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    tiredofdrama's Avatar
    tiredofdrama Posts: 6, Reputation: 1
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    #1

    Sep 5, 2015, 03:34 PM
    Ex allowed to add to school check out list even though he is non custodial
    So my ex has joint legal and I have sole physical - papers allow him two weekends from fri at 5 until he drops them off at school on Monday morning. He has attempted to check them out for various reasons but isn't allowed due to the court papers. He has a friend in the school office who has allowed him to add his parents onto the school check out list. As the custodial parent who legally has physical custody - can this be allowed? I find it odd that he can't check them out per the court papers, but the "friend" allowed him to add his parents which basically allows him the opportunity to take them. I just found this out, and I will be at the school the first of the week.
    teacherjenn4's Avatar
    teacherjenn4 Posts: 4,005, Reputation: 468
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    #2

    Sep 5, 2015, 08:30 PM
    I'm not sure where you are located, but if you are in the U.S. I'd take a set of court papers into the school office on Tuesday. Ask to speak with the Principal and review the list with him/her while you are there. Point out that the grandparents have no right to pick up your child. Also, ask that any changes to the list will be made by you only, and in person.
    tiredofdrama's Avatar
    tiredofdrama Posts: 6, Reputation: 1
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    #3

    Sep 5, 2015, 09:09 PM
    I assume you are a teacher. Have you encountered this before?
    teacherjenn4's Avatar
    teacherjenn4 Posts: 4,005, Reputation: 468
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    #4

    Sep 5, 2015, 10:31 PM
    Yes and yes. It's very common. Every teacher should review student records to know what's going on. I have one court order this year. The office staff has a notebook or a computer list they should refer to as each student is picked up. Make it easy by bringing a copy of the court order just in case. They can even call you if someone is trying to pick up your child. A "friend" in the office cannot ignore the court order. Definitely see the principal. Don't blame the "friend." Ask to review the pickup list and point out the error. I've learned over the years that being nice to the office staff makes everything easier.
    Fr_Chuck's Avatar
    Fr_Chuck Posts: 81,301, Reputation: 7692
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    #5

    Sep 6, 2015, 12:23 AM
    Does your court papers say that the ex is not allowed to pick them up from school. If he has joint "legal" custody, I find it strange he also would not have legal rights to add his name to pick up the child.

    Physical custody merely means who the child lives with, and the child lives primary with you. That does not affect legal custody.
    joypulv's Avatar
    joypulv Posts: 21,591, Reputation: 2941
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    #6

    Sep 6, 2015, 04:36 AM
    Since he isn't allowed to have them until 5 pm, and the child will be long gone by then, it sounds like this is merely a logistical problem, rather than an attempt to create a power struggle.
    Is the TIME he is picked up something you two can discuss and negotiate? Is he trying to avoid going to your house? Is 5 pm rush hour? Is it a tough time or some other reason?
    cdad's Avatar
    cdad Posts: 12,700, Reputation: 1438
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    #7

    Sep 6, 2015, 06:19 AM
    What do you mean by "he has attempted to check them out for various reasons" ?

    Also since he has physical custody also as well as legal custody he does have a say as who can pick the child up. Are you trying to keep him off the list entirely ?
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    tiredofdrama Posts: 6, Reputation: 1
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    #8

    Sep 6, 2015, 07:00 AM
    Yes- he gets visitation but it doesn't start until 5. There's no traffic issues and we meet at a designated location.He sent the children to school without their supplies, and they called for them. Instead of bringing supplies- he said they were sick and wanted to leave With them. He has a habit of trying to violate the court orders to make life Difficult. Not returning them, past due support, multiple contempt Issues- I don't understand if I have custody- howCan you feel safe when you drop them at school that he won't Swoop in and take them without me knowing? I wouldJust show up at 3:15 to realize they are gone? Even though I have a courtOrder saying they are in my physical custody?
    Fr_Chuck's Avatar
    Fr_Chuck Posts: 81,301, Reputation: 7692
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    #9

    Sep 6, 2015, 07:23 AM
    Unless your court order, says (he can not pick them up) with joint legal custody he should have the same rights as you, in almost any legal issue of the child.

    The physical custody, is merely where the child will live. Does the paper work give you a primary legal rights or makes your legal rights higher than his?

    If he violates the custody agreement, taking the children, then you take him back to court to modify the agreement to restrict his actions.
    joypulv's Avatar
    joypulv Posts: 21,591, Reputation: 2941
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    #10

    Sep 6, 2015, 07:43 AM
    The gist of my question was about his reasons for 3 pm Fri at school instead of 5 pm.
    Sure, you can stop him or his parents, but why, exactly?

    I'm presuming that he works and you don't? If he works, it's possible that a 5 pm meeting at a special location isn't always possible for someone after work. Is there something objectionable to his parents?

    No matter how awful an ex is, the interest of the children is first, and if this is easier for everyone, why not? Is there a lot of bickering at the 5:00 meeting?

    I'm worried that you aren't seeing this from a purely sensible and logistical viewpoint.
    teacherjenn4's Avatar
    teacherjenn4 Posts: 4,005, Reputation: 468
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    #11

    Sep 6, 2015, 08:02 AM
    A school will not release a child with a court order that states a 5 p.m. pickup at 3:15. If the parent complains, local law enforcement will be called and they will determine whether the custody time is clearly listed. It sounds like it is. So, the child will not be given to the father. The issue is that the grandparents have been added to the pickup list. If the father cannot have custody until 5 p.m. then he cannot add his parents to the list for a 3:15 pickup so he can have the kids. The school will err on the side of caution in all disputes. I've seen this hundreds of times. To avoid getting local law enforcement involved, have an addendum with specific additional language for school times.
    cdad's Avatar
    cdad Posts: 12,700, Reputation: 1438
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    #12

    Sep 6, 2015, 08:41 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by teacherjenn4 View Post
    A school will not release a child with a court order that states a 5 p.m. pickup at 3:15. If the parent complains, local law enforcement will be called and they will determine whether the custody time is clearly listed. It sounds like it is. So, the child will not be given to the father. The issue is that the grandparents have been added to the pickup list. If the father cannot have custody until 5 p.m. then he cannot add his parents to the list for a 3:15 pickup so he can have the kids. The school will err on the side of caution in all disputes. I've seen this hundreds of times. To avoid getting local law enforcement involved, have an addendum with specific additional language for school times.

    Correct me if Im wrong but also isnt the list used for emergency situations ? They cant just arbitrarily decide on who can be on the list independent of the parents that have legal custody. After all isnt the primary welfare of the child the first consideration ?
    tiredofdrama's Avatar
    tiredofdrama Posts: 6, Reputation: 1
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    #13

    Sep 6, 2015, 09:21 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by cdad View Post
    Correct me if Im wrong but also isnt the list used for emergency situations ? They cant just arbitrarily decide on who can be on the list independent of the parents that have legal custody. After all isnt the primary welfare of the child the first consideration ?
    There is a separate list for emergency contacts.
    teacherjenn4's Avatar
    teacherjenn4 Posts: 4,005, Reputation: 468
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    #14

    Sep 6, 2015, 01:12 PM
    In a school situation, the custody order takes precedence. Since the OP has custody during school hours, the list of pickup people would come from her. Emergency situations like medical care authorization is a separate situation. In a school setting, we look at custody time and who has physical custody. We aren't lawyers. We'll call the police or sheriff to interpret the custody agreement in a dispute. So, as I have said, if mom has custody until 5p.m. then she would be the only one to pick up the child, or someone she has authorized.
    Synnen's Avatar
    Synnen Posts: 7,927, Reputation: 2443
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    #15

    Sep 8, 2015, 07:15 AM
    Joy--this isn't about when the father actually has visitation.

    This is about the father trying to take the kids OUTSIDE of his visitation time--like the middle of the day on a Wednesday. Absolutely he should not be able to do this.
    tiredofdrama's Avatar
    tiredofdrama Posts: 6, Reputation: 1
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    #16

    Sep 8, 2015, 09:39 AM
    It has been resolved. The school is going to uphold the court order. He isn't allowed to pick her up or add to the list without my permission.
    ScottGem's Avatar
    ScottGem Posts: 64,966, Reputation: 6056
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    #17

    Sep 8, 2015, 11:19 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by tiredofdrama View Post
    It has been resolved. The school is going to uphold the court order. He isn't allowed to pick her up or add to the list without my permission.
    You make it sound like they had a choice. They cannot violate a court order at least as long as they know about it. I'm curious however, was anything said about why someone added the grandparents?
    tiredofdrama's Avatar
    tiredofdrama Posts: 6, Reputation: 1
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    #18

    Sep 8, 2015, 11:31 AM
    He added the grandparents hoping they could get the kids for him. I will add they aren't on the list because of the grandmother's suicidal tendencies. I don't have a problem with them having contact. This never really should have been an issue-- it's just his 'friend' at the school trying to give him what he wants with no regard for a court order.
    AK lawyer's Avatar
    AK lawyer Posts: 12,592, Reputation: 977
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    #19

    Sep 8, 2015, 12:08 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by ScottGem View Post
    You make it sound like they had a choice. They cannot violate a court order at least as long as they know about it....
    Not exactly correct (Strictly speaking, unless the school is a party to the case, it is not bound by orders entered in the case), but no matter: the situation has been resolved.
    teacherjenn4's Avatar
    teacherjenn4 Posts: 4,005, Reputation: 468
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    #20

    Sep 8, 2015, 06:50 PM
    As I said, the school must follow a court order. If there is a problem, local law enforcement is called to decide the outcome. The school should not add anything to a pickup list provided by custodial parent, unless authorized by them.

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