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    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #1

    Jul 8, 2022, 03:39 AM
    Shinzo Abe
    Shinzo Abe ;the longest serving PM of Japan from 2012 to 2020,;and the youngest PM in post WWII history was assassinated while campaigning for his party . He was a staunch ally of the United States . He resigned due to having chronic ulcerative colitis.

    While in office he instituted an economic program that was dubbed 'Abenomics ' (more currency weakening and government stimulus spending ) .But the economy was improving until covid and the Tokyo Olympics were cancelled .

    He raised Japan's global image and increased Japan's defensive military presence reversing years of a Constitutional policy of pacifism. He stabilized relations with China, where anti-Japanese protests had raged in the weeks before his second election. The relationship has again soured after China's crackdown on Hong Kong.
    Similarly he tried to mend territorial disputes with Russia . The reproachment has reversed since Russia's invasion of Ukraine.

    As a side note . Japan has arguably the toughest gun laws .To obtain a gun in Japan ,one needs to apply for a permit, attend a class on gun safety and laws, and pass a written test. There is a full day training course on safe shooting and practicing techniques. There are multiple rounds of checks and verification on the gun owner’s background and health, including information about their family, mental health, personal debt, and criminal record. The gun must be registered with and inspected by police. It appears the assassin used a home made shot gun.(from the amount of smoke from the blast )Abe was shot from behind .
    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 5,019, Reputation: 157
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    #2

    Jul 8, 2022, 07:36 AM
    Can't help but wonder how on earth someone managed to get that close to Abe with a homemade shotgun and fire not just once, but twice. That's pretty much the definition of lax security.
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #3

    Jul 8, 2022, 08:47 AM
    Why was security needed?
    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 5,019, Reputation: 157
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    #4

    Jul 8, 2022, 08:48 AM
    Uhm...the man was killed.
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    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #5

    Jul 8, 2022, 09:00 AM
    And was killed with what? (How likely would a shooting be in Japan? When was the most recent one? How many a year?)

    ***Firearms are strictly regulated in Japan, a country of some 125 million people. Annual deaths from guns are regularly in single figures, rarely exceeding 10 per year.

    Getting a gun licence is a long and complicated process for Japanese citizens.

    Japanese gun-ownership restrictions do not allow private citizens to have handguns.***
    https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/...fatal-shooting


    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 5,019, Reputation: 157
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    #6

    Jul 8, 2022, 09:18 AM
    ***Firearms are strictly regulated in Japan, a country of some 125 million people. Annual deaths from guns are regularly in single figures, rarely exceeding 10 per year.
    Yep. Worked out real well for Abe, didn't it? For a former prime minister you would think there would at least be a few uniformed cops keeping an eye out. They still have knives and fists, after all, and as it turned out, some homemade guns. A little common sense would have kept the man alive.
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #7

    Jul 8, 2022, 09:21 AM
    It isn't safe anywhere, is it.

    Thank you for your response. I hope you noticed that I included a link.
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    jlisenbe Posts: 5,019, Reputation: 157
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    #8

    Jul 8, 2022, 09:40 AM
    Japan is a remarkably safe country, and yet it happened. I still can't imagine a man of Abe's stature giving a speech with either no security, or security so poor that a man could basically walk up with a homemade gun and just kill the man. Incredible.

    I commend you for your link.
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    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #9

    Jul 8, 2022, 10:00 AM
    ***Police said that Tetsuya Yamagishi, a 41-year-old unemployed man, was arrested at the scene and was being investigated for murder. The suspect confessed to his crime, police said, adding that he told them he harbored a grudge against a group he believed was connected to Abe. Yamagishi also claimed to police that he had previously worked at Japan's Navy for three years.

    Video footage of Abe’s speech showed a puff of white smoke appear behind the former leader along with two loud cannon-like blasts. Security officers were seen tackling a man to the ground, with video and photos showing what appeared to be an improvised weapon lying on the ground.***
    https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/j...shot-rcna37228
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #10

    Jul 8, 2022, 10:04 AM
    The point is that if someone is determined to kill they will find a way. Clearly the security was lax because they were lulled into a false sense of security with their tough laws
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #11

    Jul 8, 2022, 10:12 AM
    Good point, tomder!
    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 5,019, Reputation: 157
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    #12

    Jul 8, 2022, 10:52 AM
    Clearly the security was lax because they were lulled into a false sense of security with their tough laws
    Yes, that was a good point, which makes people wonder why on earth WG ever said this. "Why was security needed?
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    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #13

    Jul 8, 2022, 10:59 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by jlisenbe View Post
    why on earth WG ever said this. "Why was security needed?
    Why? Because of tough gun laws. My question was to stimulate discussion.
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    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #14

    Jul 8, 2022, 11:25 AM
    We learned the hard way with the near assignation of Reagan. We learned that even Congress was not safe when a Bernie Sanders supporter targeted Republican members of Congress. I hope we learned when a would-be assassin targetted Bret Kavanaugh. I hope we learned when a would-be assassin put a bullet in Gabby Grifford

    Security matters. Gun laws don't matter Due diligence does matter.
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    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #15

    Jul 8, 2022, 11:48 AM
    What about better, more coherent, mental health responses? Crimo had problems even as a young boy, many flowing from parental conflicts that overwhelmed him.
    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 5,019, Reputation: 157
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    #16

    Jul 8, 2022, 11:50 AM
    Yep. It's hard to imagine how anyone could have walked up to within twenty feet or so of Abe carrying a gun that appears to be perhaps 20" long in a fairly sparse crowd and get off two shots without being noticed by the half-dozen or so security guards who were all too ready to take action when it was too late. Let us hope we learn something from that.

    Mental health responses? You mean from the people who have decided that there are dozens of genders? Don't have much confidence in that one. Perhaps we should return to a genuine respect for the sacredness of human life. I'll recount a quick story.

    I was at our now closed (thank God!) abortion clinic several weeks ago. Two journalists from the Boston Globe were there. They clearly had no intention of interviewing the pro-life side. I asked one as she was leaving if she would talk with us. She claimed she would, but then never came back, so I found one of them in a nearby coffee shop and asked if she minded if I talked with her a bit. She agreed. Towards the end of a not very long discussion, I suggested she do some research on how abortions are performed. She replied that she didn't need to do that since the "clinic" had allowed her to watch one that very morning. I asked if she had witnessed the doctor pulling out the arms, legs, head, etc. and reassembling it all on a metal tray. She said she had. I was a little shocked, so I asked her if she was OK with that. "It's the woman's choice," she coolly answered. I would suggest that getting from that level of hard-heartedness to shooting an innocent person is not a very long trip. It might be no distance at all.
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #17

    Jul 8, 2022, 11:54 AM
    half-dozen or so security guards who were all too ready to take action when it was too late. Let us hope we learn something from that.
    That has been my constant theme about 2nd amendment rights . The police are there to maybe apprehend the perp after the fact and to draw chalk lines around the victim .
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #18

    Jul 8, 2022, 11:55 AM
    And what about those people standing next to Abe's assassin?
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #19

    Jul 8, 2022, 11:58 AM
    What about better, more coherent, mental health responses? Crimo had problems even as a young boy, many flowing from parental conflicts that overwhelmed him.
    Legit points needing addressing . Gun laws don't address them
    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 5,019, Reputation: 157
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    #20

    Jul 8, 2022, 12:01 PM
    And what about those people standing next to Abe's assassin?
    Good question. Still, they are not trained, well-paid security. There is no excuse in my mind for that abysmal failure.

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