[pharm9]

Hey this is my first time here and I just wanted to ask for some advice that maybe I can show my friend. Bear with me since it's a long story.

I knew this girl that I'll call "D" back about 5 years ago and we dated for a couple of weeks but broke up because her Mom didn't want her dating. Anyway I ended up moving away to college and graduating from UCLA and I'm 1 month away from graduating pharmacy school.

I kept in touch off and on with D until she started getting involved with druggies and failing classes in high school. At this point she stopped contacting me and I left her alone. Anyway she went on to marry a guy, then they got a divorce because she cheated on him because she was too young to get married at 18. She had gotten kicked out of her foster mom's house, dropped out of high school, and didn't have a place to stay and I heard about this so I tried to get in touch with her since I knew I could help turn her life around and make her successful.

I got in touch with her a year ago, but she refused to move in with me which I guess I can understand since we didn't really know each other. But then she didn't contact me again until a few days ago. She had promised me a year ago that she was going to get her life straight, get her GED. Now she's 20 years old and doesn't have a GED, doesn't have a drivers license, doesn't have a job or anything.

I found out a couple of days ago that she's also 1-2 months pregnant with this guy's baby who she's living with. And this guy also has a 27 year old wife that's living with him. His wife just had a baby, so I think he slept with D because she was 6-7 months pregnant and he didn't want to sleep with her at the time. She had been involved in illegal drugs and homelessness and living on the streets over the last year, so his wife accepted her to live with them a month ago. She didn't know that D's baby's father is her husband until I talked to her. D says that the guy only stayed married for this long so his wife's child can have his last name. Yet the baby is a month old, and he still hadn't told his wife anything about his affair.

But it gets even worse. I was worried about D so I did a background check online on this guy. He was arrested and incarcerated for 1 yr 2 months in North Carolina for aggrevated (with force) sexual abuse on a child under 13 years old back when he was 20. This is a serious felony. He has 6 outstanding traffic citations in California (Where he lives now) that he hasn't paid on, including driving with a revoked license and no insurance. He has a DMV hold on his background meaning they won't give him a license now until he pays back the 2,000 or 3000 dollars in fines that he owes. He has changed his last name since he moved from North Carolina. He got arrested 6 months ago for failing to register as a sex offender in California and pled guilty which is another felony. I printed and took screenshots of this background report and asked one of her old friends to take her to her house and show her, which she hasn't been able to do yet.

And by living with him, she's putting her own future at risk. His wife (who also has 2 kids that don't live with her from another dad) had a clean criminal record until December of last year when she was with this guy. She was arrested for forgery and sentenced to 60 days jail and 3 years probation. It's only a matter of time until he drags D into a criminal life. So far, D has a clean record and hasn't been arrested for anything.

I have no idea if D knows about any of this. From what I understand, she might know about some things. But she tells her friends "its my life, I'll do what I want"

I could give her everything she ever dreamed of out of life, but for some reason she hates me and keeps telling me to get out of her life. She has no family because her birth mom was schizophrenic and she was taken away from her as a baby. And she has no known father. And if her foster mom knew what she was doing right now, she most likely would never contact her again either. She just recently got back in touch with her.

I think the best thing for her would be to ditch this loser, and get an abortion, and move in with her friend Stacy who is going to college and is a good influence. Listen, I'm against abortion. But in this case, if she has his baby, she's going to end up having him in her life for the next 18 years. This guy works at a gas station convience store. He'll never make enough money to support her baby (and his wife's baby) because he'll never be able to pass a background check and get a better job. And if she has his baby, he'll get arrested or he'll kick her out and the baby will eventually get taken away and put into a foster home and they'll grow up unhappy just like she did. And I really don't think adoption is a good idea because there are just so many other kids waiting to be adopted, and it's hard to find a loving family. Again, the child would just have a life of suffering and D would suffer always wondering what her child grew up into.

If you could leave her some advice, that would be really helpful. She's a caring person, she just had a very hard childhood and she's been living with losers ever since she divorced her husband so she probably doesn't even know what a nice life she could have. I got her in touch with one of her old friends from high school who is going to college, and she has even offered to let her move in with her, if she'll make the effort to get her life straightened out.

One of the huge problems right now is that she really wants a baby because she feels that nobody loves her and she wants someone to love her unconditionally. I've been trying to tell her that she CAN have a baby, once she finds a great man. And trust me, she can find an amazing man. She's SO beautiful. She doesn't have to have a baby right now, especially with this loser. And if she does have this guy's baby, the kid is going to grow up very resentful once he/she is old enough to know the history behind his parents relationship.

Please let me know what I should do and what you think she should do. I pretty much have done everything I could. But it would be nice if you leave advice for her because I know a website that I can contact her on and show her this. Thank you for your help

[Squiffy]

I think you should leave her alone. Yes she has screwed up her life, but really life isn't as simple as you are trying to make her believe it is. She probably doesn't like you because you are telling her tyo get an abortion, that isn't your decision to make. Leave her alone to make her own mistakes. You don't know for sure that this baby will end up with a rotten life, for a lot of mothers having a baby makes them reasess their lives and move on to better things. She shouldn't be having an affair with a married man, but she will learn from it in time. Stop interfering in her life, if she doesn't want your help, leave her alone. If she needs your help and wants your help let her know you are there for her, but don't push it.

[pharm9]

She had an abortion when she was in high school when she got pregnant by the man that she married. So I can't really say that she is very against abortions.

Why do you think she'll learn from her mistake this time when she hasn't learned from any of her previous mistakes? You want this ex-felon sex offender to be in her life forever? If she has his baby, it's going to happen that way.

[TheSavage]

Pharm as much as you seem to care about her -- there is not a thing you can do when she does not care about herself-- Savage

[Squiffy]

It doesn't matter what I want, or what you want, its what she wants that matters! If she wants him in her life forever then that is her choice, whatever he has done.

Just because she had an abortion as a schoolkid, it doesn't mean she would want to make that same mistake again, as you have said, SHE wants a baby, and she has helped to create one. A true friend is one who sticks by their friends no matter what, not one who feels the need to tell their friends what they should do with their lives, and do background checks on people they are involved with, It is just a step too far in my opinion.

Everyone learns a lesson in time. Whether it is from the first mistake or the fiftieth. Life is a journey and you don't always take the right turns the first time around, some people take detours.

[pharm9]

I have to explain about that, actually he has a myspace and posted a blog a few months ago regarding his wife's baby. I'll copy and paste it from his blog:

_____

"Had the baby shower sunday and it turned out ok from what I can tell but there is no telling what lies head for me and the baby now. just take it as it comes is what I'm being told by so many people. I don't know what's more scary, having a child or being in prison?"
_____

That's why I did a background check on him. Because I read that and got suspecious and worried for my friend. Who knows, maybe he had been lying to her and hadn't told her a thing about his criminal past. How would she ever find out the truth? I think she deserves to know. What if he was a murderer and she didn't even know. Although a child rapist isn't that far behind in terms of crimes.

[Squiffy]

I don't agree that it is a valid reason to do a background check, If she had wanted to know his past she could have asked you to, or found out herself. But she didn't, and she is getting annoyed with you, I would imagine because of this sort of thing.

[chuff]

First and totally off topic, but that was well written. It was a pleasure to read words separated into paragraphs. Made it much easier to read.

I honestly can't offer you an good advice because I think the reality is "D" is so insecure and so set in her ways that she isn't going to listen. You hit the nail on the head with the reason she wants the baby, so she will have someone who loves her unconditionally. But the reality is that's not a guarantee either. The only real suggestion I would offer you is to make a list of therapists or councelors that are available in your area for free or a small charge. Most local gov't offer services like this and should be available in your phone book. Give her that list and tell her your not going to bother her anymore but if she wants to contact you she can. Then I would leave it up to that. But you can't force someone to change and it sounds almost like your trying to hard to do that. You've got to give someone the freedom to make there own mistakes and learn from them instead of forcing them to change.

[talaniman]

While I admire your willingness to help, I think your way out of bounds. You can't save someone from themselves. Get out of her business other than suggest she go to social services and get help with bringing this child into the world and getting a place to stay. After that my friend she needs to get her own act together. Sorry and Good Luck.

[kp2171]

All that train wreck and you want to be the best thing that's ever happened to her?

Man. Some lessons you have to learn yourself I guess.

Your job IS NOT to save someone else. Its to find someone that is good enough to be with you... and if you think this train wreck is as good as you can get, you have some self esteem issues.

Really.

I don't care if she's great in every other way... she has some clear issues that SHE needs to solve. Not you.

You'd be better off backing away and trying to figure out why you are so willing to have low standards. And I'm not saying that to pi$$ you off. I have no vendetta against you.

I just think you need to demand more for yourself and from yourself. Practically stalking a girl this screwed up is a waste of energy.

[pharm9]

At this point, I don't want anything to do with her. I know I deserve better than her. I just hate to see her last chance she has to start over get away. And trust me, this is her last chance. Once she has his baby, he'll be in her life the next 18 years to screw it up.

The only thing I wanted is for her to talk to her friend that is willing to let her move in and fix up her life. But it looks like she won't even talk to her now. Anyway she wrote me back that she knows he's a child rapist and everything else about him and he's still the man of her dreams. It's just really sad. Like I said, she got taken away from her birth mother as a baby because her mom had such bad schizophrenia. And she never met her again. I'm starting to think this girl probably has that disorder as well. If you research it, it starts around age 20 in females and that's how old she is.

Here's just a piece of what she wrote :

I AM WHAT YOU CLAL A PERSON WHO WOULD BE AM MARTYR. I DO BELIEVE I AM NEVER REALLY GOING TO LIVE UNTIL I DIE. I LIVE TO DIE. LIKE SOME PEOPLE SAY... BUT I WILL GO ALONG WITH THE FOOLISHNESS OF THIS WORLD UP UNTIL THE POINT WHEN GOD TAKES ALL THAT AWAY. I HATE THIS WORLD THAT IS THE SECOND HELL. IT ISONLY FILLED WITH ISOLISM ANDMATIERAL THINGS. YOU CANNOT DECIEVE ME

[J_9]

I am sorry you are going through this. It is truly hard to see a friend wander down the path of destruction. However, there truly is nothing you can do. This girl will be going down this path until she decides otherwise. There is nothing anyone can do for her, but herself.

If her birth mother was schizophrenic it is very possible she is also. Schizophrenia is a debilitating disease that not only hurts the person with the diagnosis, but those surrounding them.

You seem to have a wonderful caring heart, and it is a shame to see it hurt this way. But, you really have no other option but to let her life as she sees fit. Save yourself from this destruction and just let her go. Use your big heart for those who will accept it for what it is, for those who are willing to help themselves.

[s2tp]

Pharm,

Well as much as I agree with the others that you are over your head on this one, I commend you and I can relatw with you for wanting to help this girl. She is obvious someone special to have a caring person such as yourself want to help her any way you can. But it all boils down to what she wants. She is obviously still immature and insure to add to it. I would think her issues from her mom make her feel unworthy, and it lowers her morals. Having a baby may or may not ruin her life. It sounds to me like this guy is a deadbeat dad... so if she ends up leaving him the end, he may just let her go... which of course is not a happy ending to have a fatherless child, but it will be better than him getting them both in jail... which of course may also happen if she does not wise up.

I think the only thing you can do it stop trying to convince her of what she should do, stop trying to change her mind or give her information- none of that is going to help in the state of mind she is in. You should just tell her you care about her, and if she ever needs anything to call you- and that you will be there- and then just do that. Be her friend, be someone she can turn to in case all of this crushes her. The more you try and 'help' her the more she is going to turn from you- its just the nature of things when girls are young and confused... expecially when a man and a baby are involved in the picture.

If anything- if she ends up having the child and unable to raise it, she can always adopt it out. I am a pro choice advocate for abortion, but only in the extreme cases- and not to just 'solve a problem'. She should seek other options before abortion- and adoption is a wonderful way to give the child a loving home.

With all that said- I have personal experience with not being able to reach someone when they were at their lowest. My own brother lived and died on the streets- but it was the lifestyle he chose. Everyone in our family tried to help him for 6 years... to no avail. He was killed almost 4 years ago by a car- while he was being chased by a guy after his drugs and money. His death was devastating, but also relieving to know he was finally at piece. He hated his life and struggled, but his willpower to change it just wasn't strong enough.

I tell you this cause sometimes you will wear yourself out trying to help someone to the point of giving up on them. Don't give up on your friend. Just forgive her, and be there for her, pray for her, and don't let her down like so many others have.

Thank you for sharing her story with us, I wish you and her the best!

[chuff]

I AM WHAT YOU CLAL A PERSON WHO WOULD BE AM MARTYR. I DO BELIEVE I AM NEVER REALLY GOING TO LIVE UNTIL I DIE. I LIVE TO DIE. LIKE SOME PEOPLE SAY... BUT I WILL GO ALONG WITH THE FOOLISHNESS OF THIS WORLD UP UNTIL THE POINT WHEN GOD TAKES ALL THAT AWAY. I HATE THIS WORLD THAT IS THE SECOND HELL. IT ISONLY FILLED WITH ISOLISM ANDMATIERAL THINGS. YOU CANNOT DECIEVE ME

That's really sad to read and as much as it's a cry for help she says herself that she is a martyr. Well if she feels that way and is even writing it down and sending it to you then it's a deep belief inside her. It's obvious that's what she believes and that's how she chooses to live her life.

She also says she hates the world and the reality is if you hate the world then your waking up already angry and defeated. Yeah she's had some horrible experiences in her life but so have until she starts liking some things, even if it's just looking at the stars or a deep breathe, something simple that she can hold onto and like she's living a defeated life. The only thing she likes now is hate. In a strange way, with hate she has a comfortable place and it brings her things she enjoys. It's brought her everything she's got which is more hate and pain. That's probably one reason she gets mad at you. Your caring and loving and that goes against what she likes.

I wish there was some magical way in real life like there is in the movies to make everything right and to make her wake up but sadly that's not how real life works.

[pharm9]

With all that said- I have personal experience with not being able to reach someone when they were at their lowest. My own brother lived and died on the streets- but it was the lifestyle he chose. Everyone in our family tried to help him for 6 years....to no avail. He was killed almost 4 years ago by a car- while he was being chased by a guy after his drugs and money. his death was devastating, but also relieving to know he was finally at piece. He hated his life and struggled, but his willpower to change it just wasnt strong enough.

I tell you this cause sometimes you will wear yourself out trying to help someone to the point of giving up on them. Dont give up on your friend. Just forgive her, and be there for her, pray for her, and dont let her down like so many others have.

Thank you for sharing her story with us, I wish you and her the best!

That's really sad about your brother. I guess you know exactly what I'm talking about then. Maybe even more so because I'm sure you loved your brother a lot more than I loved this girl since he was family.

I hear what you're saying about adoption, but the thing is, if she ever has to give up her baby (which I'm betting she will since she has no GED, no job and the Dad has a felony criminal background, is a registered sex offender, and has a revoked drivers license with 6unpaid traffic tickets), anyway if she has to give up her baby, it's going to crush her forever. Because she'll have to live with the feeling that she brought another life into this world to be raised without birth parents just like she was.

Anyway it looks like she'll probably just follow in the footsteps of your brother. She's not going to ask me for help. She even got mad and deleted her account where I could email her. I have her phone number but hell will freeze over before I ever call her again. There is still the 1 girl friend who she had in high school who offered to let her move in. But she doesn't take BS from anyone and she even said to accept her into her home, she'd have to get drug tested, and have rules and all this stuff. And I know this girl won't go for that. Plus, I don't think I could ever get involved in her life and give her help if she ends up keeping his baby because there is no way I would ever let someone like the dad into my life. He's already written threatening emails from her account, and called and left threatening voicemails on my cell from her cell saying how he has my license plate and how he's going to hurt me and all this BS. If I wanted to, I could take my cell to the police station and get him arrested. But I'm not going to go through the trouble because I know he's just making crap up. And its just not worth it.

[vlee]

It is admirable that you want to protect her so badly. You obviously care about her, but she doesn't care about herself. It would be great if we could all 'fix' things for other people, but we simply can't make them change or force them to see the huge mistakes we see. All you can do is talk to her, but bringing up the background check might not be well received news. If she listens to you, terrific. If not, let it go. As painful as it is to watch, you simply can't stop it from happening.

[clueless_guy_2007]

Do you really think that you can help someone who can't help themselves? Why would you cause yourself all the emotional stres trying to help this girl. She will most likely end up another burden on society and you are in school and making a success of yourself, you don't need things like this to drag you down. Ive been through this before too, one of my longtime friends got into drugs after his father died and he started selling drugs and breaking into houses, I helped him for a few weeks and he seemed to have changed but the minute I left him alone he was back to his old ways. So even when you think you are helping you are really just wasting your time.

[pharm9]

do you really think that you can help someone who can't help themselves? Why would you cause yourself all the emotional stres trying to help this girl. She will most likely end up another burden on society and you are in school and making a sucess of yourself, you dont need things like this to drag you down. Ive been through this before too, one of my longtime friends got into drugs after his father died and he started selling drugs and breaking into houses, i helped him for a few weeks and he seemed to have changed but the minute i left him alone he was back to his old ways. so even when you think you are helping you are really just wasting your time.

Yeah you're right. An update on what happened. Basically the father of her baby got drunk one day and started yelling at her and causing a huge scene and kicked her out. So then she went to live with her mother (who had kicked her out when she turned 18) She tells everyone she doesn't want anything to do with the dad so she's giving the baby up for adoption when she has it. But she's found this new guy who probably is just as much a loser. I guess because she was already talking to her friends about having sex with him after a week or 2 of knowing him without even using protection. And no, she's not doing anything to help her future at all. I think she moved in with this new guy. In fact she has smoked pot and re-started smoking cigs while she's pregnant too. So yeah, its just a waste of time and I'm not dealing with it anymore. Just thought I'd give an update since its been a couple of months.