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    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 5,020, Reputation: 157
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    #41

    Dec 17, 2022, 06:35 AM
    Are you invited? If so, then I'm impressed. My invitation must have been lost somehow in the mail.
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #42

    Dec 17, 2022, 08:24 AM
    It's over with. Note the date. I wore my long purple gown and tennis shoes. It was potluck, so I brought a wonderful Corn Casserole and Teriyaki Chicken Wings. The best part of the event was the display and adoption of shelter animals. I now share my life with a beautiful Golden Retriever!
    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 5,020, Reputation: 157
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    #43

    Dec 17, 2022, 08:47 AM
    Uhm...no, you weren't there. But I have no doubt you can make a killer corn casserole.
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #44

    Dec 17, 2022, 09:05 AM
    Want the recipe? Mrs. Markarova couldn't wait to duplicate it at home for Christmas dinner!
    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 5,020, Reputation: 157
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    #45

    Dec 17, 2022, 09:13 AM
    I'd be happy to give it to my wife. Wisely, we let her do the cooking around here.
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #46

    Dec 20, 2022, 04:06 AM
    haven't made corn casserole but I whip up casseroles with tuna or other left overs . I grill all types of chicken wings recipes . One of the best things about being in SC is that I can fire up the grill almost year round .
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #47

    Dec 20, 2022, 01:45 PM
    20 years in Afghanistan . But in the end the people of Afhanistan are free at last Right ?

    Afghanistan: Taliban closes universities to women - BBC News
    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 5,020, Reputation: 157
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    #48

    Dec 20, 2022, 02:36 PM
    Another great big vote of thanks to the Biden admin.
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #49

    Dec 20, 2022, 03:01 PM
    Yeah, Clueless screwed up the withdrawal. But it became a failed mission when we did not chase OBL into Pakistan and destroy him and anyone who got in the way. When we decided to try to turn this pedophile ;woman hating ;goat fornicating culture into a liberal democracy the mission was doomed to failure.

    This is all retrospect because I bought into the narrative that people yearn for liberty. But in truth many people in this world are content with serfdom (including in the good ole USA) .

    We should've left and told them we would destroy any terror camp but otherwise if they want to live in the stone age it isn't our concern.
    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 5,020, Reputation: 157
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    #50

    Dec 20, 2022, 04:22 PM
    We should've left and told them we would destroy any terror camp but otherwise if they want to live in the stone age it isn't our concern.
    Just about right. If it was just a matter of a few bucks, then different story, but when it becomes a matter of blood then that's too much.
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #51

    Jan 15, 2023, 06:07 AM
    Navy leaders are sounding the alarm . Soon we will have a choice ;arm Ukraine or arm the US. Navy Secretary Carlos Del Toro ,and James G. Stavridis; retired U.S. Navy admiral who formerly served as the NATO supreme allied commander for Europe from 2009 to 2013,both raised concerns .

    Navy Secretary Warns: If Defense Industry Can’t Boost Production, Arming Both Ukraine and the US May Become ‘Challenging’ - Defense One


    Starvis predicted a stalemate for some time with Ukraine having the advantage on the ground and Russia owning the sky . Curious then that the next big push by the West is to give tanks to Ukraine. The battlefield is littered with the carcass of tanks . The Russians were not able to gain an advantage on the ground with tanks and neither did Ukraine . Drones,mobile anti-tank equipment,IEDs,attack helicopters and precision artillery have laid them to waste. Tanks are no longer adequately defended.

    The arsenal is being depleted and production has not been ramped up sufficently to replace the arms we are sending . Given costs and supply chain challenges and $$$$$$$costs it will not happen soon.

    Part of the air defense concerns will be addressed when Patriot systems get deployed . That will mean extensive training of Ukraine personnel.

    They are coming to America for that purpose. Why don't we just declare war and get it over with ?

    Ukrainian Troops Headed to U.S. for Patriot Missile Training > U.S. Department of Defense > Defense Department News
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #52

    Jan 15, 2023, 07:20 AM
    btw ;350,000 Russian conscripts have been concentrated on the Ukraine Belarus border ;and are waiting for the ground to freeze to open a new front in the war. The Belarusian defense ministry confirmed the arrival of the contingent last week . This force will be combined with troops from Belarus .
    The fact is that fighting in the areas in the south and east that have seen the heavy concentration of WWI style combat is slowly bleeding Ukraine's ability to conduct the war .

    But in the country's east, where Russian forces are intensifying efforts on the embattled Donbas region, weeks of brutal combat have pushed the defenders to a breaking point.
    Now, under ceaseless bombardment and after immense casualties, some Ukrainian troops say they are feeling abandoned by their leadership — left to die in hopeless conditions.
    'In this war, the ordinary infantryman is nothing': Ukrainian soldiers in Donbas feel abandoned and outgunned | CBC News

    Ukraine succeeded in fighting a force of 160,000 poorly led Russians to a standstill in the 1st year of the war. Russia has adapted and reinforced. Ukraine just does not have the manpower to reinforce in kind.
    Athos's Avatar
    Athos Posts: 1,108, Reputation: 55
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    #53

    Jan 15, 2023, 09:42 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by tomder55 View Post
    Ukraine succeeded in fighting a force of 160,000 poorly led Russians to a standstill in the 1st year of the war.
    In the first year?? Do you mean the war that was supposed to be a walkover for Russia in THREE DAYS?

    Why are you supporting Russia with your posts?
    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 5,020, Reputation: 157
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    #54

    Jan 15, 2023, 12:42 PM
    Evidently telling the truth now amounts to supporting Russia.
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #55

    Jan 15, 2023, 12:53 PM
    I ask you why you favor the wholesale slaughter of Ukraine . They can't win this war . Yes Russian ineptitude and massive western arms have prolonged the war , So far all it has done is destroy a generation of Ukrainians

    Show me where I have supported Russia unless you mean I do not swallow the government line since the fall of the Soviet Union

    I am a realist, I am quite sure that the REAL reason for the war was NATO and EU expansion towards the Russian border .U.S. and European leaders blundered in attempting to turn Ukraine into a Western stronghold on Russia’s border ;and the Ukrainians are paying the price.

    This is not new starting with Putin. Before him Yeltzin warned about NATO expansion during NATO's air campaign against their ally Serbia.
    Yeltsin pointed to the NATO attacks as evidence that Russia has much to fear from Western plans to broaden the alliance to include former Soviet republics and former Communist countries in Eastern Europe.



    “It would be a major political error on the part of those who are now insisting on expanding NATO,” Yeltsin warned. “It will mean a conflagration of war throughout all Europe.”
    With its bombing raids aimed at forcing the Serbian rebels to the negotiating table, “NATO is already showing what it is capable of,” Yeltsin stated--"only of bombing, and then counting the trophies of how many are killed among the civilian population.”


    Yeltsin Lashes Out at NATO Strikes in Bosnia - Los Angeles Times (latimes.com)

    But the Russians were too weak at the time to stop NATO’s eastward movement.

    After incorporating most former eastern block nations that did not border Russia (except the Baltic States )into NATO , NATO all but gave an invitation to Georgia and Ukraine to join. in 2008

    Russia invaded Georgia to protect Russian ethnic regions . That should've been a warning that we had pushed Russia as far as Russia would go . We were willing to have a world war in 1963 for less than what we have done to threaten their national security .

    But there was more .

    2014 the US not so covertly assisted in the overthrow of the Russia friendly duly elected President of Ukraine ( according to international observers ) Viktor Yanukovych He rejected the European Union’s terms for an association agreement in late 2013, in favor of a Russian offer. That was enough to oust him.

    John McCain went to Kiev to dine with opposition leaders and demonstrate US support for their cause . Victoria Nuland, the assistant secretary of state for European and Eurasian Affairs under the emperor traveled to Ukraine three times in the weeks following the start of the demonstrations to demonstrate US support for them.Russian intelligence intercepted and leaked to the international media a Nuland phone call in which she and U.S. ambassador to Ukraine Geoffey Pyatt discussed in detail their preferences for specific personnel in a post‐​Yanukovych government. In other words ;the US was planning a post coup government while Yanukovych was still the country's President . So much for respecting the democratic process.,

    The so called Euromaidan Revolution toppled him .The emperor's regime and the compliant press called it a popular uprising against a brutal regime without stating their own meddling


    Russia reacted by seizing control of Crimea for fear Russia would lose it's naval base there .
    Russia was pushed into a corner and we were ,shocked , shocked that they pushed back
    Athos's Avatar
    Athos Posts: 1,108, Reputation: 55
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    #56

    Jan 15, 2023, 02:01 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by tomder55 View Post
    I am quite sure that the REAL reason for the war was NATO and EU expansion
    The REAL reason for the war was Russia invading Ukraine! Duh.

    Show me where I have supported Russia
    Your reasons are the same as Russian propaganda.
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #57

    Jan 15, 2023, 02:27 PM
    Maybe but there are plenty foreign policy experts in the country that agree with my POV.
    Some are
    John Mearsheimer ;the R. Wendell Harrison Distinguished Service Professor at the University of Chicago

    The author of America's policy of containment and former US Ambassador to Russia,the late George Kennan was a long time critic of US post Cold War policies .

    The late profesor emeritus of Russian studies at Princeton University and New York University, Stephen F Cohen (husband of Katrina vanden Heuvel ) was very critical of NATO expansion ;and predicted it would lead to war.

    None of tbese and many others in the realist school of American foreign policy can be truthfully charged with being Russian propagandists .

    Apologists for an indefensible US post cold war policy accuse critics of being propagandists to shut them up
    Athos's Avatar
    Athos Posts: 1,108, Reputation: 55
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    #58

    Jan 15, 2023, 02:33 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by tomder55 View Post
    None of tbese and many others in the realist school of American foreign policy can be truthfully charged with being Russian propagandists
    None of those mentioned support Putin's policy of invading his neighbors to create a new Russian Empire.
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    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #59

    Jan 15, 2023, 02:39 PM
    They all predicted that would be the result . Did we come to the brink in 1963 because the Russian were threatening us from Cuba ? It was only good luck that prevented it .

    That is where we are today except now there is no back door diplomacy occurring that I know of . All there is is escalation.
    Athos's Avatar
    Athos Posts: 1,108, Reputation: 55
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    #60

    Jan 15, 2023, 02:51 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by tomder55 View Post
    now there is no back door diplomacy occurring that I know of . All there is is escalation.
    You don't back down in the face of a bully. You confront the bully whether it's a person or a nation.

    Lack of confrontation in 1939 led to WW2 and 50+ million dead.

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