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    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 5,019, Reputation: 157
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    #21

    Oct 25, 2020, 05:39 PM
    https://www.foxnews.com/politics/bid...ling-bar-owner
    Athos's Avatar
    Athos Posts: 1,108, Reputation: 55
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    #22

    Oct 25, 2020, 08:33 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by talaniman View Post
    Please link your ad again please.
    You are referring to the post that claimed Biden's ad was a lie from beginning to end. The lie was in that post from Jilsenbe.

    Here's the truth.

    Joe Malcoun’s business interests were already a matter of public record before the ad was made, and the Biden campaign said it had pulled the ad due to harassment and threats against Malcoun and his family, not because the campaign had been “caught” in any dishonesty.

    The Trump people initiated the false rumor that the Biden campaign had been "caught in a lie". The rumor was completely false and Trump's real motive was to attack the Michigan governor who had been threatened with kidnapping and death by Trump's supporters. These morons are now in custody having been caught by the FBI.

    Trump has yet to condemn the actions of these followers of his.

    The price for having a voice in our political process cannot be endless harassment. And yet, that is what Joe Malcoun and his family currently face as he was doxxed, harassed, and threatened after the Trump campaign has sought to smear a community leader who dared to speak out against Trump’s failed response to the COVID crisis. It is shameful.
    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 5,019, Reputation: 157
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    #23

    Oct 25, 2020, 08:59 PM
    I posted much of the article below along with a link to a second source. The ad is just laughably a lie. First of all, Trump did not shut down the man's business, the Michigan gov did with Malcoun supporting her action. So to blame Trump is sheer nonsense. And if he really wanted to keep his bar open, he has PLENTY of financial resources to do it. And to top it all off, he is not simply a small businessman caught in the squeeze. He is a major Biden supporter. So as soon as their deception became public, the Biden campaign pulled the ad and took it off of Youtube. They knew they had been caught in a monstrous lie. For you to defend this is really wild.

    You can't have it both ways. You can't complain about a lack of centralized control and planning as you have done, but then blame Trump for what are local decisions which his administration neither planned nor controlled. If Malcoun thinks he's struggling now, he should wait to see if Biden is elected. If that happens, then we'll have a pres who will shut businesses down with no regard at all for the economy. Take a look at NYC if you want a model. I have read that about half of the restaurants there will not reopen. What a disaster.

    The Biden team is under fire for releasing a TV campaign ad last week depicting a Michigan bar owner struggling to keep his business afloat during the pandemic.
    What the ad fails to mention is the man is actually a wealthy tech investor who made contributions to the former vice president’s campaign. He also supported Michigan Gov. Gretchen Whitmer's stay-at-home orders that kept businesses shuttered longer.
    The ad, which was posted to YouTube on Thursday and aired Sunday on CBS during NFL games, features Joe Malcoun, who is listed as the “co-owner” of The Blind Pig, a once-popular bar and music venue in Ann Arbor, Mich. Malcoun blamed his business’ economic downturn on President Trump’s COVID-19 response.
    “For 50 years, The Blind Pig has been open and crowded – but right now it’s an empty room,” he says in the one-minute ad, showing the empty venue. “This is the reality of Trump’s COVID response.”

    The Blind Pig co-owner, Joe Malcoun, seen in a recent TV ad released by Joe Biden's presidential campaign.

    “We don’t know how much longer we can survive not having any revenue. A lot of restaurants, bars that have been mainstays for years will not make it through this. This is Donald Trump’s economy," he continued. "There’s no plan, you don’t know how to move forward. It makes me so angry. My only hope for my family and this business and my community is that Joe Biden wins this election. That’s the kind of person we need.”
    https://dailycaller.com/2020/10/20/j...ngel-investor/

    https://news.yahoo.com/biden-campaig...200752577.html
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,327, Reputation: 10855
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    #24

    Oct 25, 2020, 09:52 PM
    I Googled "trump misleading campaign ads", and decided to watch The Walking Dead and the great overtime finish between Arizona and Seattle, followed by Netflix with the wife, rather than engage in a tit for tat about silly season campaign ads/lies/distortions that the dufus surely loses.

    You got one of thousands and I got thousands of tens of thousands. That doesn't include the 60 Minutes interview. I guess my priorities are all screwed up!

    I just forgot to hold my nose when I voted Biden/Harris. Sad I know...Oh well...glad you got a thrill out of it!
    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 5,019, Reputation: 157
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    #25

    Oct 25, 2020, 10:19 PM
    Except that, as usual, you didn't name one specific example, and you still have not responded to Biden's absolute lie of an ad.

    At least you are honest in having to hold your nose to vote Harris/Biden. This is a poor year for pres candidates as was the case four years ago.
    Athos's Avatar
    Athos Posts: 1,108, Reputation: 55
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    #26

    Oct 26, 2020, 02:44 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by jlisenbe View Post
    The ad is just laughably a lie.
    I guess more truth is required to dismiss the nonsense about Trump catching Biden in a lie supported by Trump supporters like jislenbe. Here is the entire true story. I hesitated to post it because I'm quite sure it won't be read by Trump supporters. However, others will benefit by the truth as we all do. It's lengthy but thorough and well worth reading.

    https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/bar-owner-biden-ad/
    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 5,019, Reputation: 157
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    #27

    Oct 26, 2020, 05:52 AM
    The question now is about whether or not YOU read your own link. I don't think you did. The lying in question did not concern why the ad was pulled. The lying concerned Malcoun suggesting in the ad that Trump was responsible for his bar having to close down. That was an outrageous lie that was soon made clear by a number of news outlets. It is also true, and your Snopes link agrees with this, that Malcoun is not some penniless, small business owner, but a wealthy man with plenty of financial resources to support his bar. He is also a significant Biden supporter which was not mentioned.

    The funniest part of the whole article was Malcoun's pathetic defense. In it he admits that the governor had put rules on bars limiting them to half the normal number of customers, that Malcoun himself had made decisions which hurt his business, and also demonstrated that Malcoun is unable to point to a single definite policy of the Trump administration that hurt his business. Instead he is reduced to pitiful pleas such as, "But instead he chose to weaponize COVID for his own political gain."

    And as to why the ad was pulled, Snopes leans on the argument that it just couldn't have been pulled because its lies had become public. Why, that couldn't have been the case because, after all, the Biden campaign said it was not the case. So the people who put together the lying ad are now to be believed as to why it was pulled? Sorry, but as we say around here, "That dog just won't hunt!"

    Try reading your own links, Athos.

    Also laughable is this idle speculation from Malcoun's response. "If Trump had taken this virus seriously from the beginning and imposed a national strategy to address it venues like the Pig would be open by now and you would be enjoying live music again." Does he mean a national strategy like European nations used, the same nations which are still knee-deep in the virus and are enduring record spikes in infections at this very moment??? He ends with this nonsensical lunacy, saying, "...and has convinced his supporters that the medicine is the illness." What??? The real reason his bar is closed is because Malcoun chose to close it. That is the absolute bottom line. It would have been a much more honest ad if Malcoun had simply said, "I HATE DONALD TRUMP."

    "Right now thousands of venue employees and musicians are out of work and millions of fans were robbed of live music experiences. That is the real tragedy. The Blind Pig isn’t closed because of our Governor’s rules. In fact we are technically ALLOWED to be open at reduced capacity right now. We are closed because it’s UNSAFE and irresponsible to be open. It’s also unsafe for artists to tour right now. Gov. Whitmer put rules in place to protect our communities against the spread of a virus. The rules are not our enemy … the virus is the enemy. If Trump had taken this virus seriously from the beginning and imposed a national strategy to address it venues like the Pig would be open by now and you would be enjoying live music again. But instead he chose to weaponize COVID for his own political gain and has convinced his supporters that the medicine is the illness."
    Athos's Avatar
    Athos Posts: 1,108, Reputation: 55
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    #28

    Oct 26, 2020, 06:15 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by jlisenbe View Post
    The lying in question did not concern why the ad was pulled. The lying concerned Malcoun suggesting in the ad that Trump was responsible for his bar having to close down. That was an outrageous lie that was soon made clear by a number of news outlets.
    The issue was your statement that the ad was a lie "from beginning to end". Your long comment in your own words proves you were lying about that. The number of news outlets clearing up the "outrageous lie" was no doubt Fox and some other far-right outlets.

    The remainder of your long diatribe was simply describing why you didn't like the ad. It's fine to not like the ad, but it is NOT fine to describe it as a lie from beginning to end.

    I made an exception to answer you in this case, because your lie was so egregious and so easily rebutted. I will now go back to ignoring you most of the time.
    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 5,019, Reputation: 157
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    #29

    Oct 26, 2020, 06:23 AM
    The issue was your statement that the ad was a lie "from beginning to end".
    So where did Snopes dispute that the ad contained lies?

    Your long comment in your own words proves you were lying about that.
    How?

    The number of news outlets clearing up the "outrageous lie" was no doubt Fox and some other far-right outlets.
    Yahoo News is now a far-right outlet?

    You're just mad because your own link to Snopes demonstrated that the ad contained lies. My comment was never primarily about WHY the ad was pulled, but rather was about the ad itself. The Snopes article did nothing to dispell that, but also provided no evidence to show that the Biden campaign did not pull it because its lies had been made public. They simply went off the statements of the Biden campaign. Why should anyone believe them? Doesn't that simply serve to demonstrate the biases of Snopes in believing Biden but not believing the news articles?

    But I'll tell you what. Go to Youtube and listen to the ad and then come back and tell us what you think.

    You ignore me because you have no answers as your reply above clearly demonstrates. But go ahead. Make my day. Ignore me. You don't seem to have the courage to stick with it anyway, or the grace to simply admit it when you are wrong.

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