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classyT · Mar 2, 2013, 11:13 AM

WG

Actually the word in the Greek ( I am sure you already know) is sozo. And it means saved in every way a person can be saved. But to be specific I would like to know how you think a person is saved from perishing in his sins after he dies.

Wondergirl · Mar 2, 2013, 11:17 AM

Originally Posted by classyT

But to be specific I would like to know how you think a person is saved from perishing in his sins after he dies.

I have no idea what that means.

classyT · Mar 2, 2013, 11:20 AM

WG,

Sure you do.

For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son that whosoever believes in Him should not PERISH BUT HAVE EVERYLASTING LIFE.

The verse lets us know that those that don't believe in him perish and do not have everlasting Life.

Wondergirl · Mar 2, 2013, 11:22 AM

Originally Posted by classyT

The verse lets us know that those that don't believe in him perish and do not have everlasting Life.

What does "perish" mean?

dwashbur · Mar 2, 2013, 11:24 AM

Originally Posted by ;

Actually the word in the Greek ( I am sure you already know) is sozo. And it means saved in every way a person can be saved.

Not so. That's a common teaching from teachers who know a smattering about the language, and it's wrong. It means "rescue." Sometimes it means rescue from peril, sometimes it means "rescue" in the sense of "salvation" of the soul, sometimes it means "rescue" in the sense of helping reconcile people having a feud. Like similar English words, it means different things in different contexts.

This is one of my pet peeves. Ultra-Evangelical "scholars" have been over-translating Greek for decades, and the language just won't hold all the water they want to pour into it. It's a practice that needs to stop because it's not doing anybody any good (except making money for the guys who write the books about it).

classyT · Mar 2, 2013, 11:27 AM

WG

Everlasting destruction. What do you think it means?

Dave,

Ok. Good to know. Thanks

Wondergirl · Mar 2, 2013, 11:34 AM

Originally Posted by classyT

WG

everlasting destruction. What do you think it means?

You really want to send everyone to your hell!

"Perish" can refer to quality of life here on earth.

Curtis Wilson · Mar 2, 2013, 11:39 AM

Originally Posted by Wondergirl

You really want to send everyone to your hell!

"Perish" can refer to quality of life here on earth.

There is one thing we can know for sure, if life is good, then to perish is very bad. I would not want to try it out myself.

Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

classyT · Mar 2, 2013, 11:45 AM

WG,

I don't want to send anyone to hell. Neither does the Lord, that is the reason he died. It is part of the gospel.. GOOD NEWS. We don't have to go there.

There have been plenty of good Christians who have lived a hard horrible life. A hell on earth. How can you explain that? There are plenty of ungodly people who live wonderful lives. It rains on the just and unjust here on earth.

Wondergirl · Mar 2, 2013, 11:58 AM

Originally Posted by classyT

There have been plenty of good Christians who have lived a hard horrible life. A hell on earth. How can you explain that? There are plenty of ungodly people who live wonderful lives. It rains on the just and unjust here on earth.

There are a lot of Christians who live lives in which they sin over and over again. "Lord, I believe. Help thou mine unbelief." And a lot of non-Christians who live loving, joyous lives that outdo many Christians.

classyT · Mar 2, 2013, 12:19 PM

WG

True. But it has got nothing to do with eternity.

Wondergirl · Mar 2, 2013, 12:20 PM

Originally Posted by classyT

WG

True. But it has got nothing to do with eternity.

Guess there won't be many people in heaven.

classyT · Mar 2, 2013, 12:49 PM

WG

I believe His grace is far bigger than we think it is and the gospel is so simple there will be more people in heaven than we can imagine. Having said that... being saved from an eternity in hell is what the bible preaches and there isn't any way around it.

He will take revenge on those who refuse to acknowledge God and on those who refuse to respond to the Good News about our Lord Jesus. 2 thess. 1:8

And in some versions of the bible it reads:
In flaming fire, inflicting vengeance on those who do not know God and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord

Wondergirl · Mar 2, 2013, 02:56 PM

Originally Posted by classyT

WG

I believe His grace is far bigger than we think it is and the gospel is so simple there will be more people in heaven than we can imagine.

Including Hindus and Muslims? And the mentally ill who have murdered?

Curtis Wilson · Mar 2, 2013, 03:05 PM

Originally Posted by Wondergirl

Including Hindus and Muslims? and the mentally ill who have murdered?

1Co 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
1Co 6:10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
1Co 6:11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

There will be no Hindus,Muslims, or any as such in God's Kingdom. Maybe there were some who were at one time, but not now.

Wondergirl · Mar 2, 2013, 03:08 PM

Originally Posted by Curtis Wilson

There will be no Hindus,Muslims, or any as such in God's Kingdom. Maybe there were some who were at one time, but not now.

So only born again Christians will be there.

dwashbur · Mar 2, 2013, 03:32 PM

Originally Posted by ;

1Co 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
1Co 6:10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
1Co 6:11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

There will be no Hindus,Muslims, or any as such in God's Kingdom. Maybe there were some who were at one time, but not now.

I have no idea how on earth you managed to read that into the passage you quoted, since the two have nothing to do with each other.

dwashbur · Mar 2, 2013, 03:34 PM

Originally Posted by ;

and in some versions of the bible it reads:
In flaming fire, inflicting vengeance on those who do not know God and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord

Of course, both Jesus and Peter also described it as outer darkness, a place of darkness, and Peter spoke of chains. So if this fire is literal, it apparently doesn't produce any light. Or perhaps (gasp!) it's all metaphorical, trying to describe the indescribable.

classyT · Mar 2, 2013, 03:39 PM

WG,

According to the bible the ONLY people who will be in heaven this side of the cross are those who have called on the name of the Lord Jesus Christ to save them. It doesn't matter if it is on death bed or in life... but they are the ONLY ones in heaven. These are not my thoughts but rather what the Lord says in his word.

classyT · Mar 2, 2013, 03:43 PM

Dave,

Or maybe it is a real place that has flaming fire which causes no light. I can't explain it but hen I can't explain a God in three persons.. I believe it by faith.