[Matt E]

I have an old GE motor I pulled off a planer and want to use on a jointer, but need to switch directions. There is a barely legible wiring diagram on the back side of a cover, but the wires aren't numbered and the current wiring doesn't match up with the diagram.

There are 9 wires and I labeled them A-I. As originally found the motor runs on 110 and spins clockwise. I need to get it to spin ccw and still run on 110. The motor has 3 capacitors, one of which is disconnected. Two of them are tucked in the feet of the motor (see pic below). The "as found" wiring is below with each line being the wires that are connected
A-B-C-Line (+)
D-E-F-Line (-)
G-H
I

Line I runs to the capacitor on top of the motor and is just wire nutted off by itself. Also running to that capacitor is a wire that looks like it might be original and has the number 8 printed on it. It disappears inside the motor, and I forgot to check if it connects directly to any of the other wires.

Checking resistance, lines A & E connect @ 1.4 ohm, B & D @ 1.3 ohm, and C & H at 0.6 ohm. The other 3 wires (F,G,I) didn't appear to be directly connected.

Can anyone tell me how to wire this up correctly and explain how this thing was running without using one of the capacitors?

Here are a few pictures

[hkstroud]

Compare your wiring to the label. I don't know what's meant by low voltage wiring and high voltage wiring unless its 120 and 240 volts. The low voltage wiring says to exchange lead 5 with leads 8 and 9. At least that's what it looks like. High voltage says exchange leads 5 and 9.

[Matt E]

Harold, I think you're right about low/high being 120/240. I'm trying to do 120 reversed and I don't see any sign of thermal protection, so I think I should actually swap 5 with 8 & 9.

My problem is that the wires aren't numbered. At some point in time the motor was rewired and they didn't bother to label the new wires. I need some help turning my A-I assignments into 1-9 designations. I also need some input on why one of the capacitors (run capacitor?) may have been disconnected, how the motor can work without it, how I can test it and whether I should put it back in the circuit.

[Matt E]

Bump... Still need help on this one

[hkstroud]

No the wires won't be labeled. You simply swap the wire on terminal 5 with the wire on terminals 8 and 9.

Don't know how motor can be running with out capacitor unless it's a run capacitor that is used only for 220 voltage. Since wire in capacitor is labeled 8 and capped off, I would swap 5 and 9 and see if it turns in correction direction. Label implies that the line will be connected to terminal 1 only if the motor has thermal protection. It may not have thermal protection.

[Matt E]

No the wires won't be labeled. You simply swap the wire on terminal 5 with the wire on terminals 8 and 9.

OK, I didn't understand this at first, but I think I do now. You're talking about terminals, which makes sens but isn't what I see in the connection box. What I think I need to do is tear the motor housing apart where I should see a numbered terminal strip which is probably where the other end of the wires in the connection box go. Is that what you meant? If not, I'm confused because there is nothing to indicate terminal 5 or 9 or what wire is connected to them.

[Stratmando]

Did you look VERY closely to the wires for VERY small numbers, may only occur every couple of inches?

[mechanickid]

How does it recive power now? Or was it not hooked up when you got it?

[Matt E]

Did you look VERY closely to the wires for VERY small numbers, may only occur every couple of inches?

The blue wires you can see in the first picture are just common THHN wiring that was used to rewire it sometime well before I got it, probably all from the same spool and definitely not numbered, no matter how much I've wished they were.

How does it receive power now?

When I got it there were 9 unlabeled wires in the connection box. Knowing they should be labeled 1-9 I labeled them A-I to avoid confusion while I try to figure out what's what. Wires A, B, & C were connected to the Hot lead from the wall power, wires D, E, & F were connected to the neutral lead from the wall. Wires G & H were wire nutted together, and wire I was wire nutted off by itself. I did figure out that wire I is connected to the capacitor, and coming out the other side of the capacitor is an apparently original wire labeled #8 and , this just in, somewhere after it disappears in the motor in connects to wire F.

[mechanickid]

Ahh,, now I see this in your orignal post... swat. Haha

anyway

Have you tried just switching the connections?
I mean,
A-B-C-Line (-)
D-E-F-Line (+)

really there is no way to know the orignal connections even if you tore it down,

by their connections I would say that this is the current config

D, E, F is = 10 3 8 9 and g or h is in here but there is one extra total wire??

A, B, C = 2, 4, 5

I= 1


This is just my best guess based on the current config and the diagram on the motor

[Tev]

A & E = 1.4 ohms
B & D = 1.3 ohms
C & H = .6 ohms

This tells me that C & H run to a start winding and they are the two you need to swap to reverse the motor.

So try this,

A,B,H
D,E,F
G,C

F&G probably run to a cetrifugal switch that de-energizes the start winding once the motor reaches a certain RPM. The switch would be in series with the start winding and the two of them in parallel with the other windings.

If the motor starts and runs without that capacitor I wouldn't worry about it. What if anything is printed on the capacitor?

[Matt E]

Thanks Tev. The capacitor has 10 uf 330 VAC 60CY on it. It also says Pyranol and 49F458.

[Tev]

No problem, let me know if it doesn't run or start up correctly and I'll help you get the capacitor wired in if needed. Also, if you do get it working let us know, closure is always good.

[Matt E]

I just tried swapping C&H. The motor ran, but it still spun clockwise. Any other ideas? Is there a schematic out there somewhere that shows standard motor wiring?

[mechanickid]

Did you just reversing the negative and pos wires that were hooked up?

[Tev]

This may take some time but let's give it a try.

First, with the low capacitance and high voltage rating and the fact that it is of the oil filled variety that capacitor should be a run capacitor. It also may contain PCB so be extra careful with it. How are the other two hooked up? Can you mark the wires and then disconnect them to check continuity with the rest of the wires?

This has got me brushing up on motors and it would appear I was incorrect. The lower resistance winding should be the run winding, which means it looks like you have 2 start windings and one run winding and that makes no sense to me. The logical assumption here is that there is another run winding in this motor. Can you disconnect the capacitor and check resistance between the other unknown wires. Also, I somehow missed you stating in one of your posts that the wire currently on the capacitor is connected to wire F. Check the resistance there first.

Another thing of interest is that you say there is no connection between F and G so my earlier assumption of those being connected to a centrifugal switch is wrong. That also means that the C-H (run) winding isn't connected to the circuit and the motor is only running off the start windings.

[Matt E]

The two start caps are wired together in parallel. Wire G goes directly to the start caps. The wire out of the start caps connects to wire F at 1.9 ohms.

[Stratmando]

Formula for Capacitors in parallel is same as resistors in series. Just add the total of the 2 and use 1 if you need or want.
Did you look VERY close, all along each wire, sorry to repeat, but many times if the wires are the same color, there is usually a Very small number stamped at intervals along the wire.
Good Luck

[Matt E]

I can confirm with absolute certainty that I have looked very very close and the wires are definitely not labeled.

[Stratmando]

Sorry about that, Is it possible to physically turn the motor around?