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    Athos's Avatar
    Athos Posts: 511, Reputation: 55
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    #1

    Sep 5, 2017, 02:00 PM
    They Came When They Were SIX YEARS OLD!
    Their parents brought them and they grew up to be hard-working decent AMERICANS! Now that moronic jackass in the White House wants to DEPORT THEM!!!!!!!!!!

    He has his flunkie Sessions justify it by a song-and-dance about THE LAW. You remember Beauregard Sessions - he's the one who LIED about his Russian contacts during his confirmation. He also said he "liked the Ku Klux Klan" - which he later retracted.

    So evil Trump justifies his deportation of good people by citing the LAW and how important the LAW is for every country and for civilization itself. THE LAW!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Is this the same LAW that Trump DEFIED by granting a pardon to the racist Sheriff Arpaio?

    He cites the LAW when it suits him. When the LAW doesn't suit him, he simply ignores it.

    This double-faced bozo continues his disgraceful march trampling over any decency he encounters.
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,244, Reputation: 10853
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    #2

    Sep 5, 2017, 04:16 PM
    So much for having a heart and great love for THESE people. He said he would end DACA, and this way he can claim he kept his promise for his loony right wing base. They love the red meat. You think the congress will rise to the challenge and do the will of the American people? I won't hold my breath, but they have 6 months.
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,705, Reputation: 172
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    #3

    Sep 5, 2017, 05:42 PM
    Trump asking Congress to do something, the mind boggles, but then mid terms aren't that far away and this is a way of all those pollies getting some runs on the board, to use an aussie cliché. The republicans can prove themselves to the hispanics by giving these people citizenship
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,244, Reputation: 10853
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    #4

    Sep 5, 2017, 09:05 PM
    They would be happy to just keep living their lives and not get deported to someplace most don't even remember. They deserve citizenship though, much sooner rather than later. A very cruel way to screw people over. I have to note the glee that Sessions delivered his BS reasons for Trumps actions.

    Nothing uglier than a true racist except TWO of them.
    smoothy's Avatar
    smoothy Posts: 25,495, Reputation: 2853
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    #5

    Sep 6, 2017, 04:28 AM
    Too damn bad. They are STILL illegals. I suggest we send them all to Canada... you want them, you can have them.

    If their parents stole a car... the kids don't get to keep it to joyride around in.

    Contrary to what the tards think....Arpio was ENCFORCING actual Law...Illegals don't get to IGNORE the law just because some other tards want to let them in while OTHER people, MILLIONS of them, follow the law, apply and wait their turn in line, sometimes decades.

    You don't reward criminals...and punish those who follow the law.

    Deport all this Dreamer dimwits to Canada. If Canadians like them so much, you can have every last one of them.But

    But then some moronic jackasses feel certain people are above the law (Left wing loons usually)..and others aren't.....(anyone who is NOT a left wing loon).

    Most of them seem to think they are sooooooooooooooooooooo well educated, can't grasp the most simple facts of law and national sovereignty.

    NONE of these criminals...and every one IS a criminal....breaking our Immigration laws, DESERVE anything, and certainly NOT citizenship as a reward for their flagrant violation of our laws.
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,244, Reputation: 10853
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    #6

    Sep 6, 2017, 06:27 AM
    Too damn bad. They are STILL illegals. I suggest we send them all to Canada... you want them, you can have them.

    They are illegals because the RACIST who ran government designated them to be. This is nothing but the veiled hardly sanitized version of the Jim Crowe era that was designed specifically to target non-white people and keep whitey pure and in power.

    If their parents stole a car... the kids don't get to keep it to joyride around in.

    One could say YOU are joyriding in the car YOUR parents stole from the NATIVES. So what if the first thing they did was say they were no longer IMMIGRANTS.

    Contrary to what the tards think... Arpio was ENCFORCING actual Law... Illegals don't get to IGNORE the law just because some other tards want to let them in while OTHER people, MILLIONS of them, follow the law, apply and wait their turn in line, sometimes decades.

    Oh, what a hypocrite! You trot out the law to use against others, but when one of your own was hauled on the carpet for using illegal tactics, causing death, and violating civil right of lawful citizens, gets convicted in YOUR courts, you pardon him and pat him on the back and say good job, good man! Just another example of coddling RACISTS!

    You don't reward criminals... and punish those who follow the law.

    More hypocrisy since you obviously have taken a convicted criminal and raised him to sainthood in the APAIO case. What's next a statue?

    Deport all this Dreamer dimwits to Canada. If Canadians like them so much, you can have every last one of them.

    But then some moronic jackasses feel certain people are above the law (Left wing loons usually).. and others aren't... (anyone who is NOT a left wing loon).

    So why is a convicted criminal your hero? That only makes YOU the MoJack of which you speak.

    Most of them seem to think they are sooooooooooooooooooooo well educated, can't grasp the most simple facts of law and national sovereignty.

    Yeah you fit that description to a "T". The simple facts of law is what a RACIST would use to claim his rights TRUMPS everybody else's! That's why you make laws to justify your own RACISM!

    NONE of these criminals... and every one IS a criminal... breaking our Immigration laws, DESERVE anything, and certainly NOT citizenship as a reward for their flagrant violation of our laws.

    Considering you Euro-immigrants make laws to keep NON-Euro's criminals that can never be equal to you, for the purpose preserving your own sense of superiority, and the right to tell others not like you what to do and how to do it, you have little room to call anyone a criminal, since your own actions are as criminal as any a non-Euro can commit.

    By your logic, if APAIO is above the law, why are DREAMERS not also afforded the same protection of a PARDON? Never mind, your racist brain cannot wrap itself on the simple concepts of the LAW, like "all men are created equal", or "equal protection under the law".

    Instead you use the LAW to beat people into submission, who actually have broken no law. At least none that you, or your daddy's daddy have not broken.

    I take heart though, that not all Euro-immigrants share your narrow RACIST right wing views, and are better potty trained in the morality of the rule of LAW.

    PS

    Most of the US was SOVEREIGN Mexico. That makes many Latinos and even South Americans natives to the land.
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,705, Reputation: 172
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    #7

    Sep 6, 2017, 06:53 AM
    Most of the US was SOVEREIGN Mexico. That makes many Latinos and even South Americans natives to the land
    .

    Tal, you are a true reversionist, they didn't cross the border because they thought it is their land, they did it for economic reasons.

    Smoothy is wrong you can't dump your problem on someone else, it is your problem, they have been allowed to stay there, and through a cruel political deception, they revealed themselves and made themselves more vulnerable.

    As children they are not criminals, it is a stupid idea to say they are criminals
    excon's Avatar
    excon Posts: 21,482, Reputation: 2992
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    #8

    Sep 6, 2017, 07:08 AM
    Hello:

    The 5th Amendment says that you cannot be compelled to be a witness against yourself. The government PROMISED that, in exchange for coming forward, they WOULDN'T be deported, so they did. Certainly, they wouldn't have done that WITHOUT that promise..

    So, can the government then change its mind and say to the Dreamers, too bad - so sad - GOTCHA?? I say NOOO.. In my view, the governments' promise is tantamount to immunity...

    What sayeth you?

    excon
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,244, Reputation: 10853
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    #9

    Sep 6, 2017, 07:39 AM
    Tal, you are a true reversionist, they didn't cross the border because they thought it is their land, they did it for economic reasons.

    My point which seems to have escaped you is a matter of historical fact. I never said that central and southern Hispanics thought they were entitled to the land because it was theirs, YOU did, but fact is they have always migrated back and forth, yes for economic reasons, but mostly because they LIVED here. Had for many centuries before the Euro's cleared them off. Maybe your own Euro education is not as gospel as you think. I found mine was not either.

    Smoothy is wrong you can't dump your problem on someone else, it is your problem, they have been allowed to stay there, and through a cruel political deception, they revealed themselves and made themselves more vulnerable.

    Racism is alive and well in the US, in fact it never died, and racists will perpetrate the hate by any means necessary. Fortunately they are a TRUE minority, though they are VERY loud about their hate. (RE: FEAR of others, of change, of retribution, of powerlessness, of extinction)

    As children they are not criminals, it is a stupid idea to say they are criminals

    So why does he (THEY) say it? Come on, I know you know.

    The 5th Amendment says that you cannot be compelled to be a witness against yourself. The government PROMISED that, in exchange for coming forward, they WOULDN'T be deported, so they did. Certainly, they wouldn't have done that WITHOUT that promise..

    So, can the government then change its mind and say to the Dreamers, too bad - so sad - GOTCHA?? I say NOOO.. In my view, the governments' promise is tantamount to immunity...

    What sayeth you?
    I sayeth the right wing loonies don't care about the law, only what they can make it do. That's never good for anyone else. Matter of fact in there right wing loony hands it's a lethal weapon.
    smoothy's Avatar
    smoothy Posts: 25,495, Reputation: 2853
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    #10

    Sep 6, 2017, 01:42 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by talaniman View Post
    Too damn bad. They are STILL illegals. I suggest we send them all to Canada... you want them, you can have them.

    They are illegals because the RACIST who ran government designated them to be. This is nothing but the veiled hardly sanitized version of the Jim Crowe era that was designed specifically to target non-white people and keep whitey pure and in power.

    If their parents stole a car... the kids don't get to keep it to joyride around in.

    One could say YOU are joyriding in the car YOUR parents stole from the NATIVES. So what if the first thing they did was say they were no longer IMMIGRANTS.

    Contrary to what the tards think... Arpio was ENCFORCING actual Law... Illegals don't get to IGNORE the law just because some other tards want to let them in while OTHER people, MILLIONS of them, follow the law, apply and wait their turn in line, sometimes decades.

    Oh, what a hypocrite! You trot out the law to use against others, but when one of your own was hauled on the carpet for using illegal tactics, causing death, and violating civil right of lawful citizens, gets convicted in YOUR courts, you pardon him and pat him on the back and say good job, good man! Just another example of coddling RACISTS!

    You don't reward criminals... and punish those who follow the law.

    More hypocrisy since you obviously have taken a convicted criminal and raised him to sainthood in the APAIO case. What's next a statue?

    Deport all this Dreamer dimwits to Canada. If Canadians like them so much, you can have every last one of them.

    But then some moronic jackasses feel certain people are above the law (Left wing loons usually).. and others aren't... (anyone who is NOT a left wing loon).

    So why is a convicted criminal your hero? That only makes YOU the MoJack of which you speak.

    Most of them seem to think they are sooooooooooooooooooooo well educated, can't grasp the most simple facts of law and national sovereignty.

    Yeah you fit that description to a "T". The simple facts of law is what a RACIST would use to claim his rights TRUMPS everybody else's! That's why you make laws to justify your own RACISM!

    NONE of these criminals... and every one IS a criminal... breaking our Immigration laws, DESERVE anything, and certainly NOT citizenship as a reward for their flagrant violation of our laws.

    Considering you Euro-immigrants make laws to keep NON-Euro's criminals that can never be equal to you, for the purpose preserving your own sense of superiority, and the right to tell others not like you what to do and how to do it, you have little room to call anyone a criminal, since your own actions are as criminal as any a non-Euro can commit.

    By your logic, if APAIO is above the law, why are DREAMERS not also afforded the same protection of a PARDON? Never mind, your racist brain cannot wrap itself on the simple concepts of the LAW, like "all men are created equal", or "equal protection under the law".

    Instead you use the LAW to beat people into submission, who actually have broken no law. At least none that you, or your daddy's daddy have not broken.

    I take heart though, that not all Euro-immigrants share your narrow RACIST right wing views, and are better potty trained in the morality of the rule of LAW.

    PS

    Most of the US was SOVEREIGN Mexico. That makes many Latinos and even South Americans natives to the land.
    Really Now... Illegals are illegal, they have always been illegal, even when the racist Democrats were in office. Its called the LAW. No country on Earth allows just anyone to show up and live there... NONE. I suppose every country on Earth is run by Racists too? INCLUDING the ones where the little criminal bastards came from.

    Its racist to believe Latinos (Blacks, Asians, etc... etc... )are better than everyone else on Earth, and that they alone are above any and ALL of our laws.

    ALL of which by the way ARE Constitutional...
    smoothy's Avatar
    smoothy Posts: 25,495, Reputation: 2853
    Uber Member
     
    #11

    Sep 6, 2017, 01:48 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by paraclete View Post
    .

    [/B]Tal, you are a true reversionist, they didn't cross the border because they thought it is their land, they did it for economic reasons.

    Smoothy is wrong you can't dump your problem on someone else, it is your problem, they have been allowed to stay there, and through a cruel political deception, they revealed themselves and made themselves more vulnerable.

    As children they are not criminals, it is a stupid idea to say they are criminals
    THey weren't born here, they aren't citizens of this country... they have no right to be here. Sending them back to their country of origin IS right and its legal. Children can be and often ARE criminals. Take a look at the Juvinile Justice system, and look at the Murders these "Children" commit daily.

    We have a law.. you HAVE to come here legally or you are here ILLEGALLY.

    If a 12 year old shoots your WIFE to death... are they not criminals? Damn right, as they are if they break any other law.

    And about Mexico... Gee... since when was Spanish a native language outside SPAIN, MOST people in Mexico and south are NOT 100% indiginous natives. MOST have European backgrounds who stole that land.. so no way in hell does Mexico have any moral OR legal high ground on this.
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,741, Reputation: 341
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    #12

    Sep 6, 2017, 01:59 PM
    Trump is right . The emperor made law that he has no right to make under our system. Trump threw the ball back in Congress court where it belongs . Don't give me all this compassion garbage . Where is your compassion for all the so called dreamers who came here the year before the cut ? Spare me your tears .

    I have no problem with the law being changed as long as Congress makes the law. We suffered for 8 years with the emperor's pen and cell phone . Enough is enough . Time to go back to the rule of law.
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,244, Reputation: 10853
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    #13

    Sep 6, 2017, 02:45 PM
    You remind me of the guys who ran from the bear, and when you got to the cabin, you closed the door behind you, on the ones who couldn't run as fast as you could. Didn't matter they were your women and children. Trump is right, congress should act. If they don't then the ball is back in his court. Even a broken watch is right twice a day.

    Lets not forget Obama acted to protect children, when the congress didn't act! Dufus acted because his loony right wing base was poking him with a sharp stick up his arse. So he punted to the do nothing congress.

    He better be careful because repubs may decide to poke him too. That wouldn't surprise me at all.

    @ Smoothy

    Your peeps weren't born here either. Stop being a grouchy sourpuss.

    @ Tom,

    Read my rant! We all know there is law to protect you, so you can order me illegal, and criminal.

    And your peeps weren't born here either.
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,741, Reputation: 341
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    #14

    Sep 6, 2017, 03:50 PM
    Let's cut to the chase . The children brought here 5 years ago will be the next group of dreamers who will be protected by some unconstitutional dictate .This is the same 1 time amnesty crap that the Dems pulled in 1986 . Come on Charlie Brown ;kick the ball again !

    Your charade don't fool me . Why don't you just admit that you won't be happy until there are open borders ? Come on ;if not tell me where is the line ? Should a 15 year old who is not covered under your unconstitutional DACA be protected ? A 10 year old ? A 5 year old ? A 1 year old ? Tell me how many of these 'dreamers ' were being rounded up and thrown out before the emperor's edict ? Answer ;zero . There hasn't been such a round up since the Ike years .

    Still ,if that was the law of the land then so be it . You shouldn't have any trouble getting it through Congress. The Dems want voters to replace the middle class they lost ;and there are enough Repubics on the payroll of the cheap labor lobby to get it done right .
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,244, Reputation: 10853
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    #15

    Sep 6, 2017, 04:46 PM
    https://www.uscis.gov/archive/consid...-arrivals-daca

    You may request DACA if you:

    1. Were under the age of 31 as of June 15, 2012;
    2. Came to the United States before reaching your 16th birthday;
    3. Have continuously resided in the United States since June 15, 2007, up to the present time;
    4. Were physically present in the United States on June 15, 2012, and at the time of making your request for consideration of deferred action with USCIS;
    5. Had no lawful status on June 15, 2012;
    6. Are currently in school, have graduated or obtained a certificate of completion from high school, have obtained a general education development (GED) certificate, or are an honorably discharged veteran of the Coast Guard or Armed Forces of the United States; and
    7. Have not been convicted of a felony, significant misdemeanor,or three or more other misdemeanors, and do not otherwise pose a threat to national security or public safety.


    The rules seem clear enough to me but what really burns my butt is after following the rules and paying your fees, some Yahoo comes and changes the rules.

    Trump's decision to end DACA, explained | PBS NewsHour

    Why now?
    In June, 11 attorneys general — from conservative states like Texas, Arkansas, West Virginia and Kansas — threatened to sue the Trump administration unless it took steps by Sept. 5 to end the program. For months, senior Trump administration officials have expressed concern that DACA would not stand up in court. Attorney General Jeff Sessions also reportedly told the president the Justice Department would not defend the program.

    Political implications
    The decision will be popular with Trump’s base, in particular with hard-line immigration opponents on the far right who have opposed DACA since the moment it launched five years ago. But like some of Trump’s other controversial decisions that appealed to his base — such as the proposed travel ban and ban on transgender people serving in the military — ending DACA won’t play well with moderate Republicans.

    And King Reagan was the PREZ in 1986. But maybe you need some background.

    A Reagan Legacy: Amnesty For Illegal Immigrants : NPR

    And I just can't stand Turd Sessions lying happy a$$ talking his racist crap. Calling people who work productively and even serve our country CRIMINALS?? That's a lie because immigrants have always come here looking for a better life. Their home countries were in complete turmoil, and chaos. They should be given the same chance the Euro's had when there were wars and devastation, in there countries. And yeah they sent for their whole family too!

    We can do better than we have in the past

    The U.S. Government Turned Away Thousands of Jewish Refugees, Fearing That They Were Nazi Spies | History | Smithsonian


    Most notoriously, in June 1939, the German ocean liner St. Louis and its 937 passengers, almost all Jewish, were turned away from the port of Miami, forcing the ship to return to Europe; more than a quarter died in the Holocaust.
    Go ahead ignore history, and keep repeating BS!
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,705, Reputation: 172
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    #16

    Sep 6, 2017, 05:59 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by smoothy View Post
    THey weren't born here, they aren't citizens of this country... they have no right to be here. Sending them back to their country of origin IS right and its legal. Children can be and often ARE criminals. Take a look at the Juvinile Justice system, and look at the Murders these "Children" commit daily.

    We have a law.. you HAVE to come here legally or you are here ILLEGALLY.

    If a 12 year old shoots your WIFE to death... are they not criminals? Damn right, as they are if they break any other law.

    And about Mexico... Gee... since when was Spanish a native language outside SPAIN, MOST people in Mexico and south are NOT 100% indiginous natives. MOST have European backgrounds who stole that land.. so no way in hell does Mexico have any moral OR legal high ground on this.
    Smoothy, there is a vast difference between those who have committed a crime, such as you describe, and those who have not.
    A child who accompanied a parent cannot be said to have acted freely, but I gather there may have been unaccompanied minors and that is surely a different position. You said send them to Canada, that is an indefensible position, deporting "law breakers" to another country.

    As to sending them to their country of origin, I expect that would raise the intelligence level of both countries, and certainly would make Mexico want to pay for the wall. If you return them to Mexico all you will have is another group who want to recross the border and a ready target for recruitment by drug smugglers.

    If you send them to the country of origin you need to send the parents too so that all may survive.

    Trump is right in striking down an unconstitutional presidential decree and there is need to tidy up the status of many millions, not just these "children".
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,741, Reputation: 341
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    #17

    Sep 6, 2017, 06:37 PM
    1. The rules seem clear enough to me but what really burns my butt is after following the rules and paying your fees, some Yahoo comes and changes the rules.
    The rules you quote were the result of a Yahoo changing the rules like the tin pot dictator he was . Trump would've been justified to end them today . He gave you open border people a window to change the law constitutionally . I suggest that you use the time wisely.

    Your example of refusing refugees is a poor comparison. That was not rounding up people who were here illegally . The German Jews turned away AND the internment of thousands of AMERICAN CITIZENS of Japanese descent was courtesy of Liberal hero FDR .
    dontknownuthin's Avatar
    dontknownuthin Posts: 2,910, Reputation: 751
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    #18

    Sep 6, 2017, 07:08 PM
    Exactly.
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,705, Reputation: 172
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    #19

    Sep 6, 2017, 07:13 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by tomder55 View Post
    The rules you quote were the result of a Yahoo changing the rules like the tin pot dictator he was . Trump would've been justified to end them today . He gave you open border people a window to change the law constitutionally . I suggest that you use the time wisely.

    Your example of refusing refugees is a poor comparison. That was not rounding up people who were here illegally . The German Jews turned away AND the internment of thousands of AMERICAN CITIZENS of Japanese descent was courtesy of Liberal hero FDR .
    Why don't you create an amnesty for all those already there who can demonstrate they have not broken any other law, and deport the rest, close the borders, so there are no day trippers either way, and sit quietly for a while contemplating your navel, which is the special skill of all those in Congress and the Senate

    The republicans would gain great political kudos from this and truly uphold their tradition of emancipation. There is a lot to be said for holding the political high ground
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,244, Reputation: 10853
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    #20

    Sep 6, 2017, 07:13 PM
    Your example of refusing refugees is a poor comparison. That was not rounding up people who were here illegally . The German Jews turned away AND the internment of thousands of AMERICAN CITIZENS of Japanese descent was courtesy of Liberal hero FDR .
    It was cruel no matter who did it. But amnesty was by a conservative hero...Reagan.

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