[tomder55]

begone troll !

[NeedKarma]

Just because someone has an opinion that disagrees with yours doesn't mean they are a troll. It says more about you than about me.

[paraclete]

Which troll do you get your information from? Tom ?

Yup ,an Iranian nuke in the most volitile region of the world .

This isn't the way I read it, the pundits say this delays an Iranian nuke 15 years

Yup the end of any non-proliferation efforts worldwide .

Far as I know that wasn't discussed but maybe a modification of the treaty to allow peaceful use is needed.

Yup ,a nuclear arms race in the Middle East

This is a fabrication of GWB that you have been pursuing for 15 years


.

Yup ,the end of any US influence in one of the most important regions of the world .

You mean we will see the end of premptive strikes and drone attacks?

Yup ,throwing our most reliable ally in the region under the bus

No one was thrown under a bus because he didn't get what he wanted

and aligning ourselves with a Persian empire that we help create

Well if you helped to create it you have a responsibility to bring it in from the cold

..

The emperor is a schmuck !

On this we can agree but that's a jewish phrase and he is black so a mixed metaphor there, so I think the term in the 'hood is fool!

[talaniman]

According to Netty, they were months away from a bomb anyway, thanks to more than a decade of inaction, while we were distracted by Bush/Cheney chasing Saddam's mushroom cloud. Now the right and Netty holler about the "bad" plan while they have NO PLAN!

GEEZ, even your hero Vlad agrees with the plan even though he can't sell Iran ICBM missiles.

[tomder55]

This isn't the way I read it, the pundits say this delays an Iranian nuke 15 years

that's if you believe the Iranians will honor the terms . They will not and there is no history to suggest they will.

Far as I know that wasn't discussed but maybe a modification of the treaty to allow peaceful use is needed.....This is a fabrication of GWB that you have been pursuing for 15 years

Do you need Captain Obvious to explain it ? The last country that joined the nuke club did it with impunity . This time we are actually rewarding them for their efforts. How are you going to keep the Saudi's ,the Egyptians ,the Turks, the Emirate States from joining the club now ?

No one was thrown under a bus because he didn't get what he wanted

Yes Israel definitely was . They live under the threat of destruction by this regime ,and now we are allowing them to develop the means to fulfill their boast .

Well if you helped to create it you have a responsibility to bring it in from the cold

Oh yeah ,you and the utopian idiot running our country think they can be peacefully reigned in ,or that they will be a responsible hegemon once they dominate the region. Meanwhile their proxies wage war all over the region and have done so since 1979.

[NeedKarma]

the utopian idiot running our country

has kept you safe from any terrorist attacks on your soil from the "towel heads"... unlike your previous president.

[talaniman]

the utopian idiot running our country

Saved your 401k, made a few rich guys richer, brought back cuban Cigars, and stopped two wars, while you guys hollered, screamed, and called names, so not bad for a bumbling idiot.

[tomder55]

Just keep in mind the letter to the Mullahs by the 47 Republican Senators. This is NOT a treaty . It is an executive agreement that can be terminated as early as January 2017 once a Republican President and Congress ends this folly .

Saved your 401k

Nah , I bought the dip as one should always do when there is a market decline.

brought back cuban Cigars,

Who cares ? There are better cigars being made now by other Latin American nations

stopped two wars

should read retreating from 2 wars .Both wars are still being waged ,and being waged by Americans .

[paraclete]

that's if you believe the Iranians will honor the terms . They will not and there is no history to suggest they will.
Do you need Captain Obvious to explain it ?

No but undoubtedly you do. How long do you think it takes to develop a bomb? You did it in a few years and the information has been in the public demain for fifty years.

The last country that joined the nuke club did it with impunity . This time we are actually rewarding them for their efforts.

You are not rewarding their efforts, you are removing sanctions that has forced them to develop industries so they don't need your industrial military complex.

How are you going to keep the Saudi's ,the Egyptians ,the Turks, the Emirate States from joining the club now ?

Not my job you are the self appointed policeman of the world, so either do the job or withdraw

Yes Israel definitely was . They live under the threat of destruction by this regime ,and now we are allowing them to develop the means to fulfill their boast .

Times change rhetoric changes, Saddam tried it and failed, Hezbollah tried it and failed, Hamas tried it and failed. It is just possible the Iranians have weighed the price and decided as Gaddafi did that there is a lot to be gained by changing course

Oh yeah ,you and the utopian idiot running our country think they can be peacefully reigned in ,or that they will be a responsible hegemon once they dominate the region. Meanwhile their proxies wage war all over the region and have done so since 1979.

Let us get a few things properly aligned. You can't afford a war and you desperately want someone else to take on Daesh on the ground. Your focus must be on what the Russians are doing. Already the Chinese have realised this. If Iran have been fighting a proxy war since 1979 they have done it successfully, somewhat more successfully than the outcome of the wars you have fought. They survived your puppet Saddam and his war against them so you can't talk about proxy wars. Even your ally Pakistan has dealings with them and it they get the bomb that's where the information will come from if it hasn't already. You really should start working out who you can trust

It is time for you to move on, the only interest you have in the middle east is Israel, so station your troops on the Syrian border and stop the sabre rattling

[talaniman]

It is an executive agreement that can be terminated as early as January 2017 once a Republican President and Congress ends this folly .

You said that in 2008, and 2012, while the Prez just keeps BUMBLING along. Keep hollering though. Maybe you can get Russia, China, Europe and the UN to join you.

[excon]

Hello again, tom:

What's preventing you from just saying that you WANT to go to war with Iran??? Do you think we don't know?

excon

[tomder55]

How long do you think it takes to develop a bomb?

not long given the head start they already have ;and also will many fewer centrifuges than the agreement suggests . That's why I don't believe the agreement is serious . What happened to Sec State Lurch JF Kerry saying inspections will happen "anytime anywhere " . Now the IAEA will have to beg the Iranians to be permitted into a facility .

You are not rewarding their efforts

of course we are . They violated sanctions for years and nothing happened to them . Now we are lifting them on the promise to behave . Like I said ..the emperor is an idiot .

Times change rhetoric changes, Saddam tried it and failed, Hezbollah tried it and failed, Hamas tried it and failed. It is just possible the Iranians have weighed the price and decided as Gaddafi did that there is a lot to be gained by changing course

The Israeli's have twice had to bomb nuclear facilities in Iraq and Syria to prevent their enemies obtaining the bomb. Now I'm not so sure the emperor wouldn't order the US armed forces to shoot down Israeli jets trying to do the same in Iran. After all ;Iran is our new strategic ally in the region. You can't get any more betrayal than that .

You said that in 2008, and 2012, while the Prez just keeps BUMBLING along. Keep hollering though. Maybe you can get Russia, China, Europe and the UN to join you.

huh ? The agreement happened this week. I can guarantee that when Congress votes on this there will be significant cross over by Democrats who oppose this too. It won't lead to a veto proof rejection. But it will be a bipartisan majority rejection.

Hello again, tom:

What's preventing you from just saying that you WANT to go to war with Iran??? Do you think we don't know?

excon

I want regime change in Iran ..... peacefully if possible ;but regime change is the only possible way to avoid a much worse war .

[tomder55]

You said that in 2008, and 2012, while the Prez just keeps BUMBLING along. Keep hollering though. Maybe you can get Russia, China, Europe and the UN to join you.

[NeedKarma]

Maybe we should rename this thread the "IBN cartoon thread". All the conservatives will come here for the echo chamber effect.

Oh and Ezra Klein - How Stephen Hawking Proves That Investor's Business Daily's Editorial Page Tells Lies

[speechlesstx]

Hello tom:

This is simple... You ask, why he made the deal. I say, it's to avoid war.. Why are all the right wingers AGAINST the deal? I say it's cause they wanna BOMB Iran.

excon

Sorry, the word got out (which we already knew) was that he wanted it to cement his legacy. Which is going to suck when all hell breaks loose because of it.

P.S. In his speech on the deal he lied about having 24/7 access, which we don't have. Then his minions lied about never wanting 24/7 access, and Biden thinks Dems are going to love it when they can understand it. "We had to make the deal to know what was in the deal!'

Brilliant.

[excon]

Hello Steve:

Tom spilt the beans.. You want WAR.. Therefore, you'd be against ANY agreement that avoided it.

excon

[tomder55]

Actually what I said was "I want regime change in Iran ..... peacefully if possible ;but regime change is the only possible way to avoid a much worse war . "

I had hoped that eventually ;with external pressure applied ,the pendulum would swing in favor of regime change (like sanctions properly applied ,and supporting the Green Revolution). Now we are cementing the 12er's control on the nation ,and supporting the eventual nuclear capable empire,who's goal is exporting a revolution based on one of the most extremist Islamist ideologies...... to creating the chaos necessary for the 12th Imam the Madhi ;who fell in a well,to emerge and usher in Armageddon. A couple nukes will come in handy for that purpose .

[excon]

Hello again, tom:

Ok, lemme translate.. I dunno WHY you're scared of saying it...

Regime change will NOT happen through negotiation. You don't think it will either, so I don't know why you set that as a benchmark. In fact, if a Republican is elected president, he WON'T negotiate at all..

Therefore, if you're gonna get what you want, WAR is the ONLY way. Now, you can mince words, but you're NOT fooling anybody..

excon

[paraclete]

Tom you need to get some fresh ideas. You wanted regime change in Iraq, what you wound up with is far worse that what was there. Ditto for Libya. You wanted regime change in Afghanistan, for the moment you have your puppet installed. You wanted regime change in Syria, how's that going for you? You want regime change in Iran, meanwhile the world has moved on. The question is do the Iranian people want regime change? What you want is irrelevant. You should focus on what can be achieved and solve one problem at a time. For the moment the Iranian bomb has receded into the cupboard

[tomder55]

if you're gonna get what you want, WAR is the ONLY way.

Sorry you are wrong . Had we supported the Green Revoltution there would've been regime change and no war. Now I agree that regime change with a nuked up Iran is impossible without war . So this deal makes the likelyhood of war greater . Great job emperor !

Tom you need to get some fresh ideas. You wanted regime change in Iraq, what you wound up with is far worse that what was there. Ditto for Libya. You wanted regime change in Afghanistan, for the moment you have your puppet installed. You wanted regime change in Syria, how's that going for you? You want regime change in Iran, meanwhile the world has moved on. The question is do the Iranian people want regime change? What you want is irrelevant. You should focus on what can be achieved and solve one problem at a time. For the moment the Iranian bomb has receded into the cupboard

and you want "stability" by having tyrannous dictatorships . What you should understand by now is that that stability is temporary . You are just kicking the can down the road to the day when the sh*t hits the fan . Further ,the longer you delay ,the more powerful those regimes become and the price paid is greater .