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    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #1

    Jan 25, 2013, 03:10 PM
    Obamacare 2.0
    A California insurance broker, who sells health plans to individuals and small businesses, told me that she’s prepping her clients for a sticker shock. Her local carriers are hinting to her that premiums may triple this fall, when the plans unveil how they’ll billet the full brunt of Obamacare’s new regulations and mandates.

    California is hardly alone. Around the country, insurers are fixing to raise rates by double digits. They’re privately briefing politicians in Washington on what’s in store. Those briefings are leaving a lot of folks up and down Pennsylvania Avenue jumpy.
    Health Insurance Brokers Prepare Clients For Obamacare Sticker Shock - Forbes

    To try and get a handle on rising costs, the Obama Administration will start to go after the healthcare providers. The President seemed to hint about all this when he referenced the need to “lower the cost” of healthcare in his inaugural address.
    Yeah it's the greedy provider's fault that they have to double rates to cover all the mandates in the plan.

    Yeah the Obots were slick making sure all the low hanging fruit ;all the carrots like allowing your kids to stay on your plan until they are 26 ;women getting "free "contraception. But now that the elections are over ,it's time to pay the piper.
    But then again... maybe that was the plan all along.. a variation of what Obama told us in 2008 about his energy plan .
    Obama: My Plan Makes Electricity Rates Skyrocket - YouTube
    The cry will go up for the government ‘to do something’ and nationalization will be complete.
    speechlesstx's Avatar
    speechlesstx Posts: 1,111, Reputation: 284
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    #2

    Jan 25, 2013, 03:34 PM
    Everyone is getting sticker shock in one form or another...

    Confused professors shocked schools are cutting their hours to avoid Obamacare penalties

    Marc Thiessen | January 23, 2013, 9:46 am

    Barack Obama is a former adjunct professor of constitutional law, and no group has been more solidly supportive of his liberal agenda than the professorial class. So it is a sweet irony that the latest group getting hammered by the mandates of Obamacare are … wait for it … adjunct professors.

    The Wall Street Journal reports:

    The federal health-care overhaul is prompting some colleges and universities to cut the hours of adjunct professors. [...] The Affordable Care Act requires large employers to offer a minimum level of health insurance to employees who work 30 hours a week or more starting in 2014, or face a penalty. The mandate is a particular challenge for colleges and universities, which increasingly rely on adjuncts to help keep costs down as states have scaled back funding for higher education.

    A handful of schools, including Community College of Allegheny County in Pennsylvania and Youngstown State University in Ohio, have curbed the number of classes that adjuncts can teach in the current spring semester to limit the schools’ exposure to the health-insurance requirement.
    The professors are understandably confused. Robert Balla, an adjunct professor of English at Stark State College, in North Canton, Ohio received a letter in which he was told that “in order to avoid penalties under the Affordable Care Act…employees with part-time or adjunct status will not be assigned more than an average of 29 hours per week.” He told the Journal that the move cut his $40,000 salary by about $2,000 and that he cannot afford health insurance.

    “I think it goes against the spirit of the [health-care] law,” Mr. Balla said. “In education, we’re working for the public good, we are public employees at a public institution; we should be the first ones to uphold the law, to set the example.


    A spokeswoman for Stark State explained the realities of the market. The new rules were necessary “to maintain the fiscal stability of the college. There are a lot of penalties involved if adjuncts go over their 29 hours-per-week average. The college can be fined and the fines are substantial.”

    Really? Substantial penalties? You don’t say.

    You can just imagine the outraged conversations in the faculty lounge now: “We’re professors. I thought stuff like this only happened to manual laborers at Wendy’s and Taco Bell!”

    Looks like the academy is finally getting a lesson in the costs of big government liberalism.
    It goes against the spirit of the law. Ba ha ha ha! Guess you should have known what was in it before promoting it.
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,327, Reputation: 10855
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    #3

    Jan 26, 2013, 07:32 AM
    I thought you guys have always been saying its okay for businesses to make profits? Be it colleges or insurance companies. Don't blame government ,because the ACA hasn't been implemented yet, blame the businesses for the way they prepare for it, and charge you now because they may not be able to later.
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #4

    Jan 26, 2013, 07:55 AM
    Don't blame government ,because the ACA hasn't been implemented yet
    The businesses are responding to what they know the mandates will cost. The costs are exploding because of government intervention in the market ;which was the plan all along.
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,327, Reputation: 10855
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    #5

    Jan 26, 2013, 08:42 AM
    Without government intervention, they would be raising costs regardless, and kicking people off when they need it. Of course they tell YOU they are incurring more costs, but what they don't tellyou is they set the costs in the first place.

    We aren't talking cost, the consumer always pays those, we are talking PROFITS that go to the boards, and CEO's.

    You're a capitalist and a free marketer, you already know this.
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    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #6

    Jan 26, 2013, 08:45 AM
    You want them to work for free ? I bet you do .
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,327, Reputation: 10855
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    #7

    Jan 26, 2013, 09:16 AM
    No not for free but not for unlimited profits though, unless I get paid an unlimited salary. The business model is broken, how many times do I have to say that and the cost to all of us is to damn high.

    By your posting here at least stop lying to us and calling capitalists, and for profit businesses "job creators" as that's not their true purpose, goal, or intention. Making money whether citizens do or not, is the whole basis of the free market.

    Is that why you accept layoffs slow downs, as normal cost of doing business?
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #8

    Jan 26, 2013, 09:22 AM
    unlimited profits
    The health-care sector is absurdly profitable. According to this data at Yahoo Finance, the sector-wide profit margin is 21.5 percent. But the insurance industry is one of its least-profitable parts: Its profit margin is at 4.54 percent. Hospitals are also a bit strapped, with an average margin of 3.5 percent.
    Ezra Klein - Health-insurance industry: Still not that profitable
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    speechlesstx Posts: 1,111, Reputation: 284
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    #9

    Jan 26, 2013, 09:30 AM
    Profits are only evil when they aren't being redirected to promote a liberal agenda.

    Barack Obama’s new ‘grass-roots’ group isn't quite
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,327, Reputation: 10855
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    #10

    Jan 26, 2013, 09:47 AM
    Under the law validated by the Supreme Court, its okay to have corporate donors for grassroots activity, you guys do it so will we. Sometimes you have to adjust your attitudes to reality.

    What wrong with that? You guys should try reality yourselves sometimes.
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    excon Posts: 21,482, Reputation: 2992
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    #11

    Jan 26, 2013, 10:10 AM
    Hello again,

    Her local carriers are hinting to her that premiums may triple this fall,
    Like your stance on immigration is going to elect Hillary Clinton, the insurance companies stance on rates is going to INSURE a government takeover.

    No, what you saw, WASN'T a government takeover... If it was, the insurance companies wouldn't be able to make WAR on us... But, they are, and it's going to be their death knell.

    Excon
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,327, Reputation: 10855
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    #12

    Jan 26, 2013, 10:17 AM
    Maybe insurance companies should squeeze big pharma, and not consumers.
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #13

    Jan 26, 2013, 10:23 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by talaniman View Post
    Maybe insurance companies should squeeze big pharma, and not consumers.
    And hospitals -- a new one near me built a large outdoor (Chicago! ) "healing garden" where patients can walk and find serenity. How many patients can and will do that during their stay? The patient rooms are private only and are huge, better than a fine hotel. Each room is between parallel hallways and has two doors, one for staff access (one hallway) and one for visitor access (the other hallway).
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,327, Reputation: 10855
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    #14

    Jan 26, 2013, 11:20 AM
    Effort To Curb Medicare Spending Begins With Crackdown On Hospital Readmissions - Kaiser Health News

    Dr. Krumholz said hospitals should think of readmissions as a challenge to overcome. "One day, we'll look back," he said, "and we'll be incredulous that one out of every five patients ended up back in the hospital."
    Crack down on corrupt medical billing soon: Government | TheMedGuru

    Government to crack down on 'hidden' waiting lists - Channel 4 News

    Thanks for guiding us to the facts WG.
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #15

    Jan 26, 2013, 11:35 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by talaniman View Post
    Thanks for guiding us to the facts WG.
    The planners of new hospitals around here seem to be knocking themselves out in an effort to spend money for amenities that have nothing to do with a patient's care and improvement.

    Oh, and this particular new hospital with the two-hallway system is now merging with another area hospital because they are losing money. "Under the agreement, Edward Hospital, which operates a 309-bed hospital in Naperville, and a stand-alone emergency room in Plainfield, will assume control of the financially strapped 259-bed Elmhurst Memorial, which lost $14.7 million in its 2011 fiscal year after struggling to pay for its $450 million new hospital building that opened in 2011."

    http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2...ial-healthcare
    smearcase's Avatar
    smearcase Posts: 2,392, Reputation: 316
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    #16

    Jan 26, 2013, 11:47 AM
    Any comments on George Will's latest take on where Obamacare is headed?
    George Will: Health care act’s death star? - Hannibal, MO - Hannibal Courier - Post - Hannibal, MO

    I have been a supporter of Obamacare because I know that something has to be done, and I mostly saw just the low hanging fruit, even though I don't really get any of the fruit in my circumstances.
    But it is getting hard to ignore the opinions of some of the experts. A brand new hospital in my hometown (100 miles from where I live now) is on the ropes. They are trying to work together with two other hospitals in the very general area (75 to 100 miles away) to try and survive.
    Not only did they have to pass it to know what was in it, it appears that they are still trying to figure out what is in it, at this late date.
    If George Will is correct, we may have seen nothing yet.
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,327, Reputation: 10855
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    #17

    Jan 26, 2013, 01:17 PM
    Wills argument is about costs not people who NEED health care, and NOT about people who don't have it because of the costs already. I think the implementation is key, and that's not until 2014.

    I think if insurance companies, doctors, hospital get together on those costs, and include good outcomes for consumers this obstacle can be overcome. For sure consumers don't set the costs, they can only pay.

    They sure don't want universal health care, like every other nation, then they can no longer control costs to YOU, from them. Mr.Will makes no reference to the concerns of people just the cost of doing business. He is saying leave business alone to do what they have been doing, because it works for them, and passes ever rising costs on to YOU!

    That's just MY opinion though.
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #18

    Jan 27, 2013, 03:34 AM
    Consolidation of services does not necessarily result in lower costs . What it definitely results in is fewer choices in available services ,and probably scarcity; which of course raises prices.
    I see nothing about a healing garden in WG's link. I assume it's the privates funded Lurie Children's Hospital . Although the garden appears to be a resume enhancer for the architect ,the criticism that it is not accessible to the patients is not accurate. Since Lurie relies on philanthropic funding ,why would it be a concern if they added a healing garden ? That doesn't cost the public a dime.
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,327, Reputation: 10855
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    #19

    Jan 27, 2013, 09:20 AM
    Untrue as consolidation means lower administration cost and duplication of services and costs. It also reduces delivery cost, whether that means manpower, or meeting demand.

    Demand is what sets prices. One thing we have seen nation wide is hospitals buying the services of individual medical practices as satellites and restructuring the cost of building maintenance, salaries and equipment, and charging patients a fee. Its these hidden fees that create extra revenue streams that crushes the consumer with rising costs.

    Cost shifting has been an accepted practice of the free market. Accepted by money makers but consumer, I don't think so.
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #20

    Jan 27, 2013, 09:46 AM
    Healing gardens, etc. at my hospital --

    "The hospital is working with the organization Planetree, which assists medical institutions to develop and implement patient-centered care in healing environments, a type of feng shui for healing, which may include displaying art or having waterfalls in the building.

    The hospital – which has several trickling waterfalls – also features 14 different outdoor gardens and has a one-mile outdoor walking path on the 50-acre campus."

    New hospital features gardens, shopping, fountains — Elmhurst news, photos and events — TribLocal.com

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