[Wondergirl]

Guess not.

I found it, but will let Athos follow up.

What about the new grandchild?

[jlisenbe]

She is doing well. A little premature at 5.5 pounds, but healthy and greatly loved. Our daughter had a section so she is pretty sore.

[jlisenbe]

I found it. but will let Athos follow up.

I'm rather skeptical of that, but we'll see.

[talaniman]

Guess not.

Change your search terms or keywords because there are a ton of links to Athos's assertions going back years.

[jlisenbe]

Strange how the two of you are assuring me that there are "tons of links", but neither one of you can come up with one. Like I said...skeptical.

[talaniman]

Congrats on the birth of Gchild#1

For whatever reason your data input capacity is severely limited, I suspect that only you can fix it.

[jlisenbe]

Here's how it's supposed to be done. Look and learn. Notice that no one had to ask me for documentation or links.

https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/showth...86#post3859586

Thanks for the congrats. It's a special day, as I know you are more aware of than I am. Six?

[talaniman]

I have 7. Gson 1,2,3 are grown. 4 will be next year and Gdaughter 1 just turned 16, while 2, and 3 are 6 and 3! You think you're a nut, just wait...it gets nuttier.

[jlisenbe]

Oh Lord!

[talaniman]

Prayers may help but get used to peanut butter sandwiches! Gma's tend to ignore mates while Gbabies are around.

[jlisenbe]

I actually rather like PB sandwiches. 8D

[tomder55]

Plagiarizing .Biden says Trump has no plan. Then when asked what he would do he describes exactly what the Trump administration has already done.

[paraclete]

Plagiarizing .Biden says Trump has no plan. Then when asked what he would do he describes exactly what the Trump administration has already done.

So not his plan then, typical government, more of the same

[tomder55]

worth reading .

https://www.wsj.com/articles/epidemi...rd-11603477330

Most pertinently, the two men are the authors—with Sunetra Gupta, a professor of epidemiology at Oxford—of the Great Barrington Declaration. Published on Oct. 4, the declaration is a cri de coeur against lockdowns and other economic restrictions that have hobbled swaths of the world. It asked instead for “focused protection”—a policy of allowing “those at minimal risk of death” to resume their lives while societies concentrate on “better protecting those who are at highest risk.”

https://gbdeclaration.org/

[talaniman]

I'm not at all sure about herd immunity, like how many would die while we get there is my question, but if we had a rapid response protocol to identify and deal with spikes and outbreaks then we could be more selective in our shutdowns/quarantines/isolations in ways that wouldn't send a bunch of sick people to the local hospital all at once. As to who gets sick and who dies? Sure we can read the trends and data we have collected but that's no guarantee, nor can we predict the exceptions to the rules. A bit presumptive and assumptive at best given the early stages of learning about this virus and the longer term effects after recovery after infection and the time it takes for that recovery which we know can vary greatly.

I don't know where that balance is or sweet spot for response but doubt seriously if we are even there yet. Heck Tom, many don't even believe the virus exists or can be dangerous to some so here we are speculating about what works and what doesn't.

I do know though, there is a lot out here going on and I'll just keep looking out for me and mine and let everybody else do what they got to do. It's a crisis alright believe it or not, and no quick fixes, or great plans. Just trying not to be a statistic, and have regrets.

Stay safe everybody.

[Athos]

worth reading .

https://gbdeclaration.org/

I read this and there are glaring deficiencies in the plan.

The primary one is they omit any form of centralized control and planning. That's precisely the main problem today in the USA.

Other deficiencies include the reliance on "herd immunity" - a strategy that has been denounced by every credible epidemiologist in the country.

Also, they minimize youth getting the virus because, they say, it is not as deadly as the older people being infected. This is simply not as true as it was once thought to be, and they completely ignore the FACT that youth can still transmit the disease to others.

Best to stick with Faucci and company to weather the storm.

[jlisenbe]

The primary one is they omit any form of centralized control and planning. That's precisely the main problem today in the USA.

I'm not so sure of that. Not many places with more centralized control and planning than Europe, and nearly every nation there, including Italy, France, and Germany, are having record setting spikes.

New coronavirus infections hit record highs in at least nine European countries Thursday — as some nations announced tougher restrictions to stop the disease from spreading, according to reports.
The nine hard-hit nations — including Italy, France and Germany — saw the highest daily increase in cases since the pandemic began, according to CNN and other outlets.
“The general situation has become very serious,” Lothar Wieler, the president of Germany’s RKI public health institute said at a press conference in Berlin. “We have to expect that the virus will continue to spread rapidly."

”https://nypost.com/2020/10/22/multip...ovid-19-cases/

And that's not to mention New York state which is practically the model of centralized control and planning, and their cases are spiking as well.

https://www.bing.com/search?q=Coronavirus%20trend%20in%20New%20York&qs= ds&form=QBRE

I can't get that aggravating link to simply point to NY, but you can select that state and see their stats.

[Athos]

I'm not so sure of that. Not many places with more centralized control and planning than Europe, and nearly every nation there, including Italy, France, and Germany, are having record setting spikes.

There is no centralized control in the United States. There are 50 states all competing with one another (and sometimes with the federal government!) for PPE causing shortages where needed and driving up prices. There is no clear centralized direction on the simple matter of wearing a mask - known to be a major factor in reducing infection.

Trump himself has caused mass confusion leading astray millions of people with his luke-warm, and often contradictory, "guidance" as he constantly undermines his own scientific government agencies and refuses to provide a central planning function.

Trump fires or ignores qualified epidemiologists and replaces them with quacks like Scott Atlas who is a radiologist not an epidemiologist and hasn't practiced medicine in ten years but he kowtows to Trump and disastrously preaches herd immunity so he's the authority.

Spikes elsewhere do not obviate the need for centralization here. In fact, that should support the idea.

[jlisenbe]

There is no centralized control in the United States. There are 50 states all competing with one another (and sometimes with the federal government!) for PPE causing shortages where needed and driving up prices. There is no clear centralized direction on the simple matter of wearing a mask - known to be a major factor in reducing infection.

So we need to have some of that centralized control and planning that's working so well in Europe and New York? New York and California both have mandated masks and both are experiencing spikes. The same is true in many states including the one I live in. I don't think it's nearly as simple as you suggest. When centralized control/planning and wearing masks are plainly not working so well, then it's hard to get excited about it. At some point it becomes apparent that this is really all about bashing Trump.

Spikes elsewhere do not obviate the need for centralization here. In fact, that should support the idea.

So spikes where they have been employing centralization supports the idea of centralization? Well..OK, I guess.

[tomder55]

The primary one is they omit any form of centralized control and planning. That's precisely the main problem today in the USA.

NY needs are not the same as the states in the Midwest etc. The only logical response is regional ones . Everyone keeps denying the reality of herd immunity . It can come 2 ways .Enough people get infected through exposure ;or a vaccine . These are not fringe epidemiologists . Listen to the scientists !!! .