Ask Experts Questions for FREE Help !
Ask
    LjpJlo's Avatar
    LjpJlo Posts: 2, Reputation: 1
    New Member
     
    #1

    Sep 13, 2007, 10:06 AM
    GFI outlets versus grounding electric
    I am currently in the process of buying a house. The house is 84 years old, and the electric is updated to 220, however, during a home inspection there were many outlets that were not grounded. Now, the realtors are suggesting that they will put in GFI outlets for the outlets that are not grounded, instead of paying for an electrician to ground the outlets.
    Will we need to keep resetting the GFI outlets? And will this take care of the problem of the outlets not being grounded? Of course safety is first, and I know this will make it so it is safe, but we want to be able to use the outlets as if they were grounded. I really need some assistance in this area. Thanks.:o
    KISS's Avatar
    KISS Posts: 12,510, Reputation: 839
    Uber Member
     
    #2

    Sep 13, 2007, 10:31 AM
    GFCI's are NOT a substitute for grounding. Without grounding surge suppression devices won't work properly. TV's, VCR's, Telephones and microwaves might have interference issues. Ground is sometimes necessary for a reference and I'll give you a scenereo that actually happened at work.

    There was a bad ground in an outlet. A computer and some other devices were plugged into that outlet. The computer's power line filtering actually raised the potential of ground and there were sparks at another instrument when wires that were supposed to be at ground were touching ground. Result: Fried computer.

    Final conclusion: A defect in the outlets used in the building where the ground was only a pressure tab. The tolerences of the housing made it possible that when two plugs were inserted into an outlet the grounds let go. Potentially 420 outlets were affected.

    Final result: Laboratory areas outlets got changed.

    Outlets that were used were tested and replaced. When computers were added to offices the office outlets were tested and replaced if necessary.

    The hard part was finding it which I did.

    GFCI's just measure the difference of current flowing in the neutral and hot leads. If it exceeds about 0.006 Amps it trips. 0.011 Amps across the heart muscle to stop the heart.
    This is why kitchens, bathrooms and pool areas require them.

    AFCI's or Arc Fault Circuit Interrupters look for the signature of a spark and these are required for bedroom and living room areas.
    biggsie's Avatar
    biggsie Posts: 1,267, Reputation: 125
    Ultra Member
     
    #3

    Sep 13, 2007, 10:37 AM
    Replaced or rewired bathroom, kitchen, garage and exterior outlets must be GFI protected.

    Bedrooms, living rooms, dining rooms and outlets for refrigerator or freezer can get by with

    Grounded three prong outlets in most cases -- running ground wire should be acceptable

    When new three prong outlet is installed -- check out this site

    Rewiring older homes

    If this helps please rate my answer
    LjpJlo's Avatar
    LjpJlo Posts: 2, Reputation: 1
    New Member
     
    #4

    Sep 13, 2007, 10:42 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by LjpJlo
    I am currently in the process of buying a house. The house is 84 years old, and the electric is updated to 220, however, during a home inspection there were many outlets that were not grounded. Now, the realtors are suggesting that they will put in GFI outlets for the outlets that are not grounded, instead of paying for an electrician to ground the outlets.
    Will we need to keep resetting the GFI outlets? and will this take care of the problem of the outlets not being grounded? Of course safety is first, and I know this will make it so it is safe, but we want to be able to use the outlets as if they were grounded. I really need some assistance in this area. Thanks.:o
    I appreciate your answer. So are you telling me that if they change the 2 prong outlets with GFI outlets, and I use those outlets in my home office, that I will either have to keep resetting my outlet or have problems with my computer and other equipment?

    This is becoming a major issue with finalizing the deal with this house. When we first looked at the house, the outlets were all 3-prong outlets, so we were made to believe that the electric was updated. Then upon inspection, we come to find out that many of the outlets were not grounded. We stated we wanted the outlets grounded, since that was one of the reasons we put in the offer that we did, and they are telling us that they would be willing to put in GFI outlets.
    What type of problems will we have if we are using GFI outlets that are not grounded?
    I just want to be sure I am understanding this issue, since I went to school to be an attorney, and not an electrician. And I want to make sure that we are not being ripped off by being given misleading security and safety when it comes to our electric.
    labman's Avatar
    labman Posts: 10,580, Reputation: 551
    Uber Member
     
    #5

    Sep 13, 2007, 10:53 AM
    A GFCI will provide much of the same protection as a grounded outlet in a different way. They meet code if labeled no equipment ground. Depending how the house was originally wired, installing grounded outlets could mean ripping up the walls and rewiring. If it has BX or metallic conduit, that was installed correctly and is intact, just replacing the outlets with 3 prong ones will leave them grounded. That isn't as reliable as the current practice of running a green wire too in metal conduit or __-2 with ground NM-B. The GFCI protects people from shocks, but doesn't give a ground to equipment needing it.
    KISS's Avatar
    KISS Posts: 12,510, Reputation: 839
    Uber Member
     
    #6

    Sep 13, 2007, 10:58 AM
    All the problems that I said would happen with ungrounded outlets GFI or otherwise.

    Remember GFI protection can be alternatively done at the panel by changing the circuit breaker.

    GFI's don't need a ground to work, but they need to be labeled as an ungrounded GFI.

    An example problem:

    A desktop computer connected via USB to a printer. All with 3-wire cords plugged into a 3-wire surge supressor into an ungrounded outlet (GFCI or not - doesn't matter).

    An example no problem

    A desktop computer connected via Ethernet to a printer with or without a hub or switch. Again plugged into 3-wire surge suppressor into an ungrounded outlet. Ethernet is transformer coupled, so it's isolated.

    Add a modem connected to either computer which could be used for faxing or dial-up networking and you could have a potential problem again.

    An all in one printer/fax would also have the potential of being a problem because it has USB and telephone connections.

Not your question? Ask your question View similar questions

 

Question Tools Search this Question
Search this Question:

Advanced Search

Add your answer here.


Check out some similar questions!

House grounding, 2 prong outlets, main panel, lots of stuff [ 5 Answers ]

Greetings all! My wife and I are purchasing a house built during the 1960's in Texas. I have some concerns about the electrical system. It appears to be wired with 2 wire, non metallic cabling for most of the outlets in the living and bed rooms. All these rooms have 2 prong outlets. The...

Grounding a GFI [ 1 Answers ]

I am using an existing wire that was used for a dryer. I have changed the breakers to 2-20 amp single pole breakers and am splitting the line to make two 110volt GFI outlets for a whirlpool tub (1 for pump and 1 for heater). I have a red, white, and black wires, however, there is no bare copper...

Wiring outlets, and grounding [ 4 Answers ]

I just read where one of you told someone, the black wire goes on the screw with the longer opening and white opposite, Ie, Then I saw this following statement from an electrician All white wires are connected to the side with a silvery color and the black wires to the brassy terminals. ...

GFI outlets [ 1 Answers ]

We're looking to buy a house and the outlets in the 2 bathrooms do not appear to have GFI outlets. We were told by a friend that they could be tied to another circuit. Is this possible? Thanks, AJ

GFI outlets [ 6 Answers ]

I have an older home with no GFI outlets. What is involved in installing them, and how many do I need? Thanks, Roca


View more questions Search