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    Athos's Avatar
    Athos Posts: 942, Reputation: 55
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    #1

    Sep 4, 2019, 04:29 AM
    Trump's Latest Unconstitutional Move
    Trump has unconstitutionally diverted funds authorized by Congress to fund a separate project of his own.

    The amount of $3.6 billion was illegally taken from the defense budget to pay for a campaign promise of Trump - a wall on the southern border of the USA.

    He cares nothing for immigration issues (other than excluding immigrants by race/ethnicity), but obsessively needs to be seen as fulfilling a campaign promise. His sick ego will not let him do otherwise.

    As the 2020 election draws near, Trump will behave in an increasingly bizarre and strange manner, terrified of losing.
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,328, Reputation: 10855
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    #2

    Sep 4, 2019, 05:31 AM
    None of his raiding of other departments budgets have added an inch of his promised wall and that's on top of his congressionally appropriated funds. NOT ONE INCH! Ever hear of a real estate mogul who builds stuff not being able to build a simple wall? Yeah let the guy who bankrupts casinos, scams contractors, and consumers and banks run from get his hands on taxpayer money to build something.

    Somebody has lost their freaking mind, while we all lose a bunch of money, if you think that's a good idea.
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,706, Reputation: 173
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    #3

    Sep 4, 2019, 06:17 AM
    So once again the military cannot account for a few billion dollars, don't you realise that for them this is an accounting error, 0.5% and Trump is to blame, who was to blame before? If the amry engineers are tasked to build a wall it is becuase they need experience in building walls, just as they have experience in building levies and dams and roads. So how much does a new road along the southern border cost?
    Vacuum7's Avatar
    Vacuum7 Posts: 47, Reputation: 2
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    #4

    Sep 4, 2019, 07:31 AM
    Nothing illegal about it: If you frame the argument as national security, the POTUS is responsible, and he alone, with executing that requirement...and it is a requirement of Office to protect the American People.
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,328, Reputation: 10855
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    #5

    Sep 4, 2019, 07:44 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by paraclete View Post
    So once again the military cannot account for a few billion dollars, don't you realise that for them this is an accounting error, 0.5% and Trump is to blame, who was to blame before? If the amry engineers are tasked to build a wall it is becuase they need experience in building walls, just as they have experience in building levies and dams and roads. So how much does a new road along the southern border cost?
    Reporting has it that many military projects have been cancel because of the redirection of funds from the military which means many jobs and local economies will be affected.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vacuum7 View Post
    Nothing illegal about it: If you frame the argument as national security, the POTUS is responsible, and he alone, with executing that requirement...and it is a requirement of Office to protect the American People.
    Wrong my friend, the president governs as a co EQUAL partner with the congress, and it's up to the other branches to balance this dufus and repubs have no truck for that especially during an election, and the prospect of losing their jobs because he surely will bad mouth these fools if they oppose anything he does, or says like the ones that have done so before.

    The dufus is great at framing stuff for you wingers to lap up, but it is against the law if repubs would enforce the law like they are supposed to.
    Vacuum7's Avatar
    Vacuum7 Posts: 47, Reputation: 2
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    #6

    Sep 4, 2019, 08:55 AM
    Nothing illegal about it: If you frame the argument as national security, the POTUS is responsible, and he alone, with executing that requirement...and it is a requirement of Office to protect the American People.
    Athos's Avatar
    Athos Posts: 942, Reputation: 55
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    #7

    Sep 4, 2019, 09:03 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by Vacuum7 View Post
    Nothing illegal about it: If you frame the argument as national security, the POTUS is responsible, and he alone, with executing that requirement...and it is a requirement of Office to protect the American People.
    You cannot divert monies already allocated by Congress. That's a clear usurpation of power by the president. Illegal.

    If the president has a national security issue, he goes to Congress for the money.

    But everybody knows it's all BS from Trump and has to do with the Mexicans refusing to pay for his wall as he promised a zillion times. Major egg on face.
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,328, Reputation: 10855
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    #8

    Sep 4, 2019, 10:01 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by Vacuum7 View Post
    Nothing illegal about it: If you frame the argument as national security, the POTUS is responsible, and he alone, with executing that requirement...and it is a requirement of Office to protect the American People.
    Why because he said so? You obviously know nothing about the laws of your own lands. Onl dictators and monarchs ignore such things set aside in the constitution but the dufus has a tradition and history of making it up as he goes along and has lawyers to help him.

    "The dufus is great at framing stuff for you wingers to lap up, but it is against the law if repubs would enforce the law like they are supposed to."

    That's doesn't make it right that they don't!
    Vacuum7's Avatar
    Vacuum7 Posts: 47, Reputation: 2
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    #9

    Sep 4, 2019, 12:53 PM
    Athos & Talaniman: When it comes to national security, the POTUS has incredible power to make judgements, calls, and appropriations that are WAY, WAY, WAY beyond the purview of Congress' or Senate's reach: The POTUS can launch a nuclear strike if he see fit! HE DOESN'T ASK FOR ANYONE'S PERMISSION ON NATIONAL SECURITY MATTERS! How much more power do you think he needs? The POTUS is COMMANDER IN CHIEF, PERIOD! He doesn't have to ask Congress or Senate for a damn thing if he feels the people of the U.S. are in harms way. And, whether or not those are LEGITIMATE reasons is not even debatable because it doesn't matter, legally....he could be lying his off about the real reason: POTUS RULES WHEN IT COMES TO NATIONAL SECURITY AND HE ANSWERS TO NO ONE!

    All this power to POTUS is all by design, so that we don't debate things to death while we are being attacked or invaded and the "house is on fire", so to speak. I am not saying I agree with this but it is the way it is and we all have to respect and abide by it. NOT SAYING ITS RIGHT OR WRONG, all I am saying nothing short of God can stop the POTUS on matters of national security. Totally different subject when it comes to Declarations Of War, which are under the War Powers Act.

    Internally to the proper borders of the U.S., POTUS can do anything he so chooses to do and no one but no one can stop him....furthermore, The SCOTUS will back POTUS to the hilt on this....and if they didn't before, they surely will now....and damn sure will once Ginsburg is gone and a new conservative SCJ replaces her, which is going to happen.
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,328, Reputation: 10855
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    #10

    Sep 4, 2019, 08:51 PM
    Naw, the dufus's power is whatever the congress lets him get away with, and he has enough sycophants to do as he pleases almost, but that can change and despite the bluster he can still be held account. Conservative though they be SCOTUS or any conservative judge may not let him get beyound the law, and he has lost in court a few times already.

    At least one would hope so, or what's the whole point of this experiment any way? You better hope repubs keep control of the senate. We'll see won't we? Looks like his money grab of Pentagon funds for his wall will be in a court soon too. I seem to remember the budget bill he signed expressly forbid his using budgeted money for his dream wall but trying to check that out. I would imagine even repubs may balk at projects in their states being cancelled.
    Vacuum7's Avatar
    Vacuum7 Posts: 47, Reputation: 2
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    #11

    Sep 4, 2019, 09:28 PM
    Talaniman: As long as all of this is held in terms of national security the Defense budget will be the only recourse by which it can be addressed......If you just naturally extrapolate this thought all the way through, it doesn't take a whole lot of imagination to see how POTUS can maneuver this thing in his favor

    Let me try: Say that there are two million ChiCom troops lurking just over the border separating the U.S. from Mexico and they have been coming across that border in little herds, here and there but they are now threatening to come "enforce"....the U.S. response wouldn't be with Immigration & Naturalization, it would definitely be with the Department Of Defense. As long as Trump names illegal aliens as a pseudo "invasion force" and keeps all of this under the National Security umbrella, the natural extension is to also get the Department Of Defense involved. I think it will be deemed to be perfectly legal, especially given that the POTUS's primary job is to secure the welfare of the American people.

    Talaniman, I think you and I can agree on at least this point: Congress and Senate are about as worthless as tits on a boar hog......I have never seen any of these people do anything for the last 20 years that I would celebrate as even remotely remarkable.
    Athos's Avatar
    Athos Posts: 942, Reputation: 55
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    #12

    Sep 5, 2019, 03:57 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by Vacuum7 View Post
    Say that there are two million ChiCom troops lurking just over the border separating the U.S. from Mexico and they have been coming across that border in little herds, here and there but they are now threatening to come "enforce"....the U.S. response wouldn't be with Immigration & Naturalization, it would definitely be with the Department Of Defense. As long as Trump names illegal aliens as a pseudo "invasion force" and keeps all of this under the National Security umbrella, the natural extension is to also get the Department Of Defense involved. I think it will be deemed to be perfectly legal, especially given that the POTUS's primary job is to secure the welfare of the American people.
    Instead of a military invasion, how about babies in cages. You can't just make up stuff to suit your fantasy, which is essentially what Trump does.
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,328, Reputation: 10855
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    #13

    Sep 5, 2019, 11:14 AM
    Dead on Athos we don't have to substitute the reality of men women and children with some commie army, that just distorts reality. My worry would be that raiding the pentagon budget for the emergency his own incompetence and cruelty created would just be another way to justify a huge budget battle next month when the fiscal year ends, but we will see what the feckless congress does about it then.

    The dufus is not even close to fulfilling the security of the American people he has just made a challenge into a crisis and a cruel one at that and it's HIGHLY irresponsible when he has willing workers who can earn their keep and help grow and expand the economy.

    Why do you think I call him a LYING, CHEATING, DUFUS in the first place? He proves me right everyday. We need to take back our country for this idiot in chief!
    Athos's Avatar
    Athos Posts: 942, Reputation: 55
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    #14

    Sep 6, 2019, 04:51 AM
    We shouldn't be arguing about whether Trump has the power as president to do what he's doing - stealing from Peter to pay Paul.

    After all, Trump has promised the American people too many times to count that Mexico will provide the money for the wall. Problem solved!
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,706, Reputation: 173
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    #15

    Sep 6, 2019, 05:58 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by Athos View Post
    We shouldn't be arguing about whether Trump has the power as president to do what he's doing - stealing from Peter to pay Paul.

    After all, Trump has promised the American people too many times to count that Mexico will provide the money for the wall. Problem solved!
    It is easy for Trump to make them pay, by Trumpeconomics you just slap a tariff on thier goods and they pay
    Athos's Avatar
    Athos Posts: 942, Reputation: 55
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    #16

    Sep 6, 2019, 06:17 AM
    Right. I forgot about Trumpeconomics. He'll backtrack on that right after he backtracks on weather reports for Alabama.
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,706, Reputation: 173
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    #17

    Sep 6, 2019, 05:20 PM
    How is the weather in Alabama, obviously more important than Poland
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 38,742, Reputation: 5430
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    #18

    Sep 6, 2019, 05:40 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by paraclete View Post
    How is the weather in Alabama, obviously more important than Poland
    And don't forget -- the Taliban is going to be our BFFs now.
    Vacuum7's Avatar
    Vacuum7 Posts: 47, Reputation: 2
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    #19

    Sep 6, 2019, 08:24 PM
    Anyone who thinks the Taliban is going to be our new best friend is a fool.
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 38,742, Reputation: 5430
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    #20

    Sep 6, 2019, 09:10 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Vacuum7 View Post
    Anyone who thinks the Taliban is going to be our new best friend is a fool.
    Time to mention that to Trump.

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