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    jonathan64's Avatar
    jonathan64 Posts: 29, Reputation: 1
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    #41

    Nov 28, 2012, 02:37 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by albear View Post
    Im just going to throw this out there.

    But if you believe that being a virgin, and being afraid of telling a woman to the point that its unnerving you and affecting how you would normally act, then you could pay for sex and then its not an obstacle for you when you meet women.
    Agree this could be a help on the way but I know that I would never be able to look at myself in the mirror if I ever paid for sex. I have thought about it many times but, no, that will not be an option.
    albear's Avatar
    albear Posts: 1,594, Reputation: 222
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    #42

    Nov 28, 2012, 02:42 PM
    "Agree this could be a help on the way but I know that I would never be able to look at myself in the mirror if I ever paid for sex. I have thought about it many times but, no, that will not be an option."

    That's fine, I feel the same way, just trying to help
    Enigma1999's Avatar
    Enigma1999 Posts: 2,223, Reputation: 1077
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    #43

    Nov 28, 2012, 02:57 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Wondergirl View Post
    Back in the '50s and '60s, most unmarrieds were virgins. Only in today's world with media and Hollywood influences has that changed.

    People have all sorts of reasons for being virgins. Religion is only one of them. I was simply pointing out to him that there are probably more virgins in this world than he can ever imagine. There is nothing wrong with being a virgin. And I still don't think he should be making a huge effort to not be one. Finding a woman who will love him with her whole heart --and he doing the same for her -- is his first order of business.

    Yes, however, many people were married at a young age, so you still don't know if unmarried people in their late 30's were virgins.

    Again, I don't want to mislead John.

    The only reason I am harping on this issue is because of his original question. So if there is any other advice we can offer you, John, then please let us know.
    jonathan64's Avatar
    jonathan64 Posts: 29, Reputation: 1
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    #44

    Nov 28, 2012, 03:14 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Enigma1999 View Post
    Yes, however, many people were married at a young age, so you still don't know if unmarried people in their late 30's were virgins.

    Again, I don't want to mislead John.

    The only reason I am harping on this issue is because of his original question. So if there is any other advice we can offer you, John, then please let us know.
    Thanks Enigma1999. I appreciate any advice based on women's view today. I have received some good thoughts but welcome any additional thoughts or suggestions. One question I have is whether anyone ever heard of a case where a very introvert person managed to be extrovert? Or how a person my age with very low self-esteem (at least with respect to women) came out with good confidence?

    Again any response is much appreciated but I want everyone to be honest. If you think most of the hope is gone by now then be honest about it. If you think there is still hope, please let me know your advice. I don't know if I sound pathetic but this is really awkward for me.
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #45

    Nov 28, 2012, 03:17 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by jonathan64 View Post
    One question I have is whether anyone ever heard of a case where a very introvert person managed to be extrovert? Or how a person my age with very low self-esteem (at least with respect to women) came out with good confidence?
    Well, I've had male clients who felt they were social misfits and losers, so we did role playing and some cognitive-behavioral stuff, all of which boosted their confidence. Have you considered counseling or finding a coach for something like this? It's a brief therapy thing, very targeted.
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    smoothy Posts: 25,492, Reputation: 2853
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    #46

    Nov 28, 2012, 03:38 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Wondergirl View Post
    And miss out on that wondrous feeling of adventure and mystery?????
    I think the odds of finding a learning disabled female to be far greater than an exceptional student. Based on previous personal experiences.

    I picked a good wife... what more can I say.
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    slapshot_oi Posts: 1,537, Reputation: 589
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    #47

    Nov 28, 2012, 04:20 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by jonathan64
    One question I have is whether anyone ever heard of a case where a very introvert person managed to be extrovert?
    I am. I'm a natural introvert, but I go through phases which I force myself to be extroverted so I can meet new folks. The last time I forced myself into extroversion I created and account on OKCupid (it's a free dating website that is profoundly better than any paid dating website out there) and went on a few dates. The last girl I took out on a date became (and still is) my steady girlfriend.

    Speaking of which, create an OKCupid profile if you haven't already. There is a huge representation of Boston folks on there.

    In addition, I strongly recommend you read this classic: How to Win Friends and Influence People.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wondergirl
    Back in the '50s and '60s, most unmarrieds were virgins. Only in today's world with media and Hollywood influences has that changed.
    I beg to differ. Those were the years of the beat and hippie generations, both of which advocated hedonistic behavior. Promiscuity is as old as the earth. Blaming today's media is yet another version of the ol' "these darn kids today" spiel. Your generation is just as lustful as mine is.
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    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #48

    Nov 28, 2012, 05:45 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by slapshot_oi View Post
    I beg to differ. Those were the years of the beat and hippie generations, both of which advocated hedonistic behavior. Promiscuity is as old as the earth. Blaming today's media is yet another version of the ol' "these darn kids today" spiel. Your generation is just as lustful as mine is.
    Differ all you want. I was there. Sex did not start becoming a recreational sport until the 1970s.
    Enigma1999's Avatar
    Enigma1999 Posts: 2,223, Reputation: 1077
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    #49

    Nov 28, 2012, 07:54 PM
    "Differ all you want. I was there. Sex did not start becoming a recreational sport until the 1970s"

    Just because YOU were there, doesn't make it so.

    This is not the world according to Wondergirl.

    You are completely false on this.

    Slapshot, if I could give you 1000 greenies, I would.
    Alty's Avatar
    Alty Posts: 28,317, Reputation: 5972
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    #50

    Nov 28, 2012, 11:15 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Wondergirl View Post
    Differ all you want. I was there. Sex did not start becoming a recreational sport until the 1970s.
    WG. My parents were both born in the late 1930's, and both of them, and all their siblings, had sex before marriage. My dad came from a very strict Catholic family.

    My mom's oldest sister was a flower girl at their parents wedding.

    Only two Uncles on my fathers side, and 1 Uncle on my moms side and 2 Aunts (dad came from a family of 6, mom from a family of 11) married because they chose to. The rest were shot gun weddings.

    You may have been there, but you're basing your posts on how you lived your life. Not on how the rest of the world lived theirs.
    jonathan64's Avatar
    jonathan64 Posts: 29, Reputation: 1
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    #51

    Nov 29, 2012, 04:39 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by Wondergirl View Post
    Well, I've had male clients who felt they were social misfits and losers, so we did role playing and some cognitive-behavioral stuff, all of which boosted their confidence. Have you considered counseling or finding a coach for something like this? It's a brief therapy thing, very targeted.
    I have started too look for options for therapy, but if there are coaches that would appopriate for my situation that definitively sounds like a good option. Any idea what is available in the Boston area?

    Quote Originally Posted by slapshot_oi View Post
    I am. I'm a natural introvert, but I go through phases which I force myself to be extroverted so I can meet new folks. The last time I forced myself into extroversion I created and account on OKCupid (it's a free dating website that is profoundly better than any paid dating website out there) and went on a few dates. The last girl I took out on a date became (and still is) my steady girlfriend.

    Speaking of which, create an OKCupid profile if you haven't already. There is a huge representation of Boston folks on there.

    In addition, I strongly recommend you read this classic: How to Win Friends and Influence People.
    Thanks, I will check it up.
    Enigma1999's Avatar
    Enigma1999 Posts: 2,223, Reputation: 1077
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    #52

    Nov 29, 2012, 08:36 AM
    Do you happen to have any lady friends?

    I am more of an introvert that I am extrovert. However, there are times that I force myself to put myself out there and meet new people. I used to have confidence issues when I was younger, but I really don't any more. Partly because I don't care what people think. I am who I am. I have conditioned myself to think like that.

    There is hope for you. What are some things that you want to change other than your confidence and selfesteem?
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #53

    Nov 29, 2012, 09:22 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by jonathan64 View Post
    I have started too look for options for therapy, but if there are coaches that would appopriate for my situation that definitively sounds like a good option. Any idea what is available in the Boston area?
    Maybe call a few of these guys to get a feel for them by phone --

    Life Coaches in Boston MA | Noomii.com the Life Coach Directory

    Or just Google "life coach Boston Mass" or similar keywords but without quote marks. I got a number of hits when I did this. Often a telephone interview will tell you what you need to know -- plus just your feeling of ease with the office or coach, whoever answers. I had a life coach for three months back in the early '90s -- $200 a month with a phone conversation (or in-person, if preferred) once a week plus homework assignments. Diane got me unstuck and helped me realize a dream I had sat on for several years. It's quick therapy and very focused.

    Also, call the reference desk at your public library and they will give you a list of professional life coaches.in your area (probably by Googling).
    sweetness_91's Avatar
    sweetness_91 Posts: 2, Reputation: 4
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    #54

    Nov 29, 2012, 01:18 PM
    I think it's sexy when a guy is a virgin. I would have you all to myself. I wouldn't have run out if you told me you were still a virgin, however seeing how it turned out so far, you probably shouldn't mention it next time. If you find someone special and everything works out with them, you can tell them later.
    If you are not sure of yourself, just ask what she likes in bed, she won't know that you are asking from lack of experience, she'll think you just want to please her.

    Oh and by the way, I am a 21 year old female, so that you know how someone in there 20s feels about your situation. Get out there and be charming! ;)
    hheath541's Avatar
    hheath541 Posts: 2,762, Reputation: 584
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    #55

    Nov 29, 2012, 04:41 PM
    I may not be the best person to offer my opinion on male sexuality, but you did want a female perspective, which I can give.

    Not all women will be put off by a man being a virgin. You're main problem will probably be finding someone wanting/willing to date someone in their late 30's AND a virgin. Now that I've confused you, I'll try to explain.

    Most women looking to date someone your age are probably around your age. By that age, they are probably looking to either have kids, or already do. Either way, they probably want someone with a history of stable relationships. A lack of relationship history is like a lack of job history, it makes prospective matches wonder what's up, and doubt your ability to perform well (meaning, having the skills needed to have a healthy relationship or stable job). That DOESN'T mean you couldn't, just that the lack of evidence leaves doubt.

    Conversely, someone looking/willing to date a virgin is probably younger, and looking at people around their age. While there are women in their 20's looking for an older man, the draw is usually the added experience.

    Now, I'm sure there exist women in either category who wouldn't mind dating a 38 year old virgin. The trick is finding one you're compatible with.

    My first, and main, piece of advise is to quit looking. As counterproductive as that sounds, hear me out.

    You're worried about a lack of confidence, so the dating scene is probably NOT the place for you. You're better off focusing on something you ARE confident in.

    Join groups, either local or online, for things that interest you. Once there, talk to people. Make friends. Make female friends. Women you can talk to about common interests without worrying about trying to impress her or convince her to date you. If you're lucky, a friendship will become more. If not, then women LOVE setting their single girl friends up with their single guy friends.

    Don't shy away from making guy friends, either. Chances are, they'll have girlfriends/wives with single girl friends.

    Now, I'm sure you've heard ALL about the dreaded 'friend zone.' It's BS. Most women want the person they're with to also be a friend, that means TONS of relationships evolve from friendships. Even if they don't, once again, women like to play matchmaker. If all you end up with is a good friend, then you're already a step ahead. Women like to know their friends approve of their relationships, so having a friend SUGGEST they date you is already severla brownie points. You'll also get brownie points because she'll know you won't mind hanging out with her friends, since you'll already have at least one mutual friend.

    Oh, and unless asked, don't mention your lack of experience until it becomes actively relevant. Let an emotional connection form, first. If a woman invites you to spend the night in the first few months, smile, politely decline (tell her you're old fashioned and want to wait a bit), escort her to her door, and kiss her goodnight. Being a gentleman will make a better impression, and have a better chance of creating a lasting relationship.

    Honestly, someone willing to jump into bed on the third date is probably NOT looking for something longterm. Casual sex is fine, if that's what you want. If it is, then you can probably find women on craiglist or dating sites happy to teach you any number of things. Just make sure that both of you are on the same page. Having casual sex with someone wanting a relationship, or vice versus, will only end badly.
    Alty's Avatar
    Alty Posts: 28,317, Reputation: 5972
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    #56

    Nov 29, 2012, 04:46 PM
    Heath, all I can say is bravo! Best advice yet! I wish I could greenie you more than once. :)
    jonathan64's Avatar
    jonathan64 Posts: 29, Reputation: 1
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    #57

    Nov 30, 2012, 07:15 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by sweetness_91 View Post
    I think it's sexy when a guy is a virgin. I would have you all to myself. I wouldn't have run out if you told me you were still a virgin, however seeing how it turned out so far, you probably shouldn't mention it next time. If you find someone special and everything works out with them, you can tell them later.
    If you are not sure of yourself, just ask what she likes in bed, she wont know that you are asking from lack of experience, she'll think you just want to please her.

    Oh and by the way, I am a 21 year old female, so that you know how someone in there 20s feels about your situation. Get out there and be charming! ;)
    Thanks! Glad to read this!

    Quote Originally Posted by hheath541 View Post
    I may not be the best person to offer my opinion on male sexuality, but you did want a female perspective, which I can give.

    Not all women will be put off by a man being a virgin. You're main problem will probably be finding someone wanting/willing to date someone in their late 30's AND a virgin. Now that I've confused you, I'll try to explain.

    Most women looking to date someone your age are probably around your age. By that age, they are probably looking to either have kids, or already do. Either way, they probably want someone with a history of stable relationships. A lack of relationship history is like a lack of job history, it makes prospective matches wonder what's up, and doubt your ability to perform well (meaning, having the skills needed to have a healthy relationship or stable job). That DOESN'T mean you couldn't, just that the lack of evidence leaves doubt.

    Conversely, someone looking/willing to date a virgin is probably younger, and looking at people around their age. While there are women in their 20's looking for an older man, the draw is usually the added experience.

    Now, I'm sure there exist women in either catagory who wouldn't mind dating a 38 year old virgin. The trick is finding one you're compatible with.

    My first, and main, piece of advise is to quit looking. As counterproductive as that sounds, hear me out.

    You're worried about a lack of confidence, so the dating scene is probably NOT the place for you. You're better off focusing on something you ARE confident in.

    Join groups, either local or online, for things that interest you. Once there, talk to people. Make friends. Make female friends. Women you can talk to about common interests without worrying about trying to impress her or convince her to date you. If you're lucky, a friendship will become more. If not, then women LOVE setting their single girl friends up with their single guy friends.

    Don't shy away from making guy friends, either. Chances are, they'll have girlfriends/wives with single girl friends.

    Now, I'm sure you've heard ALL about the dreaded 'friend zone.' It's BS. Most women want the person they're with to also be a friend, that means TONS of relationships evolve from friendships. Even if they don't, once again, women like to play matchmaker. If all you end up with is a good friend, then you're already a step ahead. Women like to know their friends approve of their relationships, so having a friend SUGGEST they date you is already severla brownie points. You'll also get brownie points because she'll know you won't mind hanging out with her friends, since you'll already have at least one mutual friend.

    Oh, and unless asked, don't mention your lack of experience until it becomes actively relevent. Let an emotional connection form, first. If a woman invites you to spend the night in the first few months, smile, politely decline (tell her you're old fashioned and want to wait a bit), escort her to her door, and kiss her goodnight. Being a gentleman will make a better impression, and have a better chance of creating a lasting relationship.

    Honestly, someone willing to jump into bed on the third date is probably NOT looking for something longterm. Casual sex is fine, if that's what you want. If it is, then you can probably find women on craiglist or dating sites happy to teach you any number of things. Just make sure that both of you are on the same page. Having casual sex with someone wanting a relationship, or vice versus, will only end badly.
    Thanks for sharing these thoughts. Actually I find advice from women more helpful as part of what I need to learn and understand is how women feels, thinks, loves etc. I found thiis very helpful although it made me feel puzzled at the same time. But I think I do understand what you are saying and it does make sense when I think about it.

    I think I have a way forward. I will start looking for some kind of therapy and/or coaching. I need to join som activities to meet more people. Hopefully I will have more success with dating if therapy works. Although it primary is a real relationship I want, casusal sex could also be very helpful since this would both give me opportunity to 'practice' so to say, as well as boosting my ego. To find a woman in my age (which is really what I would like) may be challenging due to the reasons you described so well, but at least I think I know better how to move forward.
    hheath541's Avatar
    hheath541 Posts: 2,762, Reputation: 584
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    #58

    Nov 30, 2012, 04:12 PM
    Sorry about that. As a few people here can tell you, the confusion has more to do with me being me, than me being a woman. I'm glad you were able make sense of it, though. That's something I'm not always sure of.

    Don't stress yourself out trying to understand women. It won't happen. Women don't always understand women. We're a complicated species, that often contradicts itself.

    Good luck. You've already done more than many are willing to do by deciding work toward improving things. You're willing to accept and implement advise, instead of expecting an instant fix, which will work in your favor (in finding AND keeping a relationship).
    mypointofview's Avatar
    mypointofview Posts: 7, Reputation: 4
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    #59

    Dec 7, 2012, 12:44 PM
    Jonathan,

    You are so focused on being a virgin at 38 and not focused on the bigger picture, ROMANCE. A woman loves romance.

    The first thing is making sure you focus on cultivating your mind, nurture your body, meditate, bring peace to your innerself. The climax with that special someone will come.

    I dated a virgin and he did not broadcast it but his actions told the story. He just laid on top of me and I flipped over this 6'2" man and gave him a beautiful hot oil rub down, kissed him ever softly, told him how I enjoyed giving him a rub down. However, his hygiene was intact, he had clean fingernails, no smelly feet, behind his ears were not stinking of old sweat, his breath was fresh and clearly romance was in the air. I could tell he was embarrassed but I went out of my way to make him feel like superman.

    Months before our intimate evening, we went to Shakespeare plays, attended late night movies and dinners, went to house parties and jazz dinner clubs, we did so many wonderful things together. He would sing to me and made a fuss and I loved it.

    I remember showing up at his hotel early morning with coffee, tea and me in a trench coat and all we did was cuddle. It was beautiful.

    When we made the step to making love, we worked at the same location and would have afternoon delights in the bathrooms, my oh my what was I thinking. We would have trysts at a local hotel during lunch, it was beautiful. However, his heart belong to another and we both went our separate ways. Good memories:)

    Take your time in cultivating yourself, read current events, travel even if its to the next town, attend events you normally would not go to but the event sounds interesting enough for you to attend, join a group of business men and network because these organizations have balls, dances, and they have conventions. Attend wine tasting events and culinary arts events. Single cruise excursions are also good. Get involve in your community. Women do attend these venues. Cultivate the mind Jonathan, cultivating the mind broadens your conversation.

    Soon you will be the George Clooney of your neighborhood. Stay focus on yourself and nothing more and everything else will fall into place.

    Keep us posted.
    jonathan64's Avatar
    jonathan64 Posts: 29, Reputation: 1
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    #60

    Feb 17, 2013, 10:38 AM
    I've been on therapy a while and I thing this have helped me be somewhat more secure on myself and have helped me conversing with foreign people, particularly women. However, I have still not managed to get a date yet.

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