[Lao Tzi]

Are there any occasion when you are actually the one who drop the conversation because she is not who you thought?

[kctiger]

Are there any occasion when you are actually the one who drop the conversation because she is not who you thought?

That has happened several times. It goes both ways, but that is fine. The point of sparking conversation is to see if there is any connection there. Sometimes there is, sometimes there isn't. No worries either way.

[slapshot_oi]

I think a lot before I spurt a word!

Yes, yes you do. I have to bust out the dictionary to read your posts, and English isn't your first language?

Sorry, but I couldn't follow your example about the man with the last name Ho and the river, it was too complex.

I can tell you from past experience that analyzing every situation will actually work against you. You will second guess yourself and be indecisive, and you will give people the vibe that you're analyzing them too, they won't want to be around you. You'll also be far less likely to take any kind of risk, which is evident in the quote above.

You'll find that in America, especially in our generation, people aren't as careful and conservative as you. When in Rome my friend, when in Rome.

[Ren6]

slapshot_oi is right... most of us in this culture don't have to weigh our words so carefully. Based on your description of the conversation with Mr. Ho, I can see why such caution on your part was necessary. Here, there is no need to be so cautious, so try to relax a bit! :)

[Lao Tzi]

Yes, yes you do. I have to bust out the dictionary to read your posts, and English isn't your first language?

No, English it is not my mother tongue. You mean my grammar is bad. I apologise for this inconvenience.

You'll find that in America, especially in our generation, people aren't as careful and conservative as you. When in Rome my friend, when in Rome.

Rome is a place of rhetoric and logic! Athens and Early Rome was perhaps a place of philosophical speeches. Using silence and deception should be in China, for it considers to be a survival tactics. So,. I was deeply influenced by that.

and you will give people the vibe that you're analyzing them too, they won't want to be around you. You'll also be far less likely to take any kind of risk, which is evident in the quote above.

Very true, especially when people in US are not used to my manner, they will also be defensive. But about risking, there are good risks with high chances of success and there are risk that mostly deem failure. Anyway, I guess I just have to "through the billowy sea I dashed" huh :D

The point of sparking conversation is to see if there is any connection there.

This connection must be perceived not only by your brain but also the vicissitude of your emotion, right? As you have advised, being natural is important.

What are topics that you shouldn't bring to the conversation with a lady? Politics, Heavy Stuffs like Epistemology or Phenomenology right?

[talaniman]

Me I like to just see what comes up. No scripts.

[slapshot_oi]

No, English it is not my mother tongue. You mean my grammar is bad. I apologise for this inconvenience.

Just the opposite, your grammar is remarkably good, and your vocabulary is wider than mine.

Rome is a place of rhetoric and logic! Athens and Early Rome was perhaps a place of philosophical speeches. Using silence and deception should be in China, for it considers to be a survival tactics. So,... I was deeply influenced by that.

You've never heard that idiom before? "When in Rome, do as the Romans do". It means, in your case, nearly every girl you'll run into in this country won't be on the same page as you because you're too reserved and sophisticated, so, you should put your normal routine on a shelf and meet them on their level.

Very true, especially when people in US are not used to my manner, they will also be defensive. But about risking, there are good risks with high chances of success and there are risk that mostly deem failure. Anyway, I guess I just have to "through the billowy sea I dashed" huh :D

See, there is that paranoia again. Why on earth would you think they'd be defensive?

What are topics that you shouldn't bring to the conversation with a lady? Politics, Heavy Stuffs like Epistemology or Phenomenology right?

I don't think any of us know what epistemology or phenomenology are.

[kctiger]

What are topics that you shouldn't bring to the conversation with a lady? Politics, Heavy Stuffs like Epistemology or Phenomenology right?

I can't tell if you are trying to find things to sound really intelligent or not (I realize you are, but some of this stuff is over the top and should be obvious no-nos in conversation) but none of the above three are appropriate conversation. The only one that would remotely be interesting to any female is politics, and there are rules about discussing politics. The other two are entirely too philosophical to be talking about in your first conversation.

To break the ice, so to speak, you are going to bring up something very vague and not too deep. I wish I could meet you in person as I would be curious to find out if you are as analytical in person as you come across in your posts.

Do you think any female would want to talk about something "heavy" the first time they have ever talked to you? People like to talk about themselves. So ask questions regarding their lives and branch out from there. Don't ask them, "How do you think knowledge is truly attained or how do you suppose we should end world starvation?" That kind of leaves you nowhere to go.

[talaniman]

Dates should be fun, not a debate, or quiz, to find out how smart someone is.

Generally the location dictates the way the conversation goes, for example a carnival, as opposed to dinner, as opposed to bowling.

How comfortable someone is around you is the key, and most times they are as nervous as you maybe. Except for a coffee, or a lunch, you have to talk to them first before you even ask for a date.

Back in the day, before the texting a social networks, there was the phone, and if used right, was very effective with hooking up.

I frown on workplace relationships, because the whole place is in your business, and your asking for trouble depending on the working environment.

That leads to how best to develop your own social network of people, and activities, that brings you closer to people that enjoy what you do.

So I guess having things beside work to look forward to, is my point.

[Lao Tzi]

See, there is that paranoia again. Why on earth would you think they'd be defensive?

Oh, it is just normal, you know! If you talk to a person who for most of the conversation quiet and serious, you will also feel awkward if not a bit wondering what's wrong with this guy?

I don't think any of us know what epistemology or phenomenology are.

Oh, they're just branches of philosophy. :D

I can't tell if you are trying to find things to sound really intelligent or not (I realize you are, but some of this stuff is over the top and should be obvious no-nos in conversation) but none of the above three are appropriate conversation. The only one that would remotely be interesting to any female is politics, and there are rules about discussing politics. The other two are entirely too philosophical to be talking about in your first conversation.

To break the ice, so to speak, you are going to bring up something very vague and not too deep. I wish I could meet you in person as I would be curious to find out if you are as analytical in person as you come across in your posts.

Do you think any female would want to talk about something "heavy" the first time they have ever talked to you? People like to talk about themselves. So ask questions regarding their lives and branch out from there. Don't ask them, "How do you think knowledge is truly attained or how do you suppose we should end world starvation?" That kind of leaves you nowhere to go.

This is valuable! Thank you!
About talking things that makes me intelligent, perhaps in the US. From where I come from, these topics are normal because Buddhist praxis is always linked to Ontology and Epistemology. These are major themes in East Asian education and are very familiar to the people, so it is somewhat similar to things that you find normal in the State. This works remarkably well if you open the conversation with high school or university ladies, because they find intellectual discussion is more comfortable than personal questions, you know! Not that I mean Vietnamese students are smarter, but again, the preferred topic is simply a consequence of the habit of concealing anything personal. Politics should be sealed, because you're obviously vulnerable to arguments, worst to the censorship of the government.

Philosophical topics are especially "delicious" to me because I just love them very much, and because I haven't established much connection outside of my native circuit of friends, it is in my vein. :D

Because neither parties are willing to provide personal information, topics on religious themes, philosophy (the meaning of life is very popular) travelling, cuisine, cars, super stars, movies,. are discussed on a regular basis.

At best, names are the only available information I can get from a total Vietnamese strange girl. In order to collect more information from her, there must be a prelude, set up with certain degree of dexterity before I can trick her to talk. A voluntary giving up of seat is common and classic, a comment on weather is probably worked, a remark on the pop-star in the cover of her magazine is employed by some of my friends, so I guess it can work too,.

But it's a whole different story when it comes to American ladies. :D That's why I need your help!

Therefore, I believe it is time to put aside these topics and find something more rooted in Pop culture of US, as you have suggested. But, in general, if I find out the lady is not interested in Philosophy or any intellectual activity, I can hardly see a fit between us. It goes down to what type of girl then!

To break the ice, so to speak, you are going to bring up something very vague and not too deep. I wish I could meet you in person as I would be curious to find out if you are as analytical in person as you come across in your posts.

I'm now in China, I think it is very hard to meet in person you know, though I trust if we can meet, more advices from you can be presented in a more effective way, I guess. But it is understandable if we are all in US, it still hard to travel across and see one another because the country is too vast.

Dates should be fun, not a debate, or quiz, to find out how smart someone is.

I think "fun" here is the problem I have to try to understand. What kind of topics that can bring an American young lady to join in general? Because from where I'm from, a feeling of being respected, being understood as an intellectual person, and being appreciated for her knowledge are all very important. But as you have pointed out deeper topic should not be brought up in conversation, it is clear that these criteria falls into disuse. I guess it is here that the problem surfaces.

You've never heard that idiom before? "When in Rome, do as the Romans do". It means, in your case, nearly every girl you'll run into in this country won't be on the same page as you because you're too reserved and sophisticated, so, you should put your normal routine on a shelf and meet them on their level.

Thank you for your information on this! It stands as an example on how native English speaker employs allusion to a Classical idiom. This is the case that call my attention as this level of sophistication has been by no means achieved by me.

[Lao Tzi]

To make the matter worse, nearly all my life is devoted to study. I have to make my born when my friends are out with cheerleaders. This left me with a grossly inadequacy in the understanding of American pop culture, something I have thought to be unimportant. It is to the point that I've known nothing about the existence of an Avril Lavigne until last year. I think a period of normalisation is quite essential before I can talk to a girl.

Who cares about Classical music and movies that I like to watch (they all lack a sense of comedy, like the trilogy Godfathers, Raise The Red Lantern, The Panist,. All are too serious and aren't fun to invite someone to watch.

The more you advice me, the clearer I can recognise that my true personality is so abnormal from the mass. I start to regret that I have wasted so much chances to be more normal, to be more down-to-earth with people living around me. Why should you retreat to yourself, really. Without your advices I think there will be someday I will sit on a bench near a park, reaching the final realization that everything I have believed and enjoyed is just a far-fetched illusion. At best, the only best skill I have accumulated through years is deceiving myself.

What can I say? But I have to change a lot, I think that is it! Better do it now before it's too late! This is a costly lesson for someone who do not conform to the society he's living in.