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    Athos's Avatar
    Athos Posts: 1,108, Reputation: 55
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    #141

    Jun 13, 2021, 08:34 PM
    Several myths are contained in the above posts.

    Myth # 1. "All taxes are passed on to consumers".

    There is an ongoing debate among economists over the incidence of the corporate income tax. TPC assumes that 80 percent of the burden falls on capital and shareholders, while labor bears about 20 percent. This view is roughly shared by the Congressional Budget Office and the Congressional Joint Committee on Taxation.

    https://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxv...-them-and-when

    https://www.huffpost.com/entry/tax-t...orati_b_541709

    https://www.cs.cmu.edu/~ref/econ101e.html


    Myth # 2. "Non vaccinated people only put themselves at risk".

    Hard to believe such a statement could be made after a year of constant info re the Covid-19 pandemic. The risk from non-vaccinated people threatens any other non-vaccinated individuals whether family, friends, or strangers. Pandemic 101.


    Myth # 3. "A corporation is not a personally owned business".

    A corporation is a limited liability form of organization. It can be owned by one person, few persons, or many persons. They may or may not receive taxable profits. Corporations often do not declare dividends (profits).
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,706, Reputation: 173
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    #142

    Jun 13, 2021, 08:44 PM
    Let's discuss another myth corporate tax rates should be zero, now if corporations were required to distribute all profits as income to individuals this might be feasible but corporations do not
    waltero's Avatar
    waltero Posts: 620, Reputation: 5
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    #143

    Jun 13, 2021, 09:09 PM
    There is no American who does not have access to vaccines
    What about Otis?
    If they don't allow Otis (my American Bulldog) the vaccine, then I don't want any part of it!...same with Snubs, my pet pigeon.


    They think it's a plot to insert tracking devices into arms.
    Wonder why anybody would think that (https://vinepair.com/articles/govern...oison-alcohol/)?

    WAIT! You think they'd insert Snubs? Ain't nobody gonna vaccinate Snubs!!!
    Athos's Avatar
    Athos Posts: 1,108, Reputation: 55
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    #144

    Jun 13, 2021, 11:53 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by paraclete View Post
    Let's discuss another myth corporate tax rates should be zero, now if corporations were required to distribute all profits as income to individuals this might be feasible but corporations do not
    It's worth discussing.

    If corporations were required to distribute all profits to individuals, the distributed profits can come in the form of dividends to shareholders or in the form of reduced prices for consumers. Reducing consumer prices would result in higher income for consumers and a corresponding increase in taxable income. Does this compensate for the loss of corporate tax revenue? Perhaps distributing the price reduction over a far wider base than captured via corporate pre-price-reduction prices would generate far less tax revenue. E.g., $100,000 taxable income of a single entity at its marginal rate produces far more tax revenue than the same $100,000 distributed over 10,000 consumers.

    No taxes for corporations would also stop the creative ways corporations have of evading taxes, thereby putting a lot of lawyers out of work. The reduced income for lawyers would reduce the tax revenue from the lower income. But tax revenue from consumers, not being as clever as corporations in evading taxes, would show an increase in tax revenue.

    The effect on competition might drive prices down as tax planning would no longer be necessary, eliminating another expense. But a new expense must be approved - the expense of current and/or future expansion, and research and development to stay competitive while eliminating the need for depreciation.

    Your thoughts?
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #145

    Jun 14, 2021, 03:29 AM
    A significant amount of corporate taxes fall on the consumers through prices . Governments that want out of control spending will make the argument that taxing corporations is a painless way to fund the pork . Nothing could be further from the truth .
    This paper provides evidence that corporate taxes impact retail product prices, and that a significantportion of corporate tax incidence falls on consumers.

    The fact that corporate taxes affect product prices, as well as payouts to shareholders andwages, has important implications for tax policy. In particular, models used by policymakerslike the CBO and US Treasury may underestimate the incidence of corporate taxes on consumers

    If corporate taxes are partially incident on consumers, ratherthan primarily being borne by shareholders and workers, There remain several fruitful avenues for further exploration. First, our analysis necessarilthese taxes may be much less progressive than is commonly asserted. This is especially true since we find that lower priced goods and goods purchased by low income households are the ones most sensitive to changes in corporate taxes.
    w27058.pdf (nber.org)

    Using granular gas price data and rich variation in corporate tax rates, we find that corporate taxes increase consumer prices, especially when consumer demand is less elastic and markets are less competitive. The tax incidence on consumers is also stronger when tax avoidance opportunities and other tax shields are limited. We additionally show that shifting taxes to consumers reduces the impact of taxes on organizational form choice and growth. Our results suggest that firms reduce their tax burden by shifting taxes to stakeholders, which is rooted in firms’ market power and the unavailability of other strategies reducing the tax burden

    Using census data on the gas prices of nearly all German gas stations and local variations in business tax rates in 4,507 municipalities, we show that higher local business taxes increase consumer prices. Hence, part of the corporate tax incidence appears to fall on consumers. We further show that the effect of business taxes on gas prices increases when gas stations have greater market power and when tax avoidance opportunities or other tax shields are limited. Finally, the results of our supplemental tests further suggest that shifting taxes to consumers reduces the impact of taxes on organizational form choice and growth and could result in greater pre-tax profitability
    delivery.php (ssrn.com)
    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 5,019, Reputation: 157
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    #146

    Jun 14, 2021, 04:25 AM
    Hard to believe such a statement could be made after a year of constant info re the Covid-19 pandemic. The risk from non-vaccinated people threatens any other non-vaccinated individuals whether family, friends, or strangers. Pandemic 101.
    That's kind of the whole point. If you don't want risk from Covid, then get vaccinated. If another person chooses to forego vaccination, then that is his or her personal choice. It does not put the vaccinated person at risk at all. It only generates risk for those who choose not to be vaccinated, which is exactly what I said to begin with. Choosing not to be vaccinated only puts yourself and others who choose to be non-vaccinated at risk in an area with widespread access to the vaccine. Pandemic 101 for those who think.

    A corporation is a limited liability form of organization. It can be owned by one person, few persons, or many persons.
    That's only partially true. An S corporation can be owned by one person. It's done, as I understand it, largely to limit liability and save money on social security taxes, but they operate under different tax regs than other corporations and are treated, again as I understand it, as a private business for the purposes of taxation. But the great majority of large corporations are owned by many, many people.

    Saying corporations do not pass out all profits to the corporate owners is a strange comment. Then what is done with it? You might say that some of it is reinvested into the corporation in the form of purchasing new equipment or building a new plant. If so, then in what sense was that money a profit? Wouldn't those be considered legitimate business expenses?
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #147

    Jun 14, 2021, 05:12 AM
    The G7 dipped their toes into the China problem.

    about China's aggression against it's neighbors , they wrote of “the situation in the East and South China Seas,” without specifying that the "situation " was take over of other nations territory and turning the atolls into military bases to further enforce their premise that the whole South and East China seas are Chinese lakes . They talked of Hong Kong and Taiwan as “human rights and fundamental freedoms,” and “the importance of peace and stability across the Taiwan Strait” instead of saying that China is in violation of treaty in it's suppression of Hong Kong liberties and that they repeatedly threaten to invade Taiwan.
    About the growing evidence of covid's origins in the Wuhan research lab they write
    “We also call for a timely, transparent, expert-led, and science-based WHO-convened Phase 2 COVID-19 Origins study including, as recommended by the experts’ report, in China,”

    So they want WHO ;the organization that carried the water for the Chinese false narrative about covid to take the lead in another cover up investigation. Some of the same investigators have clear conflicts of interest because they were involved in funding the Wuhan lab.
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,327, Reputation: 10855
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    #148

    Jun 14, 2021, 05:16 PM
    The best way to reform an institution/organization/group is to be a part of it. Go Joe Go!!
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,706, Reputation: 173
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    #149

    Jun 14, 2021, 07:19 PM
    so You want to reform China by being part of it, good luck with that, you want to reform Antifa by being part of it? you want to reform BLM by being part of it? perhaps you want to reform the Taliban by being part of it, Sometimes you make ridiculous statements
    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 5,019, Reputation: 157
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    #150

    Jun 14, 2021, 07:40 PM
    so You want to reform China by being part of it, good luck with that,
    Well said.
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,327, Reputation: 10855
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    #151

    Jun 14, 2021, 08:21 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by paraclete View Post
    so You want to reform China by being part of it, good luck with that, you want to reform Antifa by being part of it? you want to reform BLM by being part of it? perhaps you want to reform the Taliban by being part of it, Sometimes you make ridiculous statements
    My reference was to the WHO an institution but it does extend to even the groups you mention as an effort to engage and form a basis of co operation like you do with China and us through trade agreements. So not so ridiculous in that aspect. Because that hasn't been done in many cases doesn't mean you rule it out all together, forever.
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,706, Reputation: 173
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    #152

    Jun 14, 2021, 08:26 PM
    and how could you being part of the WHO improve it? do you have superior medical knowledge? Trump took the US out of the WHO because of its alignment with China, before then you were part of it and it didn't change anything
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,327, Reputation: 10855
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    #153

    Jun 15, 2021, 08:31 PM
    The dufus playing drama queen didn't help the cover up(?) either Clete. Nor his own cover up of the real scale and scope of the virus, or any of his antics. Nothing to do with the WHO repeating the party line which was the only line at the time.

    He should have stayed and pressed for the truth instead of being an incompetent petulant big mouth beetch.
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,706, Reputation: 173
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    #154

    Jun 15, 2021, 08:38 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by talaniman View Post

    He should have stayed and pressed for the truth instead of being an incompetent petulant big mouth beetch.
    Yahda, yahda, yahda, shouldda, wouldda, couldda, Is Trump the only person who could have taken action over there? without him everything is frozen? well I think your demonrat obstruction in Congress might have a case to answer too
    waltero's Avatar
    waltero Posts: 620, Reputation: 5
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    #155

    Jun 16, 2021, 08:52 AM
    The best way to reform an institution/organization/group is to be a part of it. Go Joe Go!!
    True, there's a new Dufus in town. I trust he will make a lasting impression, much the same as our previous prez.
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,706, Reputation: 173
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    #156

    Jun 16, 2021, 09:13 PM
    got it in one the role of dufus has been pick up by another, see tal, not everyone thinks there is only one dufus at the top there
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #157

    Jul 6, 2021, 03:04 AM
    Quid made a bold move . He used an oversized cue card at a Michigan shop to answer a simple question about the recent ransomware attack . He is dangerously feeble and unfit to be the President .

    Joe Biden struggles & forced to refer to notes when asked about alleged Russian cyber hack - YouTube

    This is not the 1st time he has done this . He has been seen using cheat sheets at press conferences and at the meeting with Putin.
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,706, Reputation: 173
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    #158

    Jul 6, 2021, 06:28 AM
    So he isn't on top of everything, good reason why he should remain in the background
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,327, Reputation: 10855
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    #159

    Jul 6, 2021, 07:54 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by tomder55 View Post
    Quid made a bold move . He used an oversized cue card at a Michigan shop to answer a simple question about the recent ransomware attack . He is dangerously feeble and unfit to be the President .

    Joe Biden struggles & forced to refer to notes when asked about alleged Russian cyber hack - YouTube

    This is not the 1st time he has done this . He has been seen using cheat sheets at press conferences and at the meeting with Putin.
    So what? After 4 years of the lying cheating blithering idiot old Joe is a welcome change. He doesn't have to be perfect, like the dufus claimed to be.
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #160

    Jul 6, 2021, 08:49 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by tomder55 View Post
    Quid made a bold move . He used an oversized cue card at a Michigan shop to answer a simple question about the recent ransomware attack . He is dangerously feeble and unfit to be the President .
    I, along with most of the world's population, have no clue what ransomware is. But ask Joe and me about who was on Saturday morning cowboy shows or to rattle off a nursery rhyme, no problemo!

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