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    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 37,813, Reputation: 5427
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    #241

    Jun 2, 2019, 03:35 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by waltero View Post
    How so? A person has to die to self first.

    You already have your Truth/myths.

    'You' are a good person, 'you' are helping people, 'you' have a loving understanding of things...it's all "you."

    It has nothing to do with what 'you' or I believe or understand. I no longer exists, it's Christ Jesus in me...
    I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about.
    waltero's Avatar
    waltero Posts: 68, Reputation: 5
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    #242

    Jun 2, 2019, 03:59 PM
    I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about.
    No worries, your not alone.

    What I am saying; For those who are in Christ Jesus, this life and this world no longer has anything to do with self...what I think, what I do, what I feel, Where I go, who I help Etc. It's no longer about you or what you want, it's all about the Word of life/truth. Everything else is going to pass away.



    Galatians 2:20 I have been crucified with Christ. It is no longer I who live, but Christ who lives in me.
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,704, Reputation: 171
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    #243

    Jun 2, 2019, 04:17 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by waltero View Post
    No worries, your not alone.

    What I am saying; For those who are in Christ Jesus, this life and this world no longer has anything to do with self...what I think, what I do, what I feel, Where I go, who I help Etc. It's no longer about you or what you want, it's all about the Word of life/truth. Everything else is going too pass away.
    Let us be practical for a moment, if you spend your life waiting for everything to pass away you will get nothing done, so bless those around you and don't spout scripture. Jesus came into this world to do some specific things, this he accomplished, in his own words, "it is finished". So the message is; believe in Jesus. You have to put Paul in the context of his pharisaic training, he had a very legal view which was basically sin is sin, thus when he speaks of homsexuality it is in the context of many sins. The lesson of Jesus is go and sin no more
    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 3,263, Reputation: 154
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    #244

    Jun 2, 2019, 04:36 PM
    As I said, there are no verses about homosexuality being a sin. Jesus never mentioned it either. And why else would Paul have suffered and endured so many beatings and abuse? Because he had a skin disease???? Give me a break!
    Romans 1:26 ff
    Jude 1:7
    1 Tim. 1:10
    1 Cor. 7:2
    1 Cor. 6:9
    Lev. 20:13


    Enough? And add to that there is not a single verse to lead us to believe that same gender sex is approved of God. To suggest that Paul was homosexual is simply ludicrous. You might as well say he was a communist. There is not a shred of Bible evidence to show that. He was persecuted for the preaching of the Gospel. Any effort at all, even a minimal effort, at reading the Book of Acts will show that.
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 37,813, Reputation: 5427
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    #245

    Jun 2, 2019, 05:30 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by waltero View Post
    No worries, your not alone.

    What I am saying; For those who are in Christ Jesus, this life and this world no longer has anything to do with self...what I think, what I do, what I feel, Where I go, who I help Etc. It's no longer about you or what you want, it's all about the Word of life/truth. Everything else is going to pass away.

    Galatians 2:20 I have been crucified with Christ. It is no longer I who live, but Christ who lives in me.
    Okay. What is this in reference to?

    Quote Originally Posted by jlisenbe View Post
    Romans 1:26 ff
    Jude 1:7
    1 Tim. 1:10
    1 Cor. 7:2
    1 Cor. 6:9
    Lev. 20:13

    Enough? And add to that there is not a single verse to lead us to believe that same gender sex is approved of God. To suggest that Paul was homosexual is simply ludicrous. You might as well say he was a communist. There is not a shred of Bible evidence to show that. He was persecuted for the preaching of the Gospel. Any effort at all, even a minimal effort, at reading the Book of Acts will show that.
    Apparently, you don't know what was going on in the Roman world back then.
    waltero's Avatar
    waltero Posts: 68, Reputation: 5
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    #246

    Jun 2, 2019, 06:02 PM
    if you spend your life waiting for everything to pass away you will get nothing done
    My point exacly.

    it is finished
    What is it 'you' are wanting to get done (it is finished)?


    What is this in reference to?
    Galatians 2:20 It is no longer I who live...
    Don't rely on your own understanding.
    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 3,263, Reputation: 154
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    #247

    Jun 2, 2019, 06:20 PM
    Apparently, you don't know what was going on in the Roman world back then.
    You asked for scriptures. I gave you scriptures and this is the best reply you can come up with? Don't you know that it makes no difference what corruption was in place in Rome? The Christian faith does not adapt to this world, it changes it. It sure seems that modern, liberal doctrine has taken the place of the Bible in your life.

    As it says in one of my favorite scriptures,

    Seek the Lord while He may be found,
    Call upon Him while He is near.
    7 Let the wicked forsake his way,
    And the unrighteous man his thoughts;
    Let him return to the Lord,
    And He will have mercy on him;
    And to our God,
    For He will abundantly pardon.

    8 “For My thoughts are not your thoughts,
    Nor are your ways My ways,” says the Lord.
    9 “For as the heavens are higher than the earth,
    So are My ways higher than your ways,
    And My thoughts than your thoughts.
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 37,813, Reputation: 5427
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    #248

    Jun 2, 2019, 07:39 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by jlisenbe View Post
    You asked for scriptures. I gave you scriptures and this is the best reply you can come up with?
    Those verses are mistranslated or definitely misinterpreted in their respective Biblical, cultural, and historical contexts. The authors were warning Christians not to get caught up in Roman pagan worship practices.
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,704, Reputation: 171
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    #249

    Jun 2, 2019, 07:46 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Wondergirl View Post
    Those verses are mistranslated or definitely misinterpreted in their respective Biblical, cultural, and historical contexts. The authors were warning Christians not to get caught up in Roman pagan worship practices.
    Indeed and homosexuality and adultery were prime parts of those practices, but in the broader context such things are not acceptable in everyday life
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 37,813, Reputation: 5427
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    #250

    Jun 2, 2019, 08:49 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by paraclete View Post
    Indeed and homosexuality and adultery were prime parts of those practices, but in the broader context such things are not acceptable in everyday life
    Who says?
    waltero's Avatar
    waltero Posts: 68, Reputation: 5
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    #251

    Jun 2, 2019, 08:53 PM
    Those verses are mistranslated or definitely misinterpreted
    Only to those who've been given over to a reprobate mind.
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 37,813, Reputation: 5427
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    #252

    Jun 2, 2019, 08:56 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by waltero View Post
    Only to those who've been given over to a reprobate mind.
    Or to those who've never studied history.
    waltero's Avatar
    waltero Posts: 68, Reputation: 5
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    #253

    Jun 2, 2019, 09:33 PM
    I think we need to reject what the world is trying to tell us about which faction/football team we're on and, like God does, address it on an individual basis. There's a lot of judging around this topic based on the extreme activities of the exceptionally disturbed on one side or the other.
    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 3,263, Reputation: 154
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    #254

    Jun 2, 2019, 10:24 PM
    Those verses are mistranslated or definitely misinterpreted in their respective Biblical, cultural, and historical contexts. The authors were warning Christians not to get caught up in Roman pagan worship practices.
    The bottom line is this. You just don't want to accept the plain and clear text of the Bible. You are so influenced by liberal thought that you have elevated that above the Bible. Those scriptures were very plain, and there is nothing anywhere to indicate that God would approve of homosexual practices. We don't need to disparage people who are struggling with those problems. Yes, we need to love them and certainly not think we are better than they are, but I don't want anyone have to stand before the judgement seat of God one day and say, "JL told me this was OK." You will also someday stand accountable before God for the counsel you give people. Thin excuses won't work on that day.
    Athos's Avatar
    Athos Posts: 491, Reputation: 53
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    #255

    Jun 3, 2019, 05:40 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by jlisenbe View Post
    You are so influenced by liberal thought that you have elevated that above the Bible.
    You are so influenced by the Bible (Biblolatry) that you have elevated it above God. Remember the First Commandment.

    Those scriptures were very plain, and there is nothing anywhere to indicate that God would approve of homosexual practices.
    By your reasoning, God didn't approve of heterosexual practices either since He had his Son born without heterosexual intercourse.

    Yes, we need to love them and certainly not think we are better than they are
    You don't think you are better yet you would tell them the lifestyle they have chosen, no matter how good and decent it may be, will lead them to eternal punishment because they didn't believe the way you do. Wow, some love!

    but I don't want anyone have to stand before the judgement seat of God one day and say, "JL told me this was OK."
    The person you are truly concerned with - yourself - is noted.

    You will also someday stand accountable before God for the counsel you give people. Thin excuses won't work on that day.
    Whenever your arguments fail, you revert to ad hominems. You threaten WG by having God not accept her thin excuses. What does God do when confronted with the thin excuses?
    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 3,263, Reputation: 154
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    #256

    Jun 3, 2019, 05:50 AM
    By your reasoning, God didn't approve of heterosexual practices either since He had his Son born without heterosexual intercourse.
    Actually, that's your reasoning. I've never said anything that foolish.

    You are so influenced by the Bible (Biblolatry) that you have elevated it above God. Remember the First Commandment.
    That one made me laugh. I'm not sure how you go about elevating God's Word above God. Then, to try and make your curious point, you make reference to a text from...the Bible! So you're basically saying, "Don't be so influenced by the Bible, and to prove my point, I'll make a reference to the Bible."

    You don't think you are better yet you would tell them the lifestyle they have chosen, no matter how good and decent it may be, will lead them to eternal punishment because they didn't believe the way you do. Wow, some love!
    I would tell them??? Oh no. It is not me telling them, it is God's word telling them. And if you don't accept it as God's word, then why did you make reference to it (the first commandment) as though it is?

    It's hard to read your comments since they are so soaked in anger. The reference to standing accountable before God as an ad hominem argument is ridiculous. That we will stand before God and give account is throughout the Bible. "For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may be recompensed for his deeds in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad."

    Am I better than they? Absolutely not. As James said, "We all stumble in many ways." So I think it is best to stick with what the Lord spoke through Isaiah, "Let the wicked forsake his way, And the unrighteous man his thoughts; Let him return to the Lord, And He will have mercy on him."
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,704, Reputation: 171
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    #257

    Jun 3, 2019, 05:55 AM
    I hear the idiot is at work in the UK this week, bringing dissention and very poor diplomacy
    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 3,263, Reputation: 154
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    #258

    Jun 3, 2019, 06:06 AM
    Scott Morrison is in the UK??? {<;
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,009, Reputation: 10852
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    #259

    Jun 3, 2019, 06:22 AM
    Sorry if I am skeptical about Gods word through any really old guy I don't/didn't know. Or even your version of it. I'm sure you and them had/have good intentions, but is it alright with you if I ask the God that I understand and have a personal relationship with to guide my path?

    Thanks for your understanding in the matter. Not that I need permission mind you, but I do not give YOU, or ancient man the right to stand between ME, and my God, given my doubts you will be there when I go in judgement before him.
    jlisenbe's Avatar
    jlisenbe Posts: 3,263, Reputation: 154
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    #260

    Jun 3, 2019, 06:30 AM
    but is it alright with you if I ask the God that I understand and have a personal relationship with to guide my path?
    Fine by me. Everyone is entitled to his/her own ideas, but not to his/her own truth. It is the truth that is important.

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