[HANK]

Is the independent value of a person implied in the Golden Rule, e.g. "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you?" (Luke 6:31, Matt. 7:12)

HANK :)

[keenu]

It would imply that you want others to always treat you well... but then this is where the belief system of the individual would become the deciding factor.
If reality is always relative to the individual then YES! this would necessarily have to be based on the individual's own sense of self value, sense of worth, according to his belief system.
(Although I don't think that this implication is innate in the golden rule, I think that is a generalization)

[NeedKarma]

The neat thing about the Golden Rule rule is that is exists in so many religions whether free will is a part of that religion or not. This is a good non-denominational rule to follow in order to base our morals and ethics.

[HANK]

Abiding by the Golden Rule should ALWAYS be a quid pro quo experience, Patty. No one-way street. Reality is ALWAYS relative to an individual. This outlook promotes survival 'here on Earth.' In my case, these thoughts have nothing to do with generalization. They apply to yours truly... and only yours truly... because I'm the one who's pursuing my own individual quest for a correct and proper mind-set. To opine: I have killed the albatross!

HANK :cool:

[mike145k]

the true worth of a man can have no value unless he values truth

[NeedKarma]

Abiding by the Golden Rule should ALWAYS be a quid pro quo experience, Patty. No one-way street. Reality is ALWAYS relative to an individual. This outlook promotes survival 'here on Earth.' In my case, these thoughts have nothing to do with generalization. They apply to yours truly ... and only yours truly ... because I'm the one who's pursuing my own individual quest for a correct and proper mind-set. To opine: I have killed the albatross!

HANK :cool:

Who's this Patty you are speaking to?
And what does "I have killed the albatross!" mean?

[NeedKarma]

how dare you blah blah blah blah <snip> ,and burn in the fire of sinfor ever

You little fanatic trolling boys are a scary bunch.

Ever heard of punctuation? Ever been with a girl? I assume the answer is no to both.

[fredg]

The neat thing about the Golden Rule rule is that is exists in so many religions whether free will is a part of that religion or not. This is a good non-denominational rule to follow in order to base our morals and ethics.

Hi,
So, does this mean when you criticize me on this website, you want me to criticize you back??
fredg

[NeedKarma]

Hi,
So, does this mean when you criticize me on this website, you want me to criticize you back????
fredg

Sure.

Peace and love,
Need.

[fredg]

Hi,
Yes, it is dependent on who is doing the "doing".
"Do unto others as you would have them do unto you" contains the word "you".
What are your values? Some persons values are quite different from others. The courts are full of them!
Best wishes,
fredg

[Morganite]

Abiding by the Golden Rule should ALWAYS be a quid pro quo experience, Patty. No one-way street. :

The Golden Rule expressed by Jesus disagrees with your version.

The formula for successful relationships with others boils down to that divine code known as the Golden Rule.

"Therefore, all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them"
(Matthew 7:12).

It was the Master who said:

"And whosoever will be chief among you, let him be your servant"
(Matthew 20:27).

Unselfish, willing service to others was the keynote of His relationship with men.

"For even the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many"
(Mark 10:45).

To serve others willingly and unselfishly should be one of the Christian's greatest virtues. It is not even a matter of choice. It is an obligation, a sacred command.

This perfect code for personal conduct, taken from our Lord's sermon on the mount, attempts to point up the transcendent wisdom of the counsel involved.

But how effective is the Christianity which most people know? It has not yet made them love their neighbors as themselves, it has not yet taught the masses to turn the other cheek, to forgive seventy times seven times, to love their enemies, or to live the Golden Rule.

It has not yet taught all men to be honest chaste and truthful, or to live the Ten Commandments.

When we listen and obey we serve God best. When we do not listen and do not obey we do not serve him at all.

The way of the Christian is hard. It teaches unselfishness, even to the giving of our lives for others, and asks nothing by way of reward. Christian behavior to others is a one way street. Jesus said so.


MORGANITE


:)

[Starman]

Is the independent value of a person implied in the Golden Rule, e.g. "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you?" (Luke 6:31, Matt. 7:12)

HANK :)

Jesus giving his life for us clearly shows that he believed that we have value independent of our social status. The correct application of the Golden Rule does imply inherent worth since something of worth is treated with respect and care. Of course if applied arbitrarily it becomes worthless and can be used to excuse imjustices. But Jesus was not expecting an arbitrary application. Jesus was expecting an application in accordance with God's will as revealed to Israel and later to Christians.

Leviticus 19:15
Ye shall do no unrighteousness in judgment: thou shalt not respect the person of the poor, nor honor the person of the mighty: but in righteousness shalt thou judge thy neighbour. KJV

[31pumpkin]

I don't see how the independent value of a person could not apply. Since that person is doing the (action) in the first place so it would have to come from that person's value or belief systems..

Now, I heard from a pastor on a radio program that one could "love thy neighbor" without even knowing them. It must be a privacy thing, I determined.

In public... the rule looks like common courtesy. Either one has it or they don't! Just my take on it.

[ScottGem]

Hi,
So, does this mean when you criticize me on this website, you (directed at NeedKarma) want me to criticize you back????
fredg

I know this is an old post, but I couldn't resist responding to it.

My answer is yes. If I do something worthy of criticism then anyone should feel free to criticize me for it. The key though is the word worthy. If anyone wants to criticize someone, then they should be prepared to support that criticism with facts and/or logic. If they cannot do so, then they should back off.

For my part, if they can prove I was worthy of the criticism, then I will admit my error and apologize for it. But if I don't agree with their proof I will refute it.

This is how I treat others and therefore how I expect others to treat me.

[rudi_in]

I would imagine that because of all of the worm cans that this Golden Rule has opened we created the Platinum Rule.

"Treat others the way they want to be treated."

Obviously, the way I like to be treated and the way you like to be treated are not necessarily the same. So I am taking a risk by treating you that way.

If I treat you the way you want to be treated, it is hard for me to go wrong.

Of course, the Golden Rule was well intentioned and unfortunately the political correctness of things nowadays has caused the meaning of things to change so dramatically that it is hard to even attempt being nice to people sometimes for fear of a lawsuit.

Crazy eh?

[ScottGem]

"Treat others the way they want to be treated."

I prefer the Golden Rule. To treat people the way THEY want to be treated requires, In my opinion, that they earn the privilege. I'm not going to treat someone who has lied, been abusive, and committed other anti-social acts the way they want to be treated. Especially if they want their misbehavior to be ignored and that they be treated nicely.

[rudi_in]

Yes, of course, Scott. Personally, I simply treat folks in a way that would be considered polite and respectful by the majority of the sane and prudent people out there. Always exceptions :)

The next question is then...

Did -WWJD- replace the Platinum Rule?
Lol

[Morganite]

I would imagine that because of all of the worm cans that this Golden Rule has opened we created the Platinum Rule.

"Treat others the way they want to be treated."

The difficulty of this lies in the fact that whereas we know how we want to be treated, we do not always know how someone else wants to be treated.

If we treat others as we wish to be treated we will be doing just fine.





M:oRGANITE

[Hope12]

Hello Hank,
How are you today? There is a saying that pure gold never tarnishes, so jewelry fashioned in gold is prized and valued. Rather than discard damaged gold objects, goldsmiths rework the precious metal to fashion a new work of art because gold retains its value.
In a similar way, although Jesus pronounced the Golden Rule some two thousand years ago, its value has not diminished. By assaying, or determining, the reasons for its validity, we can better appreciate its value to us today.
When Jesus gave us the Golden Rule, “all things, therefore, that you want men to do to you, you also must likewise do to them,” he added: “This, in fact, is what the Law and the Prophets mean.” Matthew 7:12
We should cultivate the habit, not of judging people, but of trying to understand them by putting ourselves in their place—not an easy thing to do but a necessary thing if we are to abide by the Golden Rule. Jesus’ followers must be sensitive and discern the mental, emotional, and spiritual state of others. They must perceive and understand the needs of others and take a personal interest in assisting them. Philippians 2:2-4 Years later Paul wrote: “For the entire Law stands fulfilled in one saying, namely: ‘You must love your neighbor as yourself.’”—Galatians 5:14.
The idea of the Golden Rule, however, is by no means confined to the so-called Christian world. Judaism, Buddhism, and Greek philosophy all expounded this ethical maxim in one form or another. Well-known, especially to people in the Far East, is a statement by Confucius, who is venerated in the Orient as the greatest sage and teacher. In The Analects, the third of the Confucian Four Books, we find the thought expressed three times. Twice, in answer to queries from students, Confucius stated: “What you do not want done to you, do not do to others.” On another occasion, when his pupil Zigong boasted “What I do not want others to do to me, I also do not want to do to them,” the teacher responded with this sobering rejoinder, “Yes, but this you are not yet able to do.”
Reading these words, one can see that Confucius’ statement is a negative version of what Jesus later said. The obvious difference is that the Golden Rule stated by Jesus requires positive actions of doing good to others. Suppose people were to act in harmony with Jesus’ positive statement, caring about and taking steps to help others, living by this code daily. Do you think that would make today’s world a better place? Undoubtedly.
Whether the rule is stated in the positive, the negative, or any other form, what is significant is that people in different times and places and with diverse backgrounds have put much stock in the idea of the Golden Rule. This simply shows that what Jesus stated in the Sermon on the Mount is a universal teaching that touches the life of people everywhere in every age. Yes I believe those who live their life according to the golden rule add to the value of themselves and their contribution to humanity.


Take care,
Hope12

[magprob]

I live by the Gold plated platinum rule. "Stop buggin me man, you make me itch."