, s:

    You're ordinarily a pretty smart man... But, I guess when it comes to religious matters, you lose your mind...

    Why was I offended?? For the same reason YOU would be if they ended a NASCAR invocation with the words "in Allah's name we prey".

    excon
    s_cianci's Avatar
    s_cianci Posts: 5,472, Reputation: 760
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    #11

    Jul 27, 2009, 04:18 PM
    For the same reason YOU would be if they ended a NASCAR invocation with the words "in Allah's name we prey".
    But that's just it, I wouldn't be offended. I'd probably laugh out loud and think it was a very foolish prayer but I wouldn't be offended. I might be a little annoyed at having spent 30 sec. or a min. of my time listening to a worthless prayer but still not offended. Now, if the admonition "in Allah's name" were followed by an act of violence like a bomb going off in which innocent people were maimed or killed because "Allah told us to do it", then yes, that would offend me. But simply stating a belief in "Allah" or any other "god" isn't going to offend me in the least. After all, they're entitled to their beliefs too, foolish though they may be.
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,025, Reputation: 5431
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    #12

    Jul 27, 2009, 05:25 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by excon View Post
    "in Allah's name we prey"
    Was that a Freudian slip? Prey = plunder ; pray = call for help
    s_cianci's Avatar
    s_cianci Posts: 5,472, Reputation: 760
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    #13

    Jul 27, 2009, 05:39 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Wondergirl View Post
    Was that a Freudian slip? prey = plunder ; pray = call for help
    Yep - Freudian slip!
    JudyKayTee's Avatar
    JudyKayTee Posts: 46,503, Reputation: 4600
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    #14

    Jul 27, 2009, 05:41 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Wondergirl View Post
    Was that a Freudian slip? prey = plunder ; pray = call for help


    An award winning Freudian slip - hmmm.
    jmjoseph's Avatar
    jmjoseph Posts: 2,727, Reputation: 1244
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    #15

    Jul 27, 2009, 06:22 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by excon View Post
    Hello again, s:

    You're ordinarily a pretty smart man... But, I guess when it comes to religious matters, you lose your mind.....

    Why was I offended??????? For the same reason YOU would be if they ended a NASCAR invocation with the words "in Allah's name we prey".

    excon
    Prey, Love it. Points for our Jewish parolee. I got it. I'm a Christian , and understand completely that we shouldn't exclude, insult , or offend. Life is not easy when you've got big feet walking on eggshells. Especially when you've got one in your mouth, like I usually do.
    jenniepepsi's Avatar
    jenniepepsi Posts: 4,042, Reputation: 533
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    #16

    Jul 27, 2009, 06:50 PM

    What is so hard about being loving and accepting?
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,025, Reputation: 5431
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    #17

    Jul 27, 2009, 06:52 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by jenniepepsi View Post
    what is so hard about being loving and accepting?
    Heck, we love and accept even EXCON!!
    jenniepepsi's Avatar
    jenniepepsi Posts: 4,042, Reputation: 533
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    #18

    Jul 27, 2009, 07:12 PM

    Lol there isn't anything wrong with excon :P
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,706, Reputation: 173
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    #19

    Jul 27, 2009, 08:08 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by s_cianci View Post
    Any believing Christian will end a prayer "in Jesus' name" because a fundamental tenet of the Christian faith is that Jesus is the mediator between God and man (as in 'humanity.') But let me ask you this ; even if you don't believe in Jesus (perhaps in other than a strictly historical context), why would you be offended by the mention of his name? After all, if you truly don't believe, then it's not real and that's that and anyone who thinks it is is a poor deluded fool ; hardly worth taking offense at. Pity maybe, but not offense. After all, I don't believe in Santa Claus but I'm not offended by little children who do. And I don't get offended when I see people dressed in Santa costumes in department stores talking to children and posing for pictures with them. So why is it any different when it comes to religious matters?
    I don't know why people get offended when Jesus name is used but they do. Maybe they realise that they don't have that relationship with Jesus and they feel excluded, rejected. You see Santa Claus doesn't require you do anything but believe in a myth, whilst Jesus, he wants you to change the way you live and stop believing in myths like Santa Claus. This is offensive to people who think they have it all together.
    excon's Avatar
    excon Posts: 21,482, Reputation: 2992
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    #20

    Jul 27, 2009, 08:38 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by paraclete View Post
    This is offensive to people who think they have it all together.
    Hello again, clete:

    It's not about being better than you. It's about having a different religion, attending a public event, and being excluded. I don't know what's so hard to understand about that. Unless, you too lose your mind when it comes to religious things.

    Plus, you'll have to forgive me... but I don't believe that YOU particular Christians wouldn't be offended if you attended a public event and they invoked some other god than your own. Nahhh, you religious folks ain't that liberal...

    You're not really going to tell me that crap, are you?? Come on, it's a sin to lie. IF you went to your city counsel meeting and they prayed to the pagen god of the wilderness, WE'D never hear the end of it. Who're you trying to kid?

    excon

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