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    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,704, Reputation: 171
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    #1

    Mar 15, 2019, 05:55 AM
    NZ terror attack
    https://www.news.com.au/world/pacifi...ca7c7e44c4728e

    It is a terrible event, we have come to expect this sort of thing from radicalised Muslims, but we have forgotten that there are other radicals among us, white supremacists, neo nazi and such like, and if there was ever a reason that assault weapons should be banned this it. Surely we have had enough of this. These terrorists didn't just have guns they also possessed bombs which weren't detonated

    So at least there are three more gutless terrorists off the streets.

    I hear that Trump has threatened people with his radical friends, he should really stick a plug in his mouth, then he can talk out of his backside which he does frequently

    https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump-warns-it-would-be-very-bad-if-my-police-biker-gang-fans-decided-to-get-tough-on-my-opponents
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,738, Reputation: 340
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    #2

    Mar 15, 2019, 01:43 PM
    I thought NZ had strict gun laws ? Why didn't those laws prevent it ? Yeah there are radicals on all sides and the shooter should be put down like the mad dog he is. ... But consider that elected officials have taken a nonchalant position on what is becoming national crisis's around the world . the issue is uncontrolled mass migration into nations . That I believe is the main thrust of the shooter's so called manifesto . I can assure you that as horrible as the death toll is in this case ,it does not compare to the (estimated by politifact ) 600 homicides committed in the US annually by illegals . A nation has a right and an obligation to protect it's borders . If the nation won't then eventually a nut job is likely to think he has to take it into his own hands .
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,704, Reputation: 171
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    #3

    Mar 15, 2019, 02:04 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by tomder55 View Post
    I thought NZ had strict gun laws ? Why didn't those laws prevent it ? Yeah there are radicals on all sides and the shooter should be put down like the mad dog he is. ... But consider that elected officials have taken a nonchalant position on what is becoming national crisis's around the world …. the issue is uncontrolled mass migration into nations . That I believe is the main thrust of the shooter's so called manifesto . I can assure you that as horrible as the death toll is in this case ,it does not compare to the (estimated by politifact ) 600 homicides committed in the US annually by illegals . A nation has a right and an obligation to protect it's borders . If the nation won't then eventually a nut job is likely to think he has to take it into his own hands .
    NZ apparently doesn't have gun laws as strict as ours, but that may change. How this terrorist obtained the weapons easily will need to be answered. The point of migration in a place like NZ is moot, there isn't uncontrolled migration except emigration to OZ, we are forever sending their criminals back to them. What is disgusting in this is comments by Australia Senator Fraiser Anning, but he may pay at the ballot box. This act was allegedly in reaction to what has happened in Europe and the atrocities committed by Muslims there but it was a cowardly act. I agree with you regarding the obligation of a nation to protect its borders
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 37,750, Reputation: 5426
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    #4

    Mar 15, 2019, 02:22 PM
    How many homicides have been committed in the US annually by nativeborns? How many victims of mass murder by white men?
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,738, Reputation: 340
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    #5

    Mar 15, 2019, 02:27 PM
    non sequitur
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 37,750, Reputation: 5426
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    #6

    Mar 15, 2019, 02:32 PM
    But food for thought....

    In case you didn't read it, the NZ terrorist, in his 73-page manifesto, specifically cited President Trump as an inspiration. His online manifesto praises Trump as “a symbol of renewed white identity and common purpose.”
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,704, Reputation: 171
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    #7

    Mar 15, 2019, 02:42 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Wondergirl View Post
    How many homicides have been committed in the US annually by native borns? How many victims of mass murder by white men?
    Irrelevant, this isn't about white men, it isn't about where someone was born, it is about why anyone would commit a vicious act like this against people they do not know
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    Wondergirl Posts: 37,750, Reputation: 5426
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    #8

    Mar 15, 2019, 02:55 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by paraclete View Post
    Irrelevant, this isn't about white men, it isn't about where someone was born, it is about why anyone would commit a vicious act like this against people they do not know
    His manifesto was filled with hatred for minorities (e.g., Muslims) and urged white supremacists to rid the world of them.
    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 3,238, Reputation: 153
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    #9

    Mar 15, 2019, 04:55 PM
    Mass shooting in New Zealand. White people and Donald Trump are responsible. Wow, what a stretch. I hope to live long enough to see the day when people stop being so obsessed by race and more concerned with what's on the inside.

    This will, of course, be used to further restrict gun ownership in NZ.
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,738, Reputation: 340
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    #10

    Mar 15, 2019, 05:16 PM
    I dont read killers screeds .but I have heard excerpts . Manifesto implies a coherent political treatise .Calling it a manifesto elevates the importance of the ramblings and the person who authors it . I also place no legitimacy to his thoughts or motivations .He is nothing more than a mass murderer . If I was to take him seriously then I'd have to take his words seriously when he says that he chose guns because of the polarizing effect it would have on the US politics . He hoped to spark civil war here. You should think twice about suggesting his thoughts and Trump's the same .
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,704, Reputation: 171
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    #11

    Mar 15, 2019, 05:40 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by tomder55 View Post
    I dont read killers screeds .but I have heard excerpts . Manifesto implies a coherent political treatise .Calling it a manifesto elevates the importance of the ramblings and the person who authors it . I also place no legitimacy to his thoughts or motivations .He is nothing more than a mass murderer . If I was to take him seriously then I'd have to take his words seriously when he says that he chose guns because of the polarizing effect it would have on the US politics . He hoped to spark civil war here. You should think twice about suggesting his thoughts and Trump's the same .
    To think that committing an act of terrorism in NZ is some sort of commentary on the US is lunacy, and clearly this person is a lunatic. No doubt there are many fringe dwellers in the US but they need no incitement from outside to commit heinous acts.

    I think we have to take all militant minorities seriously and stop using them for political purposes as Trump did recently. All of these acts are an answer to aggression and the way to stop them is to stop interfering in other nations, How is that for thinking twice
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 37,750, Reputation: 5426
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    #12

    Mar 15, 2019, 06:58 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by tomder55 View Post
    I dont read killers screeds .but I have heard excerpts . Manifesto implies a coherent political treatise .Calling it a manifesto elevates the importance of the ramblings and the person who authors it . I also place no legitimacy to his thoughts or motivations .He is nothing more than a mass murderer . If I was to take him seriously then I'd have to take his words seriously when he says that he chose guns because of the polarizing effect it would have on the US politics . He hoped to spark civil war here. You should think twice about suggesting his thoughts and Trump's the same .
    He is a white male mass murderer of brown people.

    Since he did what he wrote (and said) what he would do, then did it, methinks we have to take him seriously.

    Trump has said a number of positive things about white supremacists and the KKK and negative things about black and brown people. The mass murderer merely echoed Trump.
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,738, Reputation: 340
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    #13

    Mar 15, 2019, 07:09 PM
    Trump has said a number of positive things about white supremacists and the KKK and negative things about black and brown people. .
    not true ,
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 53,856, Reputation: 10852
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    #14

    Mar 15, 2019, 07:28 PM
    There have always been those nuts among us willing to do the most heinous of acts. Who cares why they do it be it the ISIS criminals, or a local supremist. They are lunatics that don't represent the vast majority of good humans. Obviously they are everywhere and can be anywhere. Unfortunately we cannot predict where or when they decide to kill, so the why is also a mystery. When you hate that much, no telling when or where it will come to fruition.

    Unfortunately it was NZ turn to feel the haters curse, that will shake us all for a long time to come. I'm not going so far as to blame the dufus and his over the top bully hate speech, words, and actions, because at best he is but a symptom of a much bigger problem that allows hate and fear to thrive and influence the lunatics to action. As a good thoughtful human this killer of the innocent falls very short, and for sure there are many others.

    I don't buy his lies and excuse that killed so many.
    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 3,238, Reputation: 153
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    #15

    Mar 15, 2019, 08:01 PM
    Trump has said a number of positive things about white supremacists and the KKK and negative things about black and brown people.
    Yeah. I'd love to hear all those positive things he said about WS and the KKK. I don't recall any of that. Also love to see the negative quotes as well.
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 53,856, Reputation: 10852
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    #16

    Mar 15, 2019, 08:09 PM
    He said there were good people on both side speaking of the white nationalist and protesters in Charlottesville, and he made Muslims the enemy when he said Islam hates America. Just to name two examples.
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,738, Reputation: 340
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    #17

    Mar 16, 2019, 03:22 AM
    You see how it works Clete . The left
    believes every bad thing in the world is the fault of Trump. So they take the outrageous attack in NZ and all but blame it on him .

    Here is the quote where he allegedly praised White Supremist after Charlottesville :

    "But we're closely following the terrible events unfolding in Charlottesville, Va.. We condemn in the strongest possible terms this egregious display of hatred, bigotry and violence on many sides, on many sides. It's been going on for a long time in our country. Not Donald Trump, not Barack Obama. This has been going on for a long, long time. It has no place in America. What is vital now is a swift restoration of law and order and the protection of innocent lives. No citizen should ever fear for their safety and security in our society. And no child should ever be afraid to go outside and play or be with their parents and have a good time."I just got off the phone with the governor of Virginia, Terry Mcauliffe, and we agree that the hate and the division must stop, and must stop right now. We have to come together as Americans with love for our nation and true -- really, I say this so strongly, true affection for each other. Our country is doing very well in so many ways.
    You see .Since he did not specifically condemn white supremists he therefore supports them .

    The whole kkk thing was an ambush by the media . Trump had a history of condemning David Duke going back to 2000.
    In 2000, Trump told NBC’s “Today” that he wouldn’t seek the Reform Party nomination because he said the party was “self-destructing...………

    ” Matt LAUER: “When you say the party is self-destructing, what do you see as the biggest problem with the Reform Party right now?” Trump: “Well, you’ve got David Duke just joined – a bigot, a racist, a problem. I mean, this is not exactly the people you want in your party.”

    The New York Times also reported at the time that Trump issued a news release referring to Duke as “a Klansman” and not the “company I wish to keep.”

    Trump also spoke out against Duke in 1991 – three days after Duke lost a race for governor in Louisiana. CNN’s Larry KING: “Did the David Duke thing bother you? Fifty-five percent of the whites in Louisiana voted for him.” Trump: “I hate seeing what it represents, but I guess it just shows there’s a lot of hostility in this country. There’s a tremendous amount of hostility in the United States "


    But since he did not forcebly disavow Duke's support during the Presidential campaign ,he therefore supports the KKK.

    That's the left's bizzare logic.


    Recently David Duke tweeted praise for Rep Ilhan Omar's public statements against Israel
    : "By Defiance to Z.O.G. (Zionist Occupation Government) Ilhan Omar is NOW the most important Member of the US Congress!”

    I have heard no one in the left ,including prominent Jewish leaders like Schumer ,demanding that she condemn and disavow Duke's statements ,


    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,738, Reputation: 340
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    #18

    Mar 16, 2019, 04:12 AM
    meanwhile the silence is deafening .
    https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2019/...i0cubFLBH6uj5Q


    https://guardian.ng/news/suspected-f...kaduna-sokoto/
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,738, Reputation: 340
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    #19

    Mar 16, 2019, 04:38 AM
    from Reuters :
    "Beyond his white nationalistic views, he claimed to be an environmentalist and said he is a fascist who believes China is the nation that most aligns with his political and social values."
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,704, Reputation: 171
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    #20

    Mar 16, 2019, 05:28 AM
    Indeed, I suspect they weren't muslim

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