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jlisenbe · Jul 27, 2022, 08:17 AM

From WG. "What guns would you remove?"

From JL. I think where we are now is the right place.

Our problem is not a gun problem. Our problem is a moral problem.

From WG.
No one needs a weapon of war. Yes, a moral problem (ban shooting-people video games!) and a mental illness problem.

From JL. That's why I said so called "assault weapons". They are not weapons of war; they just look like them.

I don't like the video games either, but there is a lot more to it than that. We cannot continue to violently kill the most innocent and defenseless among us and expect our children to develop any respect for life.

Sometimes I think the mental illness aspect is overblown. What we really have is a family problem. The explosion of out of wedlock births has been devastating. The tendency of more and more men to produce children they have no intention of supporting has been similarly devastating.

Wondergirl · Jul 27, 2022, 08:48 AM

The mental illness problem isn't always inherited. For years, I've heard from friends, and especially clients, horror stories about being bullied by family members and classmates, being emotionally and even physically/sexually abused by family members/relatives. All that abuse sets the stage for broken romantic relationships and marriages. And dysfunctional "families" with unwanted children that result.

jlisenbe · Jul 27, 2022, 09:47 AM

Healthy families are the answer to much of that.

Who in the US needs a semiautomatic gun?

The person who wants to feel safe in their house. But for that matter, who in the U.S. "needs" a revolver, or a BB gun, or a single shot gun, or a muzzle loader, or a fishing rod, or a skinning knife, or an 8,000 square foot house?

Wondergirl · Jul 27, 2022, 10:30 AM

Originally Posted by jlisenbe

Healthy families are the answer to much of that.

Read Genesis 3. Healthy families are rare, even non-existent.

The person who wants to feel safe in their house.

No need for such a gun.

jlisenbe · Jul 27, 2022, 10:33 AM

Read Genesis 3. Healthy families are rare, even non-existent.

Only in your world. There are no perfect families, but I have known MANY, MANY healthy families...hundreds of them. I saw their kids in school and church and interacted with the parents.

No need for such a gun.

How do you know that?

Wondergirl · Jul 27, 2022, 10:36 AM

Originally Posted by jlisenbe

Only in your world. There are no perfect families, but I have known MANY, MANY healthy families...hundreds of them. I saw their kids in school and church and interacted with the parents.

Nope, there's always a burr under the saddle.

How do you know that?

A gun, yes. But not an assault type.

jlisenbe · Jul 27, 2022, 10:40 AM

Nope, there's.always.a burr under the saddle.

That's just silly. Using that standard, there are no physically healthy people. After all, a person might have a cavity, or a scratch, or some hidden, unknown malady. It's just ridiculous to use some standard of perfection. But healthy families??? Yeah, they are out there by the millions.

But not an assault type.

It is not legal to own an assault rifle. If you want to discuss this, then you need to educate yourself on the terminology. It's yet another clear indicator that you are, indeed, a liberal dem. Most of them don't know squat about guns.

Wondergirl · Jul 27, 2022, 10:45 AM

Originally Posted by jlisenbe

That's just silly. Using that standard, there are no physically healthy people.

"Physically healthy"???

jlisenbe · Jul 27, 2022, 10:47 AM

Yeah. You know, kind of like a physically healthy body? Applying your silly standard of perfection eliminates any possibility of being healthy in any way. It's just nonsense. I'm sorry you are in such a sorry place of the country that there are no healthy families, but they are in abundance here. Not perfect, to be sure, but healthy.

Wondergirl · Jul 27, 2022, 10:56 AM

Originally Posted by jlisenbe

Not perfect, to be sure, but healthy.

The "not perfect" is what I was aiming for.

jlisenbe · Jul 27, 2022, 10:59 AM

In post 5 I wrote, "Only in your world. There are no perfect families, but I have known MANY, MANY healthy families...hundreds of them."

There is a vast difference, in my view at least, between unhealthy and imperfect. NFL football players are not physically perfect, but they are certainly not unhealthy.

Wondergirl · Jul 27, 2022, 11:03 AM

Morally, emotionally, psychogically imperfect.

jlisenbe · Jul 27, 2022, 12:00 PM

And yet still to be regarded, in millions of cases, as healthy. Evidently you blew right past this, but it's as good of an illustration as I can think of.

"NFL football players are not physically perfect, but they are certainly not unhealthy."

The Mona Lisa is not a perfect work of art, so by your standard, it would have to be regarded as sub-standard. Wow. "Look at that artistically imperfect pile of junk! Who painted that???"

Wondergirl · Jul 27, 2022, 12:12 PM

This isn't about physical health or perfection.

Children are spanked and otherwise physically punished, loudly berated, humiliated, put down, ignored or at least pushed aside, emotionally scarred by parents, caregivers, teachers -- the adults in their lives.

jlisenbe · Jul 27, 2022, 12:39 PM

The comparison between physical health and family health is made to show how inaccurate your standard of perfection is.

Children go through difficulties for sure. Some families are good and some are disasters. Some beat their kids while others refuse to discipline them when a reasonable spanking would be a good thing. Many schools now encourage young boys to consider themselves to be girls and vice versa. Still, most children are raised in reasonably healthy environments.

This comment of yours is the core of this discussion. I consider it to be unspeakably foolish and wrong. In fact, I know it is since I had 36 years of experience of working with thousands of families. You seem to think our population is composed of entirely sorry, stinking families. That just seems far off the chart to me.

"Healthy families are rare, even non-existent."

Even worse, you have no way in the world of knowing that. You can only speak of the relatively tiny group you have experience with.

Wondergirl · Jul 27, 2022, 12:56 PM

I haven't said anything about physical health.

Do family counseling for 32 years. Then we'll talk again.

Did you spank/physically punish your own children and your students? (There is no such thing as a "reasonable spanking".)

Wondergirl · Jul 27, 2022, 01:02 PM

Originally Posted by jlisenbe

Many schools now encourage young boys to consider themselves to be girls and vice versa.

That's not true and you know it.

jlisenbe · Jul 27, 2022, 01:04 PM

I haven't said anything about physical health.

That's been explained to you quite adequately. I just don't know how else to help you.

Do family counseling for 32 years. Then we'll talk

Be a school principal for 24 years, and then we'll talk some more.

Did you spank/physically punish your own children and your

Yes and yes. As I said, to not spank a child as an error in the same way as beating them.

Wondergirl · Jul 27, 2022, 01:11 PM

Originally Posted by jlisenbe

That's been explained to you quite adequately. I just don't know how else to help you.

Again, your reading comprehension sucks. Physical health is NOT what I've been talking about.

As I said, to not spank a child as an error in the same way as beating them.

Spanking is an absolutely horrible thing to do to a child.

jlisenbe · Jul 27, 2022, 01:14 PM

Again, your reading comprehension sucks. Physical health is NOT what I've been talking about.

It is sad and funny at the same time. Like I said, I just can't help you with that piece of understanding.

Spanking is an absolutely horrible thing to do to a child.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion, even the lady who is convinced that healthy families no longer exist.