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    renter in DC's Avatar
    renter in DC Posts: 12, Reputation: 1
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    #1

    Apr 26, 2012, 01:13 PM
    Hold over tenant
    All,
    In Washington DC, what is the worst that can happen to me if I am a hold over tenant for two or three weeks?
    My lease will be up, and I have known for over a month the owners do not want to renew because they are selling the condo unit. Fair enough.
    However I have had bad luck in finding a replacement apartment. The rental market is thin. I finally have found one which is on hold except will not be available to me until two or three weeks AFTER my lease ends.
    My rent is paid in full for the final month of my current apartment plus the owners have one months rent security deposit of mine.
    The owners insist the painters will come the day after my lease ends which I have nicely asked them to please reschedule. No response.
    I am not cheating them, have not done any damage, and doing everything I can to vacate but I find the owners to be not nice people.
    What is the worst that can happen to me?
    Thank you.
    Fr_Chuck's Avatar
    Fr_Chuck Posts: 81,301, Reputation: 7692
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    #2

    Apr 26, 2012, 01:21 PM
    They will start eviction procedure, if rent for the next "hold over" is not paid, they can attempt a faster eviction for non payment. ( perhaps) but they can start eviction procedure.

    Ok, you did ask what is the worst? Well they can do a illegal eviction, come in, and throw everything you got out or move it to storage and you come home to the locks changed.
    Now that is not legal and you would have rights to sue, but that is the worst thing they could do. ** and it happens a 100 times a day in places.

    Also since you have been given advanced notice of repairs to the home, they will start painting and doing renovations to the home while you are still there, painters in the home all day while you are gone to work and so on.
    AK lawyer's Avatar
    AK lawyer Posts: 12,592, Reputation: 977
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    #3

    Apr 26, 2012, 01:33 PM
    Additional "worst case" possibilities:

    • They sue you for an additional month's rent.
    • Depending on the wording of the lease, they claim that the lease is renewed for an addtional year.
    • They sue you for a lost sale.
    • They sue you for a lot of extras, including costs, interest, attorney fees (if provided for in the lease), etc.
    Fr_Chuck's Avatar
    Fr_Chuck Posts: 81,301, Reputation: 7692
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    #4

    Apr 26, 2012, 01:37 PM
    Good catch, I forgot about automatically renewing the lease, yes, if the lease has a auto renewal clause and they don't move out, they could be held to another months lease.
    ScottGem's Avatar
    ScottGem Posts: 64,966, Reputation: 6056
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    #5

    Apr 26, 2012, 01:44 PM
    One of the key issues is whether they have a waiting tenant. If they don't you might mollify them by offering a little extra. Maybe an additional 10% prorated for the part of the month you will be staying.

    But, as others noted, they can make it very uncomfortable for you.
    LisaB4657's Avatar
    LisaB4657 Posts: 3,662, Reputation: 534
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    #6

    Apr 26, 2012, 01:49 PM
    Some jurisdictions provide that a holdover tenant owes rent at double the original amount during the holdover period.
    renter in DC's Avatar
    renter in DC Posts: 12, Reputation: 1
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    #7

    Apr 26, 2012, 02:04 PM
    Are you sure this all applies in Washington DC?
    Wouldn't here be some 30 days eviction notice before the owners could legally enter with repairs etc?
    They also have a security deposit and my rent is paid in full so this issue is not about "non-payment".
    AK lawyer's Avatar
    AK lawyer Posts: 12,592, Reputation: 977
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    #8

    Apr 26, 2012, 02:14 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by renter in DC View Post
    Are you sure this all applies in Washington DC?
    Wouldn't here be some 30 days eviction notice before the owners could legally enter with repairs etc?
    They also have a security deposit and my rent is paid in full so this issue is not about "non-payment".
    Sorry, but I don't know about DC in particular.

    Have they actually given you the written eviction notice? Absent specific language in the lease, I seriously doubt that they can enter to re-paint without your permission. And, push-come-to-shove, they will need a court order in any case.

    But please understand, in most places the deposit is not a substitute for timely payment of rent.
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    Fr_Chuck Posts: 81,301, Reputation: 7692
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    #9

    Apr 26, 2012, 02:31 PM
    Do not most leases allow repairs and up keep in the home with a min notice, normally one day to a week ?

    I would merely in my apartments, ( when I did paint with them there) just give notice that painters would be painting on such and such dates.

    Every spring I had a heat and air person come in and check all the units and filters ( inside and out) of every apartment. Merely posted a week before they would be there.
    AK lawyer's Avatar
    AK lawyer Posts: 12,592, Reputation: 977
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    #10

    Apr 26, 2012, 02:53 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Fr_Chuck View Post
    Do not most leases allow repairs and up keep in the home with a min notice, normally one day to a week ?
    ...
    Some do. Some don't address the situation.

    But if the painters come to the door, OP can send them away and there's really not much the LL can do about it. If they come in when OP is away, he/she can send them away when he/she gets back.
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    renter in DC Posts: 12, Reputation: 1
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    #11

    Apr 26, 2012, 03:09 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by AK lawyer View Post
    Sorry, but I don't know about DC in particular.

    Have they actually given you the written eviction notice? Absent specific language in the lease, I seriously doubt that they can enter to re-paint without your permission. And, push-come-to-shove, they will need a court order in any case.

    But please understand, in most places the deposit is not a substitute for timely payment of rent.
    I am still within my lease currently, the last day if the lease is a few weeks off. So there is not reason to evict me yet. I suppose they could start that process AFTER the lease ends. I have only notified the owners of my intent to stay two to three weeks past the end of the lease on account of the other apartment being available and asked to please re-schedule painting. There are no other renters, it will be empty. It may be on the market already to sell I am not sure and really don't care if it is. I am trying to leave. Further, maintenance of the central air, etc, happens bi-annually throughout the building in all apt. that is no problem. But why paint with all of my stuff in the way? That just seems dumb. It will be so much easier for them once I am gone.
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    renter in DC Posts: 12, Reputation: 1
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    #12

    Apr 26, 2012, 03:12 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by ScottGem View Post
    One of the key issues is whether they have a waiting tenant. If they don't you might mollify them by offering a little extra. Maybe an additional 10% prorated for the part of the month you will be staying.

    But, as others noted, they can make it very uncomfortable for you.
    There are no other renters, it will be empty.
    renter in DC's Avatar
    renter in DC Posts: 12, Reputation: 1
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    #13

    Apr 26, 2012, 03:13 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by AK lawyer View Post
    Sorry, but I don't know about DC in particular.

    Have they actually given you the written eviction notice? Absent specific language in the lease, I seriously doubt that they can enter to re-paint without your permission. And, push-come-to-shove, they will need a court order in any case.

    But please understand, in most places the deposit is not a substitute for timely payment of rent.
    Also, I have always paid my rent on time. I am fully paid to date.
    renter in DC's Avatar
    renter in DC Posts: 12, Reputation: 1
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    #14

    Apr 26, 2012, 03:17 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Fr_Chuck View Post
    Do not most leases allow repairs and up keep in the home with a min notice, normally one day to a week ?

    I would merely in my apartments, ( when I did paint with them there) just give notice that painters would be painting on such and such dates.

    Every spring I had a heat and air person come in and check all the units and filters ( inside and out) of every apartment. Merely posted a week before they would be there.
    Repairs are fine. The apt building crew regularly checks the central air, etc. But painting is more drastic and potentially damaging to my property. It will be so much easier for them once I am gone. Anyway, I am wonder whether they legally can come in and move my stuff around to paint when I am already on my way out in a few weeks.
    renter in DC's Avatar
    renter in DC Posts: 12, Reputation: 1
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    #15

    Apr 26, 2012, 03:29 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Fr_Chuck View Post
    They will start eviction procedure, if rent for the next "hold over" is not paid, they can attempt a faster eviction for non payment. ( perhaps) but they can start eviction procedure.

    Ok, you did ask what is the worst ?? well they can do a illegal eviction, come in, and throw everything you got out or move it to storage and you come home to the locks changed.
    Now that is not legal and you would have rights to sue, but that is the worst thing they could do. ** and it happens a 100 times a day in places.

    Also since you have been given advanced notice of repairs to the home, they will start painting and doing renovations to the home while you are still there, painters in the home all day while you are gone to work and so on.
    That's pretty bad. Thanks for the input.
    renter in DC's Avatar
    renter in DC Posts: 12, Reputation: 1
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    #16

    Apr 26, 2012, 03:33 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by AK lawyer View Post
    Some do. Some don't address the situation.

    But if the painters come to the door, OP can send them away and there's really not much the LL can do about it. If they come in when OP is away, he/she can send them away when he/she gets back.
    Interesting. Please tell me what "OP" and "LL" means.
    And also, thanks everyone for your responses.
    AK lawyer's Avatar
    AK lawyer Posts: 12,592, Reputation: 977
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    #17

    Apr 26, 2012, 03:39 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by renter in DC View Post
    I am still within my lease currently, the last day if the lease is a few weeks off. So there is not reason to evict me yet. I suppose they could start that process AFTER the lease ends. ...
    Very interesting question. If I was their lawyer, I'd try to be very creative and look for some authority that they can anticipate your holding over so that I could give them a notice to quit now, and get the judgment of eviction the day your lease ends. But I don't know if they can do that, frankly.

    Quote Originally Posted by renter in DC View Post
    Interesting. Please tell me what "OP" and "LL" means.
    And also, thanks everyone for your responses.
    OP = "original poster" = you. :)

    LL = landlord.

    Sorry for the shorthand. Gets tedious to type it all out.
    renter in DC's Avatar
    renter in DC Posts: 12, Reputation: 1
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    #18

    Apr 26, 2012, 03:45 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by AK lawyer View Post
    OP = "original poster" = you. :)

    LL = landlord.

    Sorry for the shorthand. Gets tedious to type it all out.
    Ah. So I may need to bring a "guard" to chase away the painters while I am off at work. Ugh. If only the LL/owners would consider my situation. They are still getting everything they want.
    Thanks again.
    renter in DC's Avatar
    renter in DC Posts: 12, Reputation: 1
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    #19

    Apr 26, 2012, 04:02 PM
    [QUOTE=AK lawyer;3098301]Very interesting question. If I was their lawyer, I'd try to be very creative and look for some authority that they can anticipate your holding over so that I could give them a notice to quit now, and get the judgment of eviction the day your lease ends. But I don't know if they can do that, frankly.


    Wow! That is super mean. And unnecessary. What difference does 2-3 weeks make when I have been a good tenant for two years? Again, I believe the owners to be not nice people and overly self-righteous so I would not put a mean move like that past them. It would be a pleasant surprise if they proved me wrong and were agreeable to an extra 2-3 weeks.
    ScottGem's Avatar
    ScottGem Posts: 64,966, Reputation: 6056
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    #20

    Apr 26, 2012, 04:20 PM
    OK, First, have you read your lease? What does it say about termination? Did you or the landlord give written notice that the lease would not be renewed? Have the landords responded to your request for some extra time?

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