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ebaines · Sep 4, 2014, 05:58 AM

The water main to our house is 3/4 inch, and based on the number of fixtures in the house it properly should by 1 inch or even larger. Our water pressure is fine - in fact we have a pressure reducer installed, though of course when two people are running showers at the same time there is a perceptible drop in pressure. About 20 years ago we built an addition that included roughed-in plumbing for a future bath over our garage. Now we are (finally) going through with completing that project, but the town is saying we now need a larger water main. To do this would require running about 100 feet of main and digging up the driveway, which is not something I really want to do. My question is this - given that we previously had a permit for the roughed-in plumbing, and back in those days the town didn't care about the size of the main, shouldn't this project be "grand fathered?" What are your experiences with respect to arguing for an exemption from current code requirements when completing an old roughed-in project like this?

hkstroud · Sep 4, 2014, 07:53 AM

Was the rough in plumbing done and inspected? Some municipalities have an expiration time on permits. If not completed in the specified time, the permit expires. Rough in plumbing is normally done and inspected before other aspects of the construction are completed. Maybe you don't need permit to finish work.

ebaines · Sep 4, 2014, 08:23 AM

Originally Posted by hkstroud

Was the rough in plumbing done and inspected? Some municipalities have an expiration time on permits. If not completed in the specified time, the permit expires. Rough in plumbing is normally done and inspected before other aspects of the construction are completed. Maybe you don't need permit to finish work.

Yes, the original rough-in was inspected, along with all other construction aspects of that original job (foundation, structural, electrical, plumbing, etc). We are now trying to get a new permit to finish the living space above the garage to include a bedroom and bathroom. One other complication: our plans for the bathroom changed from what we thought we would do 20 years ago, so the rough-in plumbing is being changed - basically moving everything about 20 feet.

hkstroud · Sep 4, 2014, 08:53 AM

Don't think you could argue that you are "grandfathered" in on old permit since it was closed out. You should be able to argue that your water demand has not changed, therefore upgrading supply should not be required.

What is present water pressure? Using two showers with 3/4 line and reasonable water pressure should not cause a perceptible drop in pressure or volume.
Who is saying main line must be upgraded?

talaniman · Sep 4, 2014, 09:15 AM

Basically this has become a brand new project. You probably could have finished the old project had you not made changes to what had already been permitted, and inspected. Hard to justify grandfathering with the scale of the changes you are making.

More often than not the financing mechanism of a project demands code compliance. Contractors are certainly bound by it, and I doubt you are doing this yourself. Illinois just got very strict a few years ago making all counties and cities upgrade and submit their building codes for state approval, so you probably just missed being grandfathered by a few years at least.

ebaines · Sep 4, 2014, 09:52 AM

Yes, I am using a contractor. He's trying to make the case with the town, but so far doesn't have a final ruling on it. It's a bit ironinc that our kids are grown and out of the house, so if anything our water needs are much less now than when we did the original rough-in.

massplumber2008 · Sep 4, 2014, 04:43 PM

Hi all!

Understanding that you already have VOLUME issues when multiple fixtures are used does strongly suggest that the upgrade really is needed here (as much as it stinks). Can you tell us if this new bath and room are going to be rented, by chance? If so, then the upgrade is definitely needed here! If not, then the only real argument I see is the fact that someday you will probably sell this home and the new owners will probably not be as happy to deal with the water volume issue as easily as you are, right?

Can you give us a basic breakdown on the number of fixtures in the home, including the new bathroom group, the washing machines, the outside faucets, etc. etc. etc. If you do this I'll crunch the numbers and tell you exactly what size pipe is required and why, OK?

Mark

ebaines · Sep 5, 2014, 05:38 AM

Thanks Mark. No. it won't be rented, but rather will be a guest room for the two or three times a year when the grand kids visit. Here's the list, including the new bath

Bathtub with shower: 2
Stand-alone shower: 3
Toilet: 7
Lav sink: 8
Kitchern sink:1
Washing machine: 1
Dishwasher: 1
Laundry room sink:1
Outdoor faucets: 3

We do not have a sprinkler system. Also, if it matters, the distance from water main entrance to the street valve is about 100 feet.