[Athos]

It is time for the Repubs to embrace the steal .

The Repubs INVENTED the steal! Time to stop the crooked gerrymandering by both parties.

[tomder55]

I can agree with that . The way redistricting is done is an incumbent party insurance policy . We saw in NY what happened when the gerrymandering was overruled .

I fault the Yertle led Repub Senate and the RNC for Walker's loss by less than 100,000 votes . He was left to pretty much fend for himself while the Dem machine poured in money and resources to support one of the most radical lefty candidates on this year's slate . Only Goober Graham gave Walker any lukewarm support at all. I ask Yertle and the rest of the 49 Repub Senators ;who would you rather serve in the Senate with ..... Walker or the radical Warnack ? As I've mentioned many times before ;the swamp critter statist Repubs are happy being the minority party .

It doesn't matter if I like the rigged system or not . Early voting /mail in voting /drop box/even ballot harvesting are here to stay until the Repubs put themselves in a position to change that . They will keep on having their power erode until they adapt .

[jlisenbe]

It seems rather sad to suggest that repubs must become better at being dishonest. The difficulty repubs have, I think, is that the American people have become so accustomed to the glories of deficit spending that many will not vote for anyone who opposes it. The motto now is, "more, more, more".

[tomder55]

Yes the American people share the blame . The saying is we get the government we deserve. What I am saying is based in reality . 2020 they did it in the dead of night . 2022 it was in broad daylight for all to see. 2020 the Repub base was angry . 2022 the Repub base in apathy did not show up . You think things will get better in 2 years ?
If we don't adapt and soon then steal will be codified nationally .


What Athos was refering to was SCOTUS took up a challenge to NC that on the surface is about redistricting but in reality is about if the State legislatures can keep their traditional constitutional role in national elections . SCOTUS heard oral arguments yesterday . State courts have been getting involved in the role of the legislature's power to run elections .

The pretext argument is that it is redistricting that is at issue . But a broader look at case will determine if the legislatures continue to have the power to set state election laws . Don't forget that many of the changes made to elections in 2020 were done at the state court level with covid being the excuse for the changes . Well the covid pandemic is over but the changes did not go away .

Issue: Whether a state’s judicial branch may nullify the regulations governing the “Manner of holding Elections for Senators and Representatives ... prescribed ... by the Legislature thereof,” and replace them with regulations of the state courts’ own devising, based on vague state constitutional provisions purportedly vesting the state judiciary with power to prescribe whatever rules it deems appropriate to ensure a “fair” or “free” election.

Moore v. Harper - SCOTUSblog

[jlisenbe]

2020 they did it in the dead of night . 2022 it was in broad daylight for all to see. 2020 the Repub base was angry . 2022 the Repub base in apathy did not show up . You think things will get better in 2 years ?

Good point. I don't think things will get better at all until republicans decide to start fighting this dishonesty.

[jlisenbe]

Tom, what difference will Sinema's decision make? Puts the dems back to 50. Will that make the situation similar to the past two years?

[tomder55]

She will still caucus with the Dems I believe ....so it will be status quo . It is like Bolshevik Bernie . He is not a Dem but since he caucuses and votes with them he may as well be one . The Schmukster will let her retain all her committee assignments as long as she toes the line. But she will be a burr in his saddles because she can wield more power as an independent .

The Repubs should make an all out effort to get Manchin to switch to the Repubs . Then at least there would be some power sharing .

Of course the dopy Repubs may have killed that too. They had a chance to add Manchin's energy deal that was removed from the final Inflation Reduction Act into the Defense Authorization Act . But Repubs joined enviro wackos and progressive Dems in blocking that . So good luck getting Manchin to switch.

[tomder55]

I don't think things will get better at all until republicans decide to start fighting this dishonesty.

I don't disagree . Glen Ellmers makes a similar arguement here

Hard Truths and Radical Possibilities › American Greatness (amgreatness.com)


That could be putting the cart before the horse. If the Repubs do not adopt to the changed election laws they will lose every time .The laws today will be the laws in 2024 .Those will be the rules that the election will be contested under.
Early voting in one form or another is definitely here to stay
Early In-Person Voting (ncsl.org)
Many of the states do not require in person voting and some states do only mail in balloting now. Same day registration and ballot harvesting is also becoming more frequent .
To level the playing field Republicans must first convince their voters to vote and then to secure the votes . The notion that rallying the base to come out on election day was the fatal mistake in Arizona. All the Dems had to do was manufacture machine malfunctions and force a large segment of the voters to deposit their ballots into the hands of the Dems who took custody of the ballots. Many of those ballots just happened to be comingled with ballots that were already counted .The results were predictable. The lesson is clear . Secure their votes before election day.

Look to the Florida red wave to see how it is done. More than a million Floridians voted early . This is believed to be an advantage for the Dems . But Repubs local organizations did what Dems do nation wide...... voter registration drives. Repubs added more than 500,000 new Repubs since 2018 while at the same time tightening requirements . They concentrated on expanding the base in the Miami region. As you know most Hispanic families tend to run conservative in their values. Many of them fled the left's oppression in their nations of birth.

DeSantis found an issue that mainstream America agrees is a problem ; the woke culture and it's encroachment into our education system . He made that a central plank. He avoided other culture war distraction.

[jlisenbe]

The lawsuit filed yesterday in Arizona is likely a step in the right direction. Perhaps Kari Lake can gain some traction.

​https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/202...tion-rcna61094

[tomder55]

The claims she makes are substantial and compelling . But I believe the courts are reluctant to tamper with results as opposed to their willingness to act as a super legislature while changing election rules in the 11th hour .

The voting machine malfunctions were substantial .This caused a disenfranchisement for the people who voted on election day....probably more than the 17,000 difference in the results Many people gave up and didn't vote

Votes cast were placed in boxes that were comingled with ballots already counted

AZ AG Demands Answers From Maricopa County Regarding Election Day Voting Failures – Arizona Daily Independent

The suit claims that signature verification was not done properly for mail in ballots.

The suit maintains there was inadequate chain of custody procedures for drop box ballots .

The suit charges candidate and Sec State Katie Hobbs and Maricopa official Stephen Richer of conflicts of interest . She did not recuse herself of certifying an election she was running in. She also suppressed free speech by calling for Twitter to censor and delete posts . Richer set up a never Trumper Repub pac to oppose Lake's campaign

There are probably other issues. I skimmed the 70 page complaint .

Kari-Lake-lawsuit.pdf (democracydocket.com)

I have no faith in the courts when the issue is voting .

[jlisenbe]

At the very least, the vote counting was done in a sloppy and irresponsible manner which should concern everyone. Hopefully the court will at least hold some people responsible.

[Athos]

The claims she makes are substantial and compelling .

Keri Lake is a right-wing nutjob. There is NOTHING about her that is substantial and compelling. She denied losing the election BEFORE the votes were counted. She claimed on national TV she would only accept the election results if she won.

Her claims include this stupendously stupid bit of nonsense:

The FBI & CIA are trying to destroy the First Amendment, Donald Trump and the Republican party.

[jlisenbe]

Her claims include this stupendously stupid bit of nonsense:

The FBI & CIA are trying to destroy the First Amendment, Donald Trump and the Republican party.

1. As always, there is no documentation for these claims. We are supposed to believe Athos, an action that has been proven to be unwise in the past.
2. It is abundantly clear that the FBI suggested the media bury the HB laptop story. What do you make of that?

Zuckerberg tells Rogan FBI warning prompted Biden laptop story censorship - BBC News

[tomder55]

I was referring only to the claims in the complaint .

But yeah when the FBI council left the FBI he implanted in Twitter and became their in house censor . Musk fired James Baker when it was proven that he was censoring Twitter releases even after he had ordered them released .

And Trump ? It is not even debatable . The FBI and the intel agencies lead or participated in 1st a dirty trick/ election steal on behalf of Evita in 2016 ;and after that an outright coup attempt to cover their involvement in the steal.

[Athos]

From Tomder
I was referring only to the claims in the complaint

Fine, but this claim refers to her nut-job mindset.

The FBI & CIA are trying to destroy the First Amendment, Donald Trump and the Republican party.

And Trump ? It is not even debatable . The FBI and the intel agencies lead or participated in 1st a dirty trick/ election steal on behalf of Evita in 2016

Not debatable? In fact, the FBI was blamed for the loss by Hillary Clinton to the con man. Remember Comey's disastrous announcement just prior to the election? The poor guy's been blamed ever since. He tried to clean it up, but was too late. "Boy scout", they called him. Some truth to that. In hindsight, if the FBI was working to steal the election for Hillary, they sure did a lousy job of it.

and after that an outright coup attempt to cover their involvement in the steal.

What "coup attempt" are you referring to?

[jlisenbe]

Remember Comey's disastrous announcement just prior to the election?

You mean the one concerning a crime of which it was determined she was guilty? The one that had the AG meeting in secret for 45 minutes with Bill Clinton mere days before Comey decided that, while the evidence sure pointed towards her guilt, he had decided not to press charges? Is that the announcement you are referring to???

[tomder55]

maybe the one where Comey detailed Evita's crimes and then made the absurd argument that 'no reasonable prosecutor would charge her ' .

[jlisenbe]

'no reasonable prosecutor would charge her ' .

How convenient.

[Athos]

maybe the one where Comey detailed Evita's crimes and then made the absurd argument that 'no reasonable prosecutor would charge her ' .

How was that a coup attempt?

[tomder55]

I was responding to Jl . He is also in the conversation. As to what coup attempt .... I have detailed it many times. The FBI top brass texted about an "insurance policy " in case Trump was elected . Comey Rosenstein ,Strzok Mueller ,et al. were all involved .

Former Federal prosecutor who busted the Blind Sheik for the WTC bombing :Andrew C McCarthy ;(no fan of Trump ); wrote the definitive book on the coup attempt.

'Ball of Collusion: The Plot to Rig an Election and Destroy a Presidency'

You won't read it