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Athos · Oct 30, 2019, 02:58 AM

Insulting a soldier who earned medals and was wounded in the line of duty wearing the uniform of his country's Armed Forces, Trump sank to new lows.

Making matters worse, this brave soldier's testimony showed that Trump's so-called "transcript" of the notorious phone call to the Ukraine president was not a transcript at all. It was a summary with critical portions left out. Those deleted portions included references to VP Biden and to the Burisma company.

All in one day, 'bone spur" Trump delivers his typical nastiness to a gallant warrior and manages to doctor the phone call.

talaniman · Oct 30, 2019, 04:53 AM

I never beleive anything the dufus or his sycophants say without verification and to be honest, it always comes back they LIE! This is the guy who started off calling the then president illegitimate and Mexicans rapists. Forget his history with the legal system, or business practices, since he has been on the national stage as a candidate and in the WH, it's always blasting his opponents and mocking them with demeaning labels in the worst terms possible. His base loves him for it, but it was a pleasant surprise when not just dems, but many repubs came out in defense of Lt. Col. Vindman as a patriot and VERY credible American.

Just his story is an incredible one as have been the backgrounds for all the witnesses so far. I think it's telling the dufus's and his sycophants smear campaigns are starting to get pushback now after the years of hearing them.

Vacuum7 · Oct 30, 2019, 05:40 AM

FORGET TRUMP: Instead of Trump, put the name of any POTUS in the blank: This Lt. Col. Vinman should immediately be thrown out of the military, with the speed of light! A Lt. Colonel running off to Congress to get his 15 minutes of fame by defaming HIS COMMANDER AND CHIEF should earn him immediate dismissal from the U.S. Military....complete breaking of protocol.....this has been verbalized by all the active military and retire vets I know: They consider him lower than pond scum.

Don't go throwing his Purple Heart out there either: ONE OF THE GREATEST SOLDIERS IN HISTORY WAS A TRAITOR! Benedict Arnold was the most courageous U.S. soldier you would ever imagine....he was the most instrumental General of the Revolutionary War, a brilliant tactician....he gave his own monetary fortunes....he gave his own leg for the U.S.....and, Benedict Arnold WAS A TRAITOR!

You are just spewing off what CNN has said: You don't KNOW WHAT THE TRANSCRIPT SAID! Its very possible that anything left off the transcript was "SECRET" or, simply, filler/unimportant material. CNN doesn't know everything.

talaniman · Oct 30, 2019, 07:30 AM

WOW Vac! The was your looniest rant ever! The craziest I've ever heard. What's up with that? Or maybe the question is what's in your coffee this morning?

Vacuum7 · Oct 30, 2019, 08:11 AM

I reiterated what the guys in the military have express to me, personally: They think this Vinman is garbage for doing what he did.

talaniman · Oct 30, 2019, 08:40 AM

Originally Posted by Vacuum7

I reiterated what the guys in the military have express to me, personally: They think this Vinman is garbage for doing what he did.

He answered a subpoena and testified truthfully? Like they would if they were called to do so. Or maybe your military guys went to the same education as you did and are still sons of the south. Or you loony fringers have had too much dufus Kool Aid.

Let me guess Faux News is the only channel you guys get.

Vacuum7 · Oct 30, 2019, 09:55 AM

Talaniman: Now, now: I was born in the South, a Southern by birth: YOU, TALANIMAN, ARE A SOUTHERNER BY CHOICE!:)

No, what the military guys I know are saying is that Vinman was mouthing off what should have been considered "Confidential" information and that he didn't follow protocol.

I don't like Trump Cool-Aid, won't drink it, either.

I also don't like FOX, either: FOX is not that good and they are extremely biased, but 180 degrees out of phase with the bias of CNN and MSNBC or the Big Three. I actually watch RT World News International and One America News Network, OAN, if I watch any TV at all, which is rare and only on weekends. RT & OAN are very down the middle, straight shooting, unbiased reporters and the RT field reporting is the best I have ever seen, particularly their overseas correspondents. OAN is decidedly a reporting network, with no lean or bias that I can tell.

Wondergirl · Oct 30, 2019, 10:30 AM

Originally Posted by Vacuum7

I don't like Trump Cool-Aid, won't drink it, either.

I also don't like FOX, either: FOX is not that good and they are extremely biased, but 180 degrees out of phase with the bias of CNN and MSNBC or the Big Three. I actually watch RT World News International and One America News Network, OAN, if I watch any TV at all, which is rare and only on weekends. RT & OAN are very down the middle, straight shooting, unbiased reporters and the RT field reporting is the best I have ever seen, particularly their overseas correspondents. OAN is decidedly a reporting network, with no lean or bias that I can tell.

*cough cough*

OAN:
"One America News is a lesser-known news outlet that has seemingly won President Donald Trump's stamp of approval. The six-year-old network is something of a surprise competitor for Trump's long-touted favorite and massive conservative mainstay, Fox News."
https://www.businessinsider.com/one-...etwork-2019-10

Vacuum7 · Oct 30, 2019, 10:48 AM

W.G.: I don't know about what you have here.....OAN is loaded with very young people who, generally, are more liberal minded. RT is a more seasoned group of people.

talaniman · Oct 30, 2019, 11:10 AM

This RT TV?

Vacuum7 · Oct 30, 2019, 11:27 AM

Talaniman: Yes, seems to be pretty good "just the facts, Ma'am type Reporting! Real Joe Friday throw back stuff. Do you watch it?

talaniman · Oct 30, 2019, 11:55 AM

Stopped a few years ago, but BBC world news and CSpan are my regulars when I'm not munching popcorn and watching sports or catching up from years of no TV. Between chores of course. I have to take issue though with your characterization of Vindman and his testimony. You southerners do know that the congress has the same power and authority as the exec. branch don't you? So what protocols were broken?

Wondergirl · Oct 30, 2019, 11:58 AM

Originally Posted by Vacuum7

Talaniman: Yes, seems to be pretty good "just the facts, Ma'am type Reporting! Real Joe Friday throw back stuff. Do you watch it?

Why would I want to watch this?

"RT International, based in Moscow, presents around-the-clock news bulletins, documentaries, talk shows, debates, sports news, and cultural programmes that it says provide 'a Russian viewpoint on major global events.'"

Vacuum7 · Oct 30, 2019, 12:41 PM

Talaniman: Lt. Col. Vinman did not adhere to "chain of command": He had no business running his mouth off, particularly on a matter pertaining to HIS COMMANDER IN CHIEF.

W.G.: RT News as a "Russian viewpoint"? I have never seen that from them: I have only seen non-aligned, hard-nosed reporting out of RT America...….RT News has Ed Schultz, who used to have "The Ed Show" on MSNBC, has "News With Ed Schultz" on RT now....I didn't like Ed when he was on MSNBC but he sure has turned over a new leaf since coming to RT! Schultz used to be very liberal/left on MSNBC and now he is a non-aligned but still a very hard-nosed reporter.

Athos · Oct 30, 2019, 02:12 PM

Geez, V7, I go to do some business and you run amok with even more of your nuttiness. There's no excuse for your nuttiness since you have easy access to the largest library on the planet - the internet. Start checking things before you run off at the mouth.

Starting from the most recent:

Originally Posted by Vacuum7

Talaniman: Lt. Col. Vinman did not adhere to "chain of command": He had no business running his mouth off, particularly on a matter pertaining to HIS COMMANDER IN CHIEF.

Vinman DID adhere to the chain of command! Twice! Both times nothing was done. It's all in his statement. Did you read it? (Rhetorical).As Tal said, he was called by Congress to testify. Did you expect him to lie?

Not for a bleeding second, do I believe you ran this by all your vet buddies. I think you made that up.

W.G.: RT News as a "Russian viewpoint"? I have never seen that from them: I have only seen non-aligned, hard-nosed reporting out of RT America...….RT News has Ed Schultz, who used to have "The Ed Show" on MSNBC, has "News With Ed Schultz" on RT now....I didn't like Ed when he was on MSNBC but he sure has turned over a new leaf since coming to RT! Schultz used to be very liberal/left on MSNBC and now he is a non-aligned but still a very hard-nosed reporter.

RT (RUSSIA TODAY) is a propaganda arm of the Kremlin. A tiny bit of research would have revealed that. Trump has promoted OAN as FOX became slightly less approving of Trump. So OAN is another state website.

As far as Ed Schultz - makes no difference that he has a show there. That's part of drawing in people like you, which, in your case, it worked. Propaganda can be, and is, subtle.

You stated you liked this site because of its intelligent people. It's time for you to display some of that intelligence you revere so much.

talaniman · Oct 30, 2019, 02:15 PM

It's been reported that he went to his immediate superior with his misgivings, and it went no further until he was subpoenad by the congress so if you have info I do not be glad to hear it.

I could not copy and paste but refer you specifically to page 2 under introduction. He outlines his reporting through the chain of command and discussing only with relevant colleagues with the proper clearance.

Shultz was a big favorite of mine.

Vacuum7 · Oct 30, 2019, 03:23 PM

Athos: I don't lie, may be a lot of thing but a liar I am not: One active duty soldier, a guy in the Reserves, and two vets all voluntarily espoused their disdain for Vinman's action.....their contention is that he had NO BUSINESS in the affairs of the Commander In Chief and, if you say he went to his immediate superior and nothing came out of it, he should have stopped and gone no further. His loyalties are fouled: He should be LOYAL to his Commander In Chief......it doesn't matter if the CIC is Trump, Obama, or Bush. Vinman will now, forever, be blackballed within the military, no one will trust him, that's what the military guys I know have said: he made himself a pariah by grandstanding.

Admittedly, I did not read Vinman's statement....I should have but haven't yet.

No, once called before Congress, VINMAN SHOULD NOT LIE, that's different....the sanctity of Congress and the process must be preserved at all costs......I don't support lying by anyone for any reason, short of saving one's life. I do think that maybe he didn't/doesn't know everything that was going on behind the scenes and he should have refrained from going to his superiors until he vetted the entire context of what was going on....he could have been premature with divulging this information.

I thought Ed Shultz gave RT a sense of being legitimate: I thought Ed had decent credentials given his tenure at MSNBC.....How/Why would Ed be working as a mouthpiece for Russian propaganda? He was a certified (not derogatory) liberal on MSNBC.....I don't think he would be a sellout.

Wondergirl · Oct 30, 2019, 03:56 PM

July 5, 2018
Ed Schultz, a fiercely liberal television and radio host, died Thursday in Washington, D.C., at 64.
The former MSNBC host's death was confirmed by his current employer, the Russian-backed media organization RT America.

talaniman · Oct 30, 2019, 03:57 PM

That's why I gave you the link to read as any military guy takes an oath to his country, not his president and by your own words and his testimony he honored that and you or anybody else never heard a peep until he was subpoenaed. That makes the dufus and his sycophants the more despicable and the notion a soldier knows the CIC is lying and committing a wrong act and he should not question that is dishonorable. That's exactly what his statement lays out so read it and get back with me.

On ES though he said publicly he didn't care what the platform was he would still do what he needed to do. He was a repub but switched and was a great personality until he died.

You still should be cautious of those Ruskies though.

Athos · Oct 30, 2019, 11:42 PM

Originally Posted by Vacuum7

..their contention is that he had NO BUSINESS in the affairs of the Commander In Chief

Of course he did! That was his military assignment. He performed his duties as ordered. Sorry, but your friends are nuts!

if you say he went to his immediate superior and nothing came out of it, he should have stopped and gone no further.

I can tell you were never in the military. Every member of the Armed Forces has a positive responsibility to refuse to follow and to expose an illegal order. In this particular case, he DID stop from going up the ladder. He was ORDERED by Congress to testify. Can't you get that through your head?

Vinman will now, forever, be blackballed within the military, no one will trust him, that's what the military guys I know have said

The "military guys you know" are idiots.

he made himself a pariah by grandstanding.

You think testifying before Congress is grandstanding? Really?

Admittedly, I did not read Vinman's statement..

That was pretty important before shooting off your mouth, wasn't it?

I do think that maybe he didn't/doesn't know everything that was going on behind the scenes and he should have refrained from going to his superiors until he vetted the entire context of what was going on.

If you've read his statement by now, you know why he couldn't "vet the entire context" of what was going on. The falsity of what Trump did was staring him right in the face. NOT reporting it would have been a crime against the oath he took to defend the Constitution and the nation.

How/Why would Ed be working as a mouthpiece for Russian propaganda?

He was not a mouthpiece for Russian propaganda. He was there to give a semblance of objectivity. I'm sure Ed knew that - he wasn't stupid - but he had his reasons, and he had a platform. Propaganda is never obvious.