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Vasilios G Molf · Jul 18, 2008, 09:40 AM

I purchased a lot upstate New York in 1972 with a 10 year loan which I paid in 1982. I just built a house on it and found out the deed was never issued by an attorney of the trustee at the time. Now, my present lawyer cannot find the recording of the deed in the county office either. The trustee is defunct but it appears my lawyer doesnot know what to do. Is there anything I can do?

JudyKayTee · Jul 18, 2008, 10:09 AM

Originally Posted by Vasilios G Molf

I purchased a lot upstate New York in 1972 with a 10 year loan which I paid in 1982. I just built a house on it and found out the deed was never issued by an attorney of the trustee at the time. Now, my present lawyer cannot find the recording of the deed in the county office either. The trustee is defunct but it appears my lawyer doesnot know what to do. Is there anything I can do?

Pull the title search - where you stand in the process will be on the search - names, previous deeds and so forth. Then you'll know how to proceed.

If need be you'll have to go to Court to get the titled cleared and a deed reissued.

Who is the owner in terms of real property taxes? In my area that name can ONLY be changed by deed so if it's you, there is some record, perhaps lost, perhaps never filed, but there is a deed somewhere.

twinkiedooter · Jul 18, 2008, 10:42 AM

A full abstract on the property is in order. Also Judy did bring up a very valid method with the taxes. If you pay the taxes in your name, then there has to be a deed somewhere to offset this otherwise they would not send the tax bill to you.

George_1950 · Jul 18, 2008, 10:42 AM

Originally Posted by JudyKayTee

Who is the owner in terms of real property taxes? In my area that name can ONLY be changed by deed so if it's you, there is some record, perhaps lost, perhaps never filed, but there is a deed somewhere.

Good point: who has been paying taxes, on what?

George_1950 · Jul 18, 2008, 10:45 AM

Originally Posted by Vasilios G Molf

I purchased a lot upstate New York in 1972 with a 10 year loan which I paid in 1982. ?

It sounds as though you are describing a mortgage; if so, the mortgage may reference the deed, with book and page number, by which you took title.

Vasilios G Molf · Jul 21, 2008, 06:44 AM

Originally Posted by JudyKayTee

Pull the title search - where you stand in the process will be on the search - names, previous deeds and so forth. Then you'll know how to proceed.

If need be you'll have to go to Court to get the titled cleared and a deed reissued.

Who is the owner in terms of real property taxes? In my area that name can ONLY be changed by deed so if it's you, there is some record, perhaps lost, perhaps never filed, but there is a deed somewhere.

Thank you Judy for your answer-should I go to a title firm before I try to straighten out the deed?--or go to court first--If so how do I do this --can I do this myself or do I need an attorney-I am the owner and I have been paying for 34 yrs. However the tax bill is in the name of a Trustee with my name under it.

The trustee no longer exists--Back in 1972 all the lots were sold under a general deed, when I took out the loan and the bank notified the trustee that I satisfied the loan the attorney at the time was instructed (ten yrs. Later 1982 ) to draw up a deed in my name and record it lwith the county. Two weeks ago the attorney who is now 85 yrs. Old upon showing the evidence to him says I must have made out a deed and will not make up another. Claims my current lawyer and I have to look for it.

Vasilios G Molf · Jul 21, 2008, 06:47 AM

Originally Posted by twinkiedooter

A full abstract on the property is in order. Also Judy did bring up a very valid method with the taxes. If you pay the taxes in your name, then there has to be a deed somewhere to offset this otherwise they would not send the tax bill to you.

My tax bill shows the trustee and myself---I have been paying for 34 yrs-how do I go about full abstract do I need an attorney

JudyKayTee · Jul 21, 2008, 07:01 AM

Originally Posted by Vasilios G Molf

thank you Judy for your answer-should I go to a title firm before I try to straighten out the deed?--or go to court first--If so how do I do this --can I do this myself or do I need an attorney-I am the owner and I have been paying for 34 yrs. however the tax bill is in the name of a Trustee with my name under it.

The trustee no longer exists--Back in 1972 all the lots were sold under a general deed, when I took out the loan and the bank notified the trustee that I satisfied the loan the attorney at the time was instructed (ten yrs. later 1982 ) to draw up a deed in my name and record it lwith the county. Two weeks ago the attorney who is now 85 yrs. old upon showing the evidence to him says I must have made out a deed and will not make up another. Claims my current lawyer and I have to look for it.

Honestly, I don't think I would handle this myself because you are going to need a new Deed if there is no Deed on file.

Ultimately this is the responsibility of the 85-year old Attorney - saying, 'I must have" is not sufficient but I'm sure he's long out of active practice and I don't think there's any point in talking to him any more. At this point I don't think I'd trust him to make up a new Deed (or a replacement Deed); however, he should work hand in hand with your new Attorney.

I would leave this up to your Attorney - he can do it faster/easier.

Do you have your original Title Search (document) which could be updated or would you have to order a new Search?

Vasilios G Molf · Jul 21, 2008, 08:53 AM

Originally Posted by JudyKayTee

Honestly, I don't think I would handle this myself because you are going to need a new Deed if there is no Deed on file.

Ultimately this is the responsibility of the 85-year old Attorney - saying, 'I must have" is not sufficient but I'm sure he's long out of active practice and I don't think there's any point in talking to him any more. At this point I don't think I'd trust him to make up a new Deed (or a replacement Deed); however, he should work hand in hand with your new Attorney.

I would leave this up to your Attorney - he can do it faster/easier.

Do you have your original Title Search (document) which could be updated or would you have to order a new Search?

Thank you again--no, there was never a title search to my knowledge--the original developer bought land from farmers and put in a man made lake and I assume in those days each lot that was sold did not require a search, for he had all the deeds from the farmers. Who knows-

In any event how does one go about obtaining a deed cause my lawyer is now saying we may have to go to ny state supreme court and file under some 10 yr rule that if you have been paying taxes for 10 yrs and no one else has the land is yours. Thanks

ScottGem · Jul 21, 2008, 08:59 AM

What I would do, is tell your attorney to draw up a deed for the 85 yr old's signature. Have your attorney take it to him to get it signed, then record it with the county.

As Judy said, his "must have done it", doesn't cut it. If he refuses to sign, sue him.

JudyKayTee · Jul 21, 2008, 09:24 AM

Originally Posted by ScottGem

What I would do, is tell your attorney to draw up a deed for the 85 yr old's signature. have your attorney take it to him to get it signed, then record it with the county.

As Judy said, his "must have done it", doesn't cut it. If he refuses to sign, sue him.

Right, I agree - but I wouldn't attempt this without an Attorney. Also keep in mind that your Attorney knows the entire picture, the laws in your State and is able to give correct, binding advice.

And, yes, I would sue the original Attorney for all the expenses you incur as a result of him not taking care of this when he should have.

Vasilios G Molf · Jul 23, 2008, 12:08 PM

Originally Posted by ScottGem

What I would do, is tell your attorney to draw up a deed for the 85 yr old's signature. have your attorney take it to him to get it signed, then record it with the county.

As Judy said, his "must have done it", doesn't cut it. If he refuses to sign, sue him.

Scott thank you--well-I spoke to my attorney and he is doing what you said--sending all the information in writing and asking him to sign a substitute deed- However, he feels we might not get anywhere and than he says we have to initiate the making of new deed by
1.notifying the defunct co.(trustee) and wait 30 days
2.file a motion with the courts and initiate a new deed --He says 60-90 days

He is hoping that the old attorney once sees what will have to happen to get this done, he may change his mind and sign I hope --Thanks

ScottGem · Jul 23, 2008, 12:49 PM

Why isn't suing the old atty part of his plan?

JudyKayTee · Jul 23, 2008, 03:31 PM

Originally Posted by ScottGem

Why isn't suing the old atty part of his plan?

Exactly, including the malpractice part and paying any and all legal bills and expenses you incur as a result of his failure to conclude the transaction by recording a Deed - ?

Vasilios G Molf · Jul 24, 2008, 01:40 PM

Originally Posted by JudyKayTee

Exactly, including the malpractice part and paying any and all legal bills and expenses you incur as a result of his failure to conclude the transaction by recording a Deed - ?

Excellent point---I will ask my attorney if the old lawyer still refuses to sign. I will keep you posted---he probably will say no-- because the attorneys all know each other--I will keep you posted